Apple Macbook Pro 15" 2.4GHz (MC371B/A) £1292.48 inc VAT @ Costco - HotUKDeals
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RRP is £1499, Amazon seems to be cheapest at £1,352. Don't forget Costco PCs come with a 2 year warranty.

Trusted Review - http://www.trustedreviews.com/laptops/review/2010/04/29/Apple-MacBook-Pro-15-inch--MC371B-A---April-2010-/p1

Blurb from John Lewis -

A fully-featured laptop inside a single inch of sturdy aluminium, the MacBook Pro is designed for maximum performance in minimum size. Your high definition videos, photos and games will look even more brilliant on the sharp 15.4 inch high resolution display.

The MacBook Pro also features an advanced trackpad with wonderfully intuitive Multi-Touch technology. You can flip through photos, enlarge text and adjust an image using just your fingers. Your hands have room to spread out on the full-size keyboard with crisp, responsive keys. And it’s illuminated so you can see what you’re typing in low-light settings. Navigation is simple and intuitive thanks to the new multi-touch trackpad, which doubles as a button.

The MacBook Pro features a speedy 2.4GHz Intel Core i5 processor, 4GB of memory and a built-in iSight camera for video chatting on the go. Store your digital photos, music and video on the 320GB hard drive and enjoy them at the touch of a button with the Front Row interface. Connect wirelessly to Bluetooth enabled peripherals and go online while you’re out and about with AirPort Extreme 802.11n Wi-Fi.
Software included:
iLife ’09 (includes iTunes, iPhoto, iMovie, iDVD, iWeb, GarageBand))
Mac OS X v10.6 Snow Leopard (includes Time Machine, Quick Look, Spaces, Spotlight, Dashboard, Mail, iChat, Safari, Address Book, QuickTime, iCal, DVD Player, Photo Booth, Front Row, Xcode Developer Tools)
More From costco:

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#1
Voted hot, although for the money I'd go for an iMac this is a good price for what you get. Still much inflated on windows prices but if you like macs this is a "hot deal" in my opinion.
#2
looks like people are voting cold just because its a mac and not on if its a good price or not.

we all know macs are overpriced and there not for me but if someone wants one maybe this is a good price :)
#3
Voted hot :) Macs are expensive, but in my experience the 'quality' of the products, and the exceptional aftersales service is second to none. I've worked in IT as an account manager, and 6 years as customer service team leader, and I can confirm that no other manufacturer can touch the service Apple provide. Every Mac I dealt with was turned around within 3 working days. Average with every other manufacturer was 2-3 weeks. You get what you pay for, and that includes service.
#4
Good deal.
#5
To the people voting negative:

How on earth can the cheapest current price, for a desirable product, be a cold deal?

If you find mac too expensive or you don't consider them value-for-money, please don't vote...somebody might miss out on a saving, due to you voting negative and missing the deal because its ice cold.

Its an infantile way to behave. If you consider something to be grotesquly overpriced, no deal is going to change your opinion.

Remember: A negative vote on an Apple deal is NOT a pin in a Steve Jobs voodoo doll.


Edited By: Lupeto on Aug 20, 2010 10:05: edit
#6
@Lupeto If that's you in your avatar you look like a stereotypical mac driver.

Hows the MX5?
#7
eroomydna
@Lupeto If that's you in your avatar you look like a stereotypical mac driver. Hows the MX5?
Haha so true, Hey Lupeto go back to Starbucks. :p
#8
no stock in Leeds or Manchester :(
#9
Lupeto
To the people voting negative:

How on earth can the cheapest current price, for a desirable product, be a cold deal?

If you find mac too expensive or you don't consider them value-for-money, please don't vote...somebody might miss out on a saving, due to you voting negative and missing the deal because its ice cold.

Its an infantile way to behave. If you consider something to be grotesquly overpriced, no deal is going to change your opinion.

Remember: A negative vote on an Apple deal is NOT a pin in a Steve Jobs voodoo doll.



+1 I am not a MAC fan as such and am one of those who consider them overpriced. However if this is the cheapest one around then surely it is by the very definition of what this site stands for - a hot deal.
#10
The product is also only mid lifecycle, Days Since Update 129 (Avg = 2, so 'worth it'.

http://buyersguide.macrumors.com/#Portable_Macs

Macs surprise me, I was looking at eBay prices for selling my iBook (5 years old) and its still fetching around £200 which is insane for what the machine can/cant do with the latest apps!
#11
It might be cheap compared to anywhere else for this model, but if you look a few items down the page, you can get a similarly specced Win7 machine for £629 at Dixons, so I perfectly understand why people vote cold. Apple superior design or not, it's still over twice the price for near-on identical Win7 hardware.

