How about a houkdeals auction? - HotUKDeals
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#1
You can count me in:thumbsup: Great idea
#2
Would be a great addition, the vast majority of people I speak to are sick to death of Ebay rising their final value fees all the time (over 7% now?).

The work involved in setting it up would be a hell of a lot though I would have thought so doubtful the sites owner would do it (especially if it was to be a free service).
#3
sounds like a great idea to me, ebay can turn out to be a right rip off sometimes.
#4
Money Spinning
Would be a great addition, the vast majority of people I speak to are sick to death of Ebay rising their final value fees all the time (over 7% now?).

The work involved in setting it up would be a hell of a lot though I would have thought so doubtful the sites owner would do it (especially if it was to be a free service).


I have SVN set up on my machine at home, with Trac running on top of it. Very easy to set up in Linux and easier in windows. As soon as I load my PC it starts up and I can access my whole SVN from university.

I could talk the admin through it, and if they have any problems I could help them out.

But I'm up for it. We already have a good community, would be a good idea to extend it.

Also there's always sourceforge for hosting our project, it's free as long as we keep it opensource???
#5
I'd be willing to pay to use the service. It's only fair with the amount of extra effort it would take to do...
#6
highguyuk
I'd be willing to pay to use the service. It's only fair with the amount of extra effort it would take to do...


I'm not going to say no, but I would like to keep it free initially. (Maybