Dubious Thread-Lock - HotUKDeals
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#1
It's a very grey area and because of that I am sure you can
understand why HUKD does not want to get involved with it.
I can see it from both sides though, like yourself........
[admin]#2
Hi Vibeone & Simon012 :) Thanks for your comment-
To be honest, I agree, it is a grey area. I was in two minds about it but I'm the only one online this morning so I had noone to chat about it to. I had to make a decision based on what I thought was the right thing to do. In my eyes, serial numbers are supposed to be attached to the original game in question, and the publishers state that the game cannot be reproduced or redistributed- I applied this to the serial number (as in my opinion, the sale of something like this can only be for illegal purposes??)
I want to speak to Rayman about it when he gets online and if I've made the wrong decision, obviously I'll reopen the thread and post here with the verdict :)
#3
after looking at the original post and jb's comment, then at this post and jb's comment again, I have to agree with jb. i feel that this would classed as redistributing and would be illegal.

i can see where vibeone is coming from, but i have to side with jb on this one
[mod]#4
I agree it should be locked.......it was actually me that reported it as if you have the original game then you would also have the serial key.

Downloading the game and then buying a serial key for online play is the most likely reason.........not saying it is but does seem very likely.
#5
You're both getting confused between the law, and the EULA.

It's entirely legal to sell nearly any posession that you might have. That big bag of cocaine kept inside your pillow, that's illegal to sell. But the collection of DVDs, CDs and games, that's all fine to resell. The EULA may prohibit such a thing, but then, if the owner of the copyright has a problem with you reselling your copy, it's a civil matter anyway. And it's not one that, with only a couple of exceptions, any company has ever tried to push The only exceptions I know of are Autodesk and Microsoft, both of whom I believe lost in court.

But, anyway. The guy was clearly wanting the serial number so he could run a legal copy of the game, so it was a legit request. Vibe was spot-on - the thread should be unlocked. It's no more illegal than any of the other threads in FS at the moment, including hte one for PGR4 on the Xbox 360, the Xbox 360 games James90 has on offer, the BR copy of Gone Baby Gone, or, y'know, you see the theme. It's all legal.
#6
I don't understand why the user who created the thread asked for the serial number, rather than the entire game?
banned#7
To save on postage I assume.

I don't dispute that he has probably been using a copied/downloaded version of the game, but in asking for a serial number, he is wanting to go legit, and in buying a legit serial number, indirectly, he is paying for his copy.

No one will sell him a legit key for £10, thats just madness, but I assumed straight away he wanted the key emailing, so he wouldnt have to faff about paying for postage on a disk (or disk contents) he already has.

Thanks for your reply juliet_bravo :)
#8
Either because they downloaded the game, or because they own a legit copy already, but the serial got blocked for whatever reason. Publishers have been known to double-issue and block the second one that registers, or block serials they believe have been used for cheating online.
banned#9
Syzable
I agree it should be locked.......it was actually me that reported it as if you have the original game then you would also have the serial key.

Downloading the game and then buying a serial key for online play is the most likely reason.........not saying it is but does seem very likely.


What does that matter? He isn't selling an illegal copy, nor asking for one. So what if he has been playing an illegal copy? It doesn't, and shouldn't matter to HUKD, because hes actually trying to "go straight"
#10
It's fine to sell a serial key as long as it comes with the original software, selling one without the other is a bit of a grey area and I think the mods are right to lock it
banned#11
RedIron
It's fine to sell a serial key as long as it comes with the original software, selling one without the other is a bit of a grey area and I think the mods are right to lock it

other than your own judgement, could you explain why its a grey area?
[mod]#12
Well i could go on a certain site now......get a key generator for this game and sell them for £10 a time without ever having bought the original game.
#13
vibeone
other than your own judgement, could you explain why its a grey area?


Are you looking for another reason on top of the fact that I said so? Lol :whistling:

simon012
It's a very grey area and because of that I am sure you can
understand why HUKD does not want to get involved with it.
I can see it from both sides though, like yourself........


