Using the same CODEC and bit rate what would look best on a typical lounge TV under 50 inches? - HotUKDeals
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Using the same CODEC and bit rate what would look best on a typical lounge TV under 50 inches?

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Using the same CODEC and bit rate what would look better on a typical lounge TV under 50 inches? 1. 1080P 2. 4K I ask because media that isn’t distributed via optical discs tends to be more b… Read More
Agharta Avatar
2y, 3m agoPosted 2 years, 3 months ago
Using the same CODEC and bit rate what would look better on a typical lounge TV under 50 inches?

1. 1080P
2. 4K

I ask because media that isn’t distributed via optical discs tends to be more bit rate limited due to the delivery constraints of OTA broadcasting and Internet TV mainly due to pricing pressure.
Agharta Avatar
2y, 3m agoPosted 2 years, 3 months ago
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#1
I ask because I’ve seen so much HD content that looks very unimpressive due to low bit rate compared to say Blu-ray which has a higher bit rate.
So is it better to have high quality 1080P than a low to medium quality 4K?

One reason for asking is that I’m sure much 4K footage that is seen as a demo in-store is not typical so gives people unrealistic expectations.
My experience of HD with Netflix and BT Sport is very underwhelming and this via a 50Mb Virgin Media connection. So far Amazon Prime HD video looks better but early days on my trial.
#2
Agharta
I ask because I’ve seen so much HD content that looks very unimpressive due to low bit rate compared to say Blu-ray which has a higher bit rate.
So is it better to have high quality 1080P than a low to medium quality 4K?

One reason for asking is that I’m sure much 4K footage that is seen as a demo in-store is not typical so gives people unrealistic expectations.
My experience of HD with Netflix and BT Sport is very underwhelming and this via a 50Mb Virgin Media connection. So far Amazon Prime HD video looks better but early days on my trial.

HEVC is out now so it should look pretty good but streaming media from online compared to Bluray will never look as good. Give it a few more years and the technology will catch up. Wasn't that long ago that 5mbit was classed as a fast connection.

Edited By: kester76 on Jan 04, 2015 19:58
#3
So are you asking if a 4GB file had exactly the same bit rate and codes, what would look better, high bit rate 1080p or lower bit rate 4K? I usually find that a 2-3Gb movie at 1080p looks just as good as a 4GB 720p movie on my 1080p screen etc. So I would stick with the native resolution.

How's are you getting 4K material anyway?
#4
Let me rephrase this:

Say a £5-600 1080P TV with HD media (720P/1080i/1080P) versus a similarly priced and sized 4K TV with the same media or 4K media with the same bit rate.

I imagine the 4K panels are more expensive but do they look as good especially with non 4K material as a similarly priced 1080P TV?
Also at the same bit rate do the constraints of broadcast TV (OTA or Internet) mean that the low bit rates equates to 4k being compromised versus HD material?
In other words there’s a lot more to picture quality than just resolution.
#5
kester76
HEVC is out now so it should look pretty good but streaming media from online compared to Bluray will never look as good. Give it a few more years and the technology will catch up. Wasn't that long ago that 5mbit was classed as a fast connection.
I think you have missed the point as all those improvements help HD as well as 4K so they don't address the question I'm asking.
#6
1080p on bluray is compressed and not raw video, same with 4K. Bitrate, compression method and video format will effect image quality. It will all depend on how the extra information is stored for 4k and what is recorded.
4K video has better colour than 1080 but it depends on what you're watching.
4K is better or why broadcast it when you could upscale 1080p. at worse it would look like upscaled 1080p.
#7
kester76
1080p on bluray is compressed and not raw video, same with 4K. Bitrate, compression method and video format will effect image quality. It will all depend on how the extra information is stored for 4k and what is recorded.
4K video has better colour than 1080 but it depends on what you're watching.
4K is better or why broadcast it when you could upscale 1080p. at worse it would look like upscaled 1080p.
Stop there as you are clearly missing the whole point of my question.
#8
Agharta
kester76
1080p on bluray is compressed and not raw video, same with 4K. Bitrate, compression method and video format will effect image quality. It will all depend on how the extra information is stored for 4k and what is recorded.
4K video has better colour than 1080 but it depends on what you're watching.
4K is better or why broadcast it when you could upscale 1080p. at worse it would look like upscaled 1080p.
Stop there as you are clearly missing the whole point of my question.

There is no real answer without real values. You need to give a codec, a maximum bitrate and the type of video. Fast motion video is different to slow motion video. When you lower the bitrate of a video you reduce the amount of detail. Also it will depend on how good the video processor is on the TV.

In nutshell if something is broadcast in 4K then it will look better than 1080p or it wouldn't be broadcast in 4K. Also Sky/BBC don't broadcast in 1080p as it's 1080i up scaled to 1080p.

HEVC is the new standard and all HD content will be moved over to that. Also 50" is tiny for 4K as you would need to sit on top of it to see the extra detail.
#9
To answer this question correctly, quite evidently, the bitrate for a single frame of 4K video will be higher than the bitrate for a single frame of 1080P video, in order to make an equitable comparison of video quality. So it stands to reason that using the same bitrate and decoding with the same decoder, the 4K video appears worse (subject to bitrates not exceeding a certain threshold). It is that simple.

Edited By: ElliottC on Jan 06, 2015 13:12: .
#10
ElliottC
To answer this question correctly, quite evidently, the bitrate for a single frame of 4K video will be higher than the bitrate for a single frame of 1080P video, in order to make an equitable comparison of video quality. So it stands to reason that using the same bitrate and decoding with the same decoder, the 4K video appears worse (subject to bitrates not exceeding a certain threshold). It is that simple.
Yep 15mbps+ 4k wins, below 12mbps 1080p starts to look better but still a pointless question if you're sitting 8 foot away from a 50" tv :D

Check out http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/4k-streaming-201404063713.htm
#11
kester76
ElliottC
To answer this question correctly, quite evidently, the bitrate for a single frame of 4K video will be higher than the bitrate for a single frame of 1080P video, in order to make an equitable comparison of video quality. So it stands to reason that using the same bitrate and decoding with the same decoder, the 4K video appears worse (subject to bitrates not exceeding a certain threshold). It is that simple.
Yep 15mbps+ 4k wins, below 12mbps 1080p starts to look better but still a pointless question if you're sitting 8 foot away from a 50" tv :D

Check out http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/4k-streaming-201404063713.htm

I am not sure where it has been mentioned here that one requirement is for the viewer to be located 8 feet away from the source and also the requirement that the TV is 50 inch. Hence, the question is of relevance, especially since you even provided a link which even attempts to provide further insight - if the question is "pointless", then the corollary is that the link you provided would be pointless too.

While still referring to the link you provided, I assume you have read it since post #2 makes a reference to "but streaming media from online compared to Bluray will never look as good" and post #6 mentions "4K is better or why broadcast it when you could upscale 1080p. at worse it would look like upscaled 1080p". There is a lot of contradiction between those comments and the article provided within the link you have provided.

The answer is simple and rather than making conjectures, it is as simple as I had mentioned earlier. A 4K encoded frames usually contains more pixels than a 1080P encoded frame (equal at best), for the same video frame. More pixels (even after compression using the same CODEC) means a higher bitrate and it is extremely simple to deduce that the same quality, given the same CODEC means a higher bitrate is required for a 4K video. Nothing to do with sitting8 feet away from a 50 inch screen TV or online streaming is of lesser quality than Blu Ray.

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