(I've abstained from voting, incidentally)
#12
Baron Jerk-Off
It might be cheap compared to anywhere else for this model, but if you look a few items down the page, you can get a similarly specced Win7 machine for £629 at Dixons, so I perfectly understand why people vote cold. Apple superior design or not, it's still over twice the price for near-on identical Win7 hardware.


But it's not like-for-like...unless it's a hackintosh, which you can't do with most laptops.

You can't by a Mac Laptop of this spec for less, so it's a hot deal. Whether you think that it is poor value in comparison with a Win 7 laptop is a subject for debate, but is no reason to neg this deal.

Keep such debates for discussions, not for deals.
#13
Baron Jerk-Off
(I've abstained from voting, incidentally)


I wish more people had your common sense.
#14
This was the Croydon Costco.
#15
Lupeto
Whether you think that it is poor value in comparison with a Win 7 laptop ... is no reason to neg this deal.

Keep such debates for discussions, not for deals.
Are you a site admin or moderator? Are you a Hot UK Deals police officer? Have you been appointed in any way to speak for Hot UK Deals? Are you quoting from some official rules?

As far as I can tell there are no rules on how people must assess a potential hot deal: they are free to apply their own criteria and heuristics. That is the point of having humans vote rather than simply arithmetically comparing prices.

You Lupeto are yet another one of these people on this site who resorts to inventing rules whenever people don't vote the way you think they should.

When people buy laptops or computers in general, they look at the spec they can get for the money. For most of those who aren't Apple junkies, this is a large part of what constitutes a good deal. Obviously spec isn't everything but it is a large part. You can see this reflected in the voting patterns for general non-Apple computers on this site. You don't get someone appearing in a cold HP deal complaining that it is unfair to compare HP computers to other computers (although sometimes there are Sony VAIO zealots).

Now suddenly when it is Apple, you are saying we aren't allowed to compare the spec of an Apple machine to a normal PC? Apple must have its own special category and can only be compared to itself? This is ludicrous. If you are correct then Apple could sell this laptop for £5,000 and it would still be a hot deal just so long as they set the RRP to £10,000. But they don't, because like it or not, Apple computers are in competition with other computer manufacturers. It's basic economics. Apple know this, but you can't quite accept it.

However much of an Apple zealot you are, you must realise that Macs are still just personal computers. Certainly Macbook Pros are very nicely designed and built and they run OSX, but for lots of people the approximately 40-50% extra cost is just not worth it. Who are you to tell these people that they can't vote cold on that basis?

By all means vote it hot, but don't start whining when others don't follow suit. You are like the stereotypical kid at primary school who changes the rules of the game when he starts losing.

(PS: To avoid partisanship, I haven't voted. I am just posting here to defend peoples' right to vote as they see fit and not be dictated to by a jumped-up Mac zealot.)

Edited By: alasrati on Aug 20, 2010 23:38: Second sentence was originally mangled by site
#16
alasrati
Lupeto
Whether you think that it is poor value in comparison with a Win 7 laptop ... is no reason to neg this deal.Keep such debates for discussions, not for deals.
Are you a site admin or moderator? Are a Hot UK Deals? Have you been appointed in any way to speak for Hot UK Deals? Are you quoting from some official rules?As far as I can tell there are no rules on how people must assess a potential hot deal: they are free to apply their own criteria and heuristics. That is the point of having humans vote rather than simply arithmetically comparing prices.You Lupeto are yet another one of these people on this site who resorts to inventing rules whenever people don't vote the way you think they should.When people buy laptops or computers in general, they look at the spec they can get for the money. For most of those who aren't Apple junkies, this is a large part of what constitutes a good deal. Obviously spec isn't everything but it is a large part. You can see this reflected in the voting patterns for general non-Apple computers on this site. You don't get someone appearing in a cold HP deal complaining that it is unfair to compare HP computers to other computers (although sometimes there are Sony VAIO zealots).Now suddenly when it is Apple, you are saying we aren't allowed to compare the spec of an Apple machine to a normal PC? Apple must have its own special category and can only be compared to itself? This is ludicrous. If you are correct then Apple could sell this laptop for £5,000 and it would still be a hot deal just so long as they set the RRP to £10,000. But they don't, because like it or not, Apple computers are in competition with other computer manufacturers. It's basic economics. Apple know this, but you can't quite accept it.However much of an Apple zealot you are, you must realise that Macs are still just personal computers. Certainly Macbook Pros are very nicely designed and built and they run OSX, but for lots of people the approximately 40-50% extra cost is just not worth it. Who are you to tell these people that they can't vote cold on that basis?By all means vote it hot, but don't start whining when others don't follow suit. You are like the stereotypical kid at primary school who changes the rules of the game when he starts losing.(PS: To avoid partisanship, I haven't voted. I am just posting here to defend peoples' right to vote as they see fit and not be dictated to by a jumped-up Mac zealot.)

That, I have to say, was very well articulated. There are other deals on this site that brings similar repercussions. For instance, I saw a very unusual item that was claimed to be the lowest priced possible yet it was voted cold. I forget what it was but it was not of much use to most and for what it was, it was deemed to be expensive. The OP became defensive asking where such an item could be had for cheaper and pleaded for others to give reasons for the cold votes and even had the gall to cite "Possible misprice?" too.

I'm afraid I have to blame the moderators for this lemmings like behaviour though. I have seen a certain moderator posting a message warning that some cold voters would receive infractions for not giving reasons. The ones unable to make their own decisions seem to take this too literally and as you have noticed, become moderators themselves. While on the subject of Lemmings let's add 10 exclamation marks to a title, include the words "Possible misprice" to the title and even perform simple maths for others (eg. 4 Creme Eggs for £1 - YES that's 25p each).


Edited By: ElliottC on Aug 20, 2010 21:02: .
#17
midiman

+1 I am not a MAC fan as such and am one of those who consider them overpriced. However if this is the cheapest one around then surely it is by the very definition of what this site stands for - a hot deal.


I fully agree, at least someone understands the virtues of the hot/cold voting system.
#18
Really have no idea why this is voted so cold. Do you know if costco sells the 27 inch imacs or cheaper. Would really help if I can get a few hundred quid saved on one.
#19
alasrati
Lupeto
Whether you think that it is poor value in comparison with a Win 7 laptop ... is no reason to neg this deal.

Keep such debates for discussions, not for deals.


Are you a site admin or moderator? Are you a Hot UK Deals police officer? Have you been appointed in any way to speak for Hot UK Deals? Are you quoting from some official rules?

As far as I can tell there are no rules on how people must assess a potential hot deal: they are free to apply their own criteria and heuristics. That is the point of having humans vote rather than simply arithmetically comparing prices.

You Lupeto are yet another one of these people on this site who resorts to inventing rules whenever people don't vote the way you think they should.


For what it's worth alasrati I agree with Lupeto. There are a great many perfectly good discussion boards where the Pro's and Con's of Mac(OSX & Windows) vs Windows only machines can be discussed to your hearts content. This area should have been reserved for the discussion of this deal, that's why it's entitled 'Deals' (If you are struggling with that have a look at the navigation bar at the top of the page, and it sits between 'All' and 'Vouchers'.

I don't think for one moment that Lupeto has attempted to self elect or portray himself as an official of HUKD, he has just spoken some common sense in a thread where it seems to be decidedly lacking at the moment.

Ok so lets get onto a hypothetical like for like comparison the way it happens in your world -

You could buy a Hyundai Sonata with an RRP of £15,445. You could also buy a BMW 320i SE with an RRP of £25,175.

Both will have 4 doors, 5 seats, a boot, most likely a radio and I've chosen two cars which both feature a 2.0 naturally aspirated petrol engine. Both will get you from A to B smoothly, safely and in relative comfort.

Now, if the BMW was posted here as a deal would you be spouting **** about it being too expensive and that you could get the Hyundai for best part of £10k less?? I would sincerely hope not!!

You'd also do well to consider that in 3 years time the 3 Series BMW will probably still be worth more than a brand new Sonata - Even with it's 5 year Warranty!!

So in this case the 3 Series BMW is not only a better purchase and ownership prospect, it is infinitely more desirable than the Hyundai Sonata.

(Please remember this is an entirely hypothetical example)

So what you need to realise is that not everything is as directly comparable as you might think and hence why discussions in the deals section should be confined to points relevant to the specific deal that has been posted. Cold votes should be accompanied with an explanation of why it's cold which would normally be restricted to it being cheaper elsewhere or problems with the retailer.

And one last point to further outline the negativity of cold voting because you don't like the product -

If for example I wanted to buy a MacBook Pro 15" I might look on a website such as HUKD and search for my product and what I would likely find this deal. However it would be woefully misrepresented because a large number of mis-informed, narrow minded, Apple haters had voted it cold. It's currently showing as -105' but as has been widely acknowledged by many here it is a very good deal and I challenge you to find that exact product cheaper. I'd love for you to explain to me how that works, and what value that brings to this website.

So well done and thanks to the OP for posting, and well done to those who have the common sense to realise this is a great deal. Best of luck to anyone that buys it, you'll love it I am sure.

To the rest of you who vote cold because you stupidly think a deal on a Windows only based laptop is better please don't bother in the future, you offer no benefit or support to this website.

Edited By: Stu on Aug 21, 2010 11:27: More detail
#20
That is irrelevant. If you post a deal on an expensive BMW and if people vote it cold because they only need a cheap car to get them from A to B, then that would still be fine because it is their choice how they vote. Of course, on average, they probably wouldn't vote it that cold as BMWs have a lot more status than Hyundais. Macs don't quite have the same posing value except amongst a certain subset of people, those who hang around in Starbucks updating their blogs. BMWs have a wider appeal and are more likely to get you laid. But if a person wants to save money on their car and buy expensive Apple products that is their choice.