Doesn't selling the serial number seperately promote the purchasing/downloading
of the software? ( the illegal act in the frst place! )
#14
I agree that it should be locked, I'm by no means an expert on these things but it seems to me that I could download loads of games and buy cut price serial numbers for them. I still don't have a legit copy do I? IMO the serial number should stay with the copy of the game, if someone wants to buy/sell the whole thing that's fine, otherwise there will be 2 copies of the game floating about and the publisher has only been paid for one.
#15
Syzable
Well i could go on a certain site now......get a key generator for this game and sell them for £10 a time without ever having bought the original game.


Actually no you could not, most of the newer online games require a legitimate key cd and key generators are useless they simply do not work anymore.

Buying a CD key online is common practice nowadays as most keys can be brought over the net at many websites that specifically sell those things they are companies based in places like Thailand ect that do this. It is a grey area and I have to say is probably best to keep topics like it off the forum from attracting any heat.
banned#16
Syzable
Well i could go on a certain site now......get a key generator for this game and sell them for £10 a time without ever having bought the original game.


I apologise if you think this post is too strong, but what a stupid thing to say. Since you posted in this thread, I assume you checked the original thread as well. You know... the one in which the trader asked SPECIFICALLY for a legit key.

My complaint is NOT about selling a dodgy key. He asked to buy a fully legitimate key. I don't see the problem in that.
banned#17
In my mind, the value and cost is for the serial number really, not the game.

The developers don't even bother protecting the game much anymore - its impossible, but killing the pirate copies on the multiplayer servers is easy and effective.

As long as a genuine key was asked for, was paid for, and sent, I see no issue.

As the thread hasn't come back, I guess the judgment has been made - which I respect. However, I'd like to hear raymans thoughts on it.
[mod]#18
vibeone;2627893
I apologise if you think this post is too strong, but what a stupid thing to say. Since you posted in this thread, I assume you checked the original thread as well. You know... the one in which the trader asked SPECIFICALLY for a legit key.

My complaint is NOT about selling a dodgy key. He asked to buy a fully legitimate key. I don't see the problem in that.


You completely miss the point.........the OP asked for a legitimate key yes............but there is nothing to stop the person selling it to him not providing one which then causes more hassle with people getting ripped off.
banned#19
Syzable
You completely miss the point.........the OP asked for a legitimate key yes............but there is nothing to stop the person selling it to him not providing one which then causes more hassle with people getting ripped off.

thats true of anything though! Anyone selling anything could be a rip off merchant. By your law, we should ban anything that could be fake: ie: clothings, trainers, game codes or DVD/GAMES/music.... Most things.
[mod]#20
I don't remember stating laws.........just an opinion.

I think you are getting a tad carried away and defensive over an issue that is for the mods to decide.
#21
vibeone
In my mind, the value and cost is for the serial number really, not the game.


That's the problem, it's surely not ok to expect to get use of a game by only paying for the serial number? The serial number goes with the game it was supplied with and should only be sold as a whole. Most people would have downloaded the game for free and be looking for a serial number, granted there may be the odd few who have lost their key and are looking for another.
banned#22
Syzable
I don't remember stating laws.........just an opinion.

I think you are getting a tad carried away and defensive over an issue that is for the mods to decide.

By your law, I meant by your reckoning etc... you stated "there is nothing to stop the person selling it to him not providing one"

But thats true of anything pretty much. Why single out software?

On your latter point, you are probably right!
banned#23
Benjimoron
That's the problem, it's surely not ok to expect to get use of a game by only paying for the serial number? The serial number goes with the game it was supplied with and should only be sold as a whole. Most people would have downloaded the game for free and be looking for a serial number, granted there may be the odd few who have lost their key and are looking for another.

Again, I accept your point of view, but if the OP was gonna pay full wack for the game, what is the problem? I assumed (perhaps wrongly), he only wanted the serial number in order to save on postage (because the code could be emailed). I cant see how anyone is being ripped off thats all. But hey, Syzable is right. *Leaves thread in order to get out more*
#24
At the end of the day, the serial number that is purchased is your 'license' to play the game legally. whether the game was installed from an 'original' disc or not is not an issue. it is simply whether you are licensed to play the game and that is what was looking to be purchased.
the serial numbers ARE NOT tied to the disc that it is supplied with, if it was then there would be ties put into the software on the disc.
in my opinion it is ok to pass on your license as long as there is still only 1 person using said license and the previous owner reneges on all ownership. much like the V40 on a motor vehicle. you are selling on your ownership.

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