Stu
So what you need to realise is that not everything is as directly comparable as you might think
They are certainly a lot more comparable than you seem to accept. As I said above, Apple know they are in competition with other computer manufacturers: if they weren't they could raise their prices even higher.

Stu
and hence why discussions in the deals section should be confined to points relevant to the specific deal that has been posted.
This is a complete non sequitur.

Stu
Cold votes should be accompanied with an explanation of why it's cold
Yes although asking everyone who votes cold to give a reason is a bit much and would lead to fewer votes being cast which would be detrimental to the voting system (a larger sample size is more representative). Usually what happens is a handful of people give reasons and that is enough to get a general idea of why something has been voted cold. There are a lot more votes on each deal than there are comments.

Stu
which would normally be restricted to it being cheaper elsewhere or problems with the retailer.
Again a complete non sequitur. Where are you getting this information? You sound like another pseudo-moderator here. You are stating something in a manner that makes it sound like it is an official rule, yet you have plucked it from thin air.


Stu
If for example I wanted to buy a MacBook Pro 15" I might look on a website such as HUKD and search for my product and what I would likely find this deal. However it would be woefully misrepresented because a large number of mis-informed, narrow minded, Apple haters had voted it cold.
Anyone with any sense would just compare the price in the deal to their best current price and see that it is cheaper. But for people who aren't looking for a specific make and model of laptop, having this pop up as a hot deal would be misleading as it doesn't compare well in value to other laptops (assuming that is how people have voted).

Stu
It's currently showing as -105' but as has been widely acknowledged by many here it is a very good deal
No, obviously the majority of people think it is not a "very good deal" as it has been voted down to -105: that is how voting works. It has been "widely acknowledged" by a small yet vocal group of ardent Mac fans that it is a good deal (and furthermore that anyone who disagrees is going against the policies of the site, is stupid, has no common sense, etc, etc). You can't turf out the voting system when it doesn't agree with your opinions or shall I call you Kim Jong?

Stu
and I challenge you to find that exact product cheaper.
Again, another non sequitur. My entire argument has been that you don't have to find a cheaper price for the same product in order to vote a deal cold (again please point me to the site rules that state such). If you are right and we have to vote hot for anything that is a better price than usual and cold for anything that is cheaper elsewhere, then everything would be either fully hot or fully cold: everyone would be forced to vote the same way (or abstain). It's Hobson's choice. What would be the point of that? There would be no way of distinguishing between deals, the heat would be just a function of the number of people that happened to see the deal (currently that plays a factor). In fact, you could just use a computer to compare the prices and do away with the voting entirely.

Stu
To the rest of you who vote cold because you stupidly think a deal on a Windows only based laptop is better please don't bother in the future, you offer no benefit or support to this website.
Nice attitude there. Anyone who doesn't agree with you is both stupid and not benefiting this website? For the good of the site we must vote hot on all Apple products? Laughable.
#21
Stu
alasrati
Lupeto
Whether you think that it is poor value in comparison with a Win 7 laptop ... is no reason to neg this deal.Keep such debates for discussions, not for deals.
Are you a site admin or moderator? Are you a Hot UK Deals police officer? Have you been appointed in any way to speak for Hot UK Deals? Are you quoting from some official rules?As far as I can tell there are no rules on how people must assess a potential hot deal: they are free to apply their own criteria and heuristics. That is the point of having humans vote rather than simply arithmetically comparing prices.You Lupeto are yet another one of these people on this site who resorts to inventing rules whenever people don't vote the way you think they should.
For what it's worth alasrati I agree with Lupeto. There are a great many perfectly good discussion boards where the Pro's and Con's of Mac(OSX & Windows) vs Windows only machines can be discussed to your hearts content. This area should have been reserved for the discussion of this deal, that's why it's entitled 'Deals' (If you are struggling with that have a look at the navigation bar at the top of the page, and it sits between 'All' and 'Vouchers'.I don't think for one moment that Lupeto has attempted to self elect or portray himself as an official of HUKD, he has just spoken some common sense in a thread where it seems to be decidedly lacking at the moment. Ok so lets get onto a hypothetical like for like comparison the way it happens in your world - You could buy a Hyundai Sonata with an RRP of £15,445. You could also buy a BMW 320i SE with an RRP of £25,175.Both will have 4 doors, 5 seats, a boot, most likely a radio and I've chosen two cars which both feature a 2.0 naturally aspirated petrol engine. Both will get you from A to B smoothly, safely and in relative comfort.Now, if the BMW was posted here as a deal would you be spouting **** about it being too expensive and that you could get the Hyundai for best part of £10k less?? I would sincerely hope not!!You'd also do well to consider that in 3 years time the 3 Series BMW will probably still be worth more than a brand new Sonata - Even with it's 5 year Warranty!!So in this case the 3 Series BMW is not only a better purchase and ownership prospect, it is infinitely more desirable than the Hyundai Sonata.(Please remember this is an entirely hypothetical example)So what you need to realise is that not everything is as directly comparable as you might think and hence why discussions in the deals section should be confined to points relevant to the specific deal that has been posted. Cold votes should be accompanied with an explanation of why it's cold which would normally be restricted to it being cheaper elsewhere or problems with the retailer.And one last point to further outline the negativity of cold voting because you don't like the product - If for example I wanted to buy a MacBook Pro 15" I might look on a website such as HUKD and search for my product and what I would likely find this deal. However it would be woefully misrepresented because a large number of mis-informed, narrow minded, Apple haters had voted it cold. It's currently showing as -105' but as has been widely acknowledged by many here it is a very good deal and I challenge you to find that exact product cheaper. I'd love for you to explain to me how that works, and what value that brings to this website.So well done and thanks to the OP for posting, and well done to those who have the common sense to realise this is a great deal. Best of luck to anyone that buys it, you'll love it I am sure.To the rest of you who vote cold because you stupidly think a deal on a Windows only based laptop is better please don't bother in the future, you offer no benefit or support to this website.

I have some nail clippings for sale. Currently mispriced at £500 for 5. That's £100 each, yes £100. Must be a glitch. Where else can you buy the same clippings for less than this price? Please find a better deal for the same clippings. If you're going to vote cold please state why. Please do not vote cold just because you don't like my nail clippings. Oh by the way, this is my first post so please be gentle.

Can you see the problem? If we are all lemmings, everything will be voted hot. One should follow guidelines with a noninterventionist attitude. Voting on something requires judicial thinking rather than set rules. Of course, there are many who are unable to stand on their 2 feet and make decisions for themselves and for those, there is no helping them. Simple comprehension, ability to apply liberal thinking and common sense is all that is required.

Just because some people have rated this product hot does not override the amount of cold votes. As I said earlier, apply some comprehension and liberal way of thinking - it isn't difficult. One the one hand, we have a handful of people judging the product as hot. On the other hand there are many cold votes, so you conclude that the deal is hot based on the results? The only time I have seen this in politics was Margaret Thatcher having x votes, Michael Heseltine having y votes and the Prime Minister, therefore, is .... John Major?? But that was a one off.

You have have also argued the case that the cold voters are Apple haters? How was that conclusion drawn up? Maybe, you have sufficient foundation to base your conclusion on and if that is the case, why is there a requirement for you to ask why the cold voters have voted in this manner - you have already concluded they are narrow-minded Apple haters. It appears that the term "narrow-minded" may not apply to the people on the cold vote side of the fence!

A vote is a choice, by definition. Coercing others into only voting hot smacks completely of totalitarianism.

Edited By: ElliottC on Aug 21, 2010 13:01: .
#22
alasrati
Stu
To the rest of you who vote cold ...please don't bother in the future, you offer no benefit or support to this website.
For the good of the site we must vote hot on all Apple products? Laughable.


What's laughable is your command of logic.

Not Vote Cold != Vote Hot

Not Vote Cold = Vote Hot OR Vote Neutral OR No Action
#23
ElliottC
A vote is a choice, by definition. Coercing others into only voting hot smacks completely of totalitarianism.


And voting cold, only because it is a mac, and not appraising the actual deal, is fanboyism of the highest order (in this case, anti-apple fanboyism)

Is it really so hard to see the difference?

I'd be equally against an apple fanboy voting negative on every Win 7 laptop deal they saw, purely because they think it a poorly-built piece of tat.

What makes me laugh is that, because I point out and object to fanboy-driven behaviour, morons like Alasrati automatically assume I'm a fanboy of the opposing camp. Again...logic isn't his strongest point...

Edited By: Lupeto on Aug 22, 2010 10:16: edit
#24
Of course it is everyones free choice to vote as they wish. The point that myself and Lupeto are trying to get across is that inappropriately voting (in this case because you have chosen to pitch it against another, albeit incompatible, product) masks the true value of the deal in question. We aren't trying to 'force' anyone to vote especially in a specific direction, but in the true spirit of the system of voting on the merits of a deal surely you should only vote on like for like products of the same specification.

We aren't talking site rules or pseudo moderation, we're talking common sense.

So ElliotC & alasrati by your logic these wouldn't be deals -

http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/microsoft-office-2010-pro-plus-home/742493

298' Hot - Microsoft Office at £8.95 for eligible people. Why pay £8.95 when you can get open office for free??

http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/walkers-sensations-roasted-chicken-/742447

206' Hot - Walkers Sensations for 15p. After all it's only a bag of crisps and I can get 18 bags of Walkers Salt & Vinegar in Asda for a net 9p each.

http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/coca-cola-diet-coke-coke-zero-pepsi/722790

269' Hot - 6 x 330ml Coke, most varieties 99p - Surely that's not a deal?? I've got to go all the way to Wilkinsons. I might as well get Asda's own while I'm there, it's the same price. I could get 6 litres of the stuff for £3 in Sainsbury's if I really wanted it.

http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/lg-blu-ray-player-bd350-34-97-curry/742925

578' Hot - LG Blu Ray Player. Why should I spend all that on a Blu Ray player?? I can buy a DVD player for under a tenner.

http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/sony-ps3-slim-250gb-with-2-x-offici/742916

844' Hot - Sony PS3 pack at £235. Surely and without even looking very hard I could walk into somewhere and pick up a Wii Bundle for between £150 - £170 and save myself a few quid. After all I could still plug it into my telly and play games with it couldn't I??

Can you see the logic now?? I doubt you can to be honest because you've dug yourselves into rabbit hole which you now can't explain your way out of without resorting to calling people lemmings or assuming that all Apple owners sit in Starbucks updating blogs.

What you should be doing is applying the common sense that you so rightly say is required.

Equally I have no interest in Playstation or Xbox paraphernalia and to be honest I think it's all over priced, should I apply your logic and vote everything cold?? No I apply common sense, I understand that those that are that way inclined might like to have visibility or a potential bargain that might suit their needs and I abstain from voting.
#25
Lupeto
alasrati
Stu
To the rest of you who vote cold ...please don't bother in the future, you offer no benefit or support to this website.
For the good of the site we must vote hot on all Apple products? Laughable.

What's laughable is your command of logic.

Not Vote Cold != Vote Hot

Not Vote Cold = Vote Hot OR Vote Neutral OR No Action
Of everything I said, this trivial statement is what you pick up on?

"For the good of this site we must vote hot, if we vote, on all Apple products?" That is what I meant. (I didn't realise you can vote neutral.)

But thanks for calling me an illogical moron. I can join the other infantile cold voters and we can attempt to make it through our lives despite our lack of common sense.

Note I said "however much of an Apple zealot you are". Not "you are an Apple zealot". There was an assumption that you were at least partly an Apple zealot, based on your claim that Macbook Pros can't be compared to other laptops. Do you use an Apple computer?

Also, using logic, please explain how you have arrived at the conclusion that "anyone" (note anyone, not "everyone") who voted cold on this deal did so merely because it's a Mac and they are anti-Apple fanboys. (Assuming that wasn't just an irrelevant general statement, e.g. "if you hate all black people then you are a racist".) Who are you to second-guess the voters? Your arrogance is contemptible. Not many people other than certain paranoid Apple zealots actually believe there is such a thing as an anti-Apple fanboy. Not loving Apple products doesn't mean you hate them (this is ironic because it's the law of the excluded middle which you attempted to bash me over the head with earlier).

Irrelevant diversion over, please let me recap my overarching point here, the point which you seem conveniently to be ignoring:
People are free to vote as they see fit; you are in no position to call them childish, denounce their common sense, dictate to them how they are allowed to vote, attempt to limit what they can discuss or to accuse them of being biased fanboys simply because they disagree with your opinion.
#26
This is a silly debate you can only compare like for like a Dell or any other computer might perform as well as an Apple but it’s not an Apple, a Rolls Royce will perform the same function as a Mini i.e. get you from a to b but you can’t compare the them anymore than you can compare an Apple with any other computer, I am not saying that the Apple is better or worse but they are quite unique so any other comparison is pointless. So whatever you think of Apple the cheapest one you can find has to be a hot deal.
#27
love this argument,always happens when an apple product is posted.

apples are overpriced we know but some people can afford and prefer them,if that's you then this is a good deal because its the best price around, what's too argue about??
#28
quizmaniac
love this argument,always happens when an apple product is posted.


Yep, it gets tiresome after a while.

quizmaniac
apples are overpriced we know but some people can afford and prefer them


There is no denying that Apple products are expensive, and I don't think anyone would try to argue out of that. Over priced is a matter of opinion but that in itself is more reason to pay heed to a cheaper way to acquire one when it arises.

What you do get for your money is a good quality, well designed product that comes with excellent customer support that just works.

quizmaniac
this is a good deal because its the best price around, what's too argue about??


Likewise it could be argued, as i have indicated above, that many brands of a type of item are more/less expensive than others and that is why I feel so strongly about ensuring that the voting system is not abused as it has been here.


Edited By: Stu on Aug 22, 2010 13:16: Edit
#29
Lupeto
ElliottC
A vote is a choice, by definition. Coercing others into only voting hot smacks completely of totalitarianism.
And voting cold, only because it is a mac, and not appraising the actual deal, is fanboyism of the highest order (in this case, anti-apple fanboyism)Is it really so hard to see the difference?I'd be equally against an apple fanboy voting negative on every Win 7 laptop deal they saw, purely because they think it a poorly-built piece of tat.What makes me laugh is that, because I point out and object to fanboy-driven behaviour, morons like Alasrati automatically assume I'm a fanboy of the opposing camp. Again...logic isn't his strongest point...

I don't care if "fanboyism" is a reason behind the votes. A vote is a vote. I did not vote but if it was obligatory I would vote cold because I do not believe this represents value. It may be the cheapest price for a particular product but as with nail clippings, that in my book, is not reason alone for a hot vote. Stu's examples just shows how injudciously he has picked them. Shall I compare Rolls Royce branded nail clippings with Ford branded nail clippings?

Let's not forget that there is also a price to pay for a brand. Some believe it is worth paying extra to flash around a manufacturer's brand name (offering free advertising for the manufacturer) but others do not believe it is worth paying for certain brands. Essentially, we may have a standard Foxconn motherboard, Intel CPU, Seagate hard drive, Asus laptop chassis. These type of machines are in abundance and we know typical prices. Add an Apple sticker to the machine and install a very capable OS (based on Linux) and the price changes significantly in comparison with the hardware. Some will still vote hot but others do not believe the extra costs justifies a logo and the OS. This deal is over 100 degrees below zero and is a representation of what people believe. You cannot change that and it has to be accepted that the majority has voted cold.

People vote how they wish to, no matter how much you may disagree. Hitherto, there has not been a cold voter who has attempted to argue that we should all vote Apple products cold - far from it. The converse, however, is in this thread in its abundance and clearly (despite Stu's attempt to completely twist the words) there were persuasive comments to people that they should be voting this hot - and this included insults and assumptions too!

Allow people to vote how they wish, no quibbles, no arguments. Allow people to vote BNP, no quibbles, no arguments. People should not be insulted by being dictated to and those that are incongruent with one's views should not be described as "a large number of mis-informed, narrow minded, Apple haters had voted it cold" and then changed to "Of course it is everyones free choice to vote as they wish". Isn't that right, Stu?

I won't reply directly to Stu because I believe he's a little more difficult to reason with than yourself but as I said earlier, it is not difficult to be liberal minded - much akin to reading a tabloid paper where it is not difficult to pick faults with the story and realise how editors use persuasive language to convey information.
suspended#30
And this is the reason that Apple are rich bastards :D
#31
DarkKnight
And this is the reason that Apple are rich bastards :D


Bill Gates isn't doing bad!! :D

http://www.forbes.com/lists/2010/10/billionaires-2010_The-Worlds-Billionaires_Rank.html
#32
I would never buy this product (for my own personal reasons), but I can appreciate that some members may wish to & if this is the best price available for the product at this time then I would vote hot to help my fellow members see the deal listing.

I say would vote hot, but I stopped voting on any deals a few months ago when it became clear that I have been wasting my time doing so for almost 3.5 years as my votes (based on price alone, or on price & with better terms/incentives) for the same product were effectively being "cancelled out" by other members voting cold because they didn't like the retailer, or the product, or the colour, or the speed of delivery, or any number of subjective factors (even though they had no interest in the product anyway).

BFN,

fp.
1 Like #33
Stu you are creating false dichotomies. Two goods don't have to be perfect substitutes in order to be in competition. Many people do use Open Office instead of MS Office, but they might prefer MS Office (for compatibility, because they have to use it at work, etc). Such people may be willing to pay a small price for it: £9 is not very much. However, if they had to pay £1,000 for Office, you would see droves of people switching to alternative products. This is basic economics and common sense.

This is the third time I have made this point. Perhaps I am not being clear enough. There is a good Wikipedia article here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Substitute_good

Just so you know, substitute goods are a GCSE Economics topic. So this is not exactly advanced stuff but perhaps it is just outside your area of expertise?

Stu
I feel so strongly about ensuring that the voting system is not abused as it has been here.
Well Stu, if you feel that strongly then the only sensible course of action is to report the abuse to the admin staff. I am sure that if the site is being abused then they will take action.

fanpages
I stopped voting on any deals a few months ago when it became clear that I have been wasting my time doing so for almost 3.5 years as my votes (based on price alone, or on price & with better terms/incentives) for the same product were effectively being "cancelled out" by other members voting cold because they didn't like the retailer, or the product, or the colour, or the speed of delivery, or any number of subjective factors (even though they had no interest in the product anyway).
From the Help: How Voting Works section of this website:

"The HUKD temperature gauge (the little red and blue arrow next to each deal) is used by members to show their opinion on the deals, competitions, vouchers and freebies on HUKD. Members vote "hot" for those offers that seem pretty special. Enough hot votes and the deal will go front page."

Opinions are inherently subjective. So it seems you are categorically wrong to complain about people voting based on subjective matters (not that all the things you listed are completely subjective anyway.) It is a fact of life that a single vote has very little weight (although your vote on this site counts for more because you have posted so many good deals).

See here: http://www.hotukdeals.com/help

Don't get me wrong fanpages, I am not having a go at you as I appreciate your contributions to this site and that dog is too cute to be angry at. However, I think you are wrong to criticise people for voting on factors other than price.

Edited By: alasrati on Aug 22, 2010 17:15: Response to fanpages
#34
alasrati

Stu
I feel so strongly about ensuring that the voting system is not abused as it has been here.
Well Stu, if you feel that strongly then the only sensible course of action is to report the abuse to the admin staff. I am sure that if the site is being abused then they will take action.


I haven't felt the need to report the thread for abuse yet, and to be honest you couldn't do that on the basis of cold votes because you don't have visibility of who does vote cold. I have however attempted to take up the issue with the Admins/Moderators in the feedback section where it is best discussed. It probably wouldn't surprise you to learn that this has quickly degenerated into an Apple bashing thread - perhaps you'd care to stop by and join in too.
1 Like #35
Thanks alasrati :)

I am not criticising people's factors on voting. The wording you quoted has been changed recently (8 July 2010).

I am trying to relay that there needs to be clarification on what the opinions can be upon relating to a deal.

The previous wording can be found in the old thread created in February 2008 ("Newcomers advice on HotUKDeals & general forum usage").

You may recall I initially raised my concerns in a thread we both contributed to (in May 2010):
"Sony HS1 - 1TB Home Media Server - Only £179.89 - R.R.P £399 @ Micro Anvika!"

My viewpoint was not the consensus of opinion in that thread & I received some choice comments about my mental capacity.

I continued my discussions in another thread:
"Killzone 2 PS3 £11.98 Delivered @ Argos Clearance (eBay Outlet)"

Here it became clear that it was not just me with the confusion about voting.

The subject was raised again:
"Voting Cold on a deal just because you don't like the product"

...and again thereafter:
"EXPIRED - New help section and voting guidelines."

It continues today:
"Can we please have the rules/guidelines on Voting made more clear??" (as mentioned above, by Stu)


I do not have an issue with any member's reason for voting.
My problem is with the understanding of what this voting should be based upon.

If we are all left to vote subjectively on any aspect of a product, or a particular deal, then the relevance to the deal element of the thread is lost.

BFN,

fp.
1 Like #36
I think I agree with you both Stu and fanpages that there needs to be a clarification from the site admins, regardless of which way that clarification falls. Currently it doesn't say anything specific (which is precisely my point) and it leads to people like Stu and Lupeto (and unfortunately you Fanpages) seemingly quoting rules and guidelines which don't exist. Until we get that clarification, you probably shouldn't criticise peoples' voting logic or tell them how to decide to vote.

Fanpages, as regards the previous wording, I believe it is precisely that wording that we were discussing in the previous thread and I don't feel I need to repeat myself here. Needless to say, the wording does not mention any criteria for legitimate reasons for voting.

Stu
I haven't felt the need to report the thread for abuse yet, and to be honest you couldn't do that on the basis of cold votes because you don't have visibility of who does vote cold.
You don't need to have a suspect to report a crime. If the voting system really is being abused like this then the admins need to know. They probably have ways of finding out who is doing the abuse.

Edited By: alasrati on Aug 22, 2010 18:44: Response to Stu.
#37
alasrati
You don't need to have a suspect to report a crime. If the voting system really is being abused like this then the admins need to know. They probably have ways of finding out who is doing the abuse.


Very true mate, but only if they consider it to be abuse (_;)

Until it's clarified we'll never know and we'll likely keep on banging heads.
#38
OK, thanks for your separate replies.

If I have recalled guidelines, or wording of guidelines that have never existed, then I apologise, but I am obviously not the only member who has seen such rules, or have read the rules in such a way, to believe price was the only (or was a major contributing) factor in comparing one deal against another.

We have all contributed to the most recent "Feedback" thread now, and we should await the response from the site representatives.

From experience, though, this may never be provided, or may never be provided to everybody's satisfaction. I would certainly welcome a definitive statement so we can put this issue aside once & for all.

The most important part of today’s discussion is that we acknowledged each other's right to an opinion.

BFN,

fp.
#39
fanpages
The most important part of today’s discussion is that we acknowledged each other's right to an opinion.
Well I truly hope so and I hope that extends to respecting other peoples' reasons for voting, now and in the future.
#40
fanpages
The most important part of today’s discussion is that we acknowledged each other's right to an opinion.


alasrati
Well I truly hope so and I hope that extends to respecting other peoples' reasons for voting, now and in the future.


I never said I didn't (unless that response wasn't directly solely at me).

BFN,

fp.

Edited By: fanpages on Aug 22, 2010 21:53: Naffin' stupid quote system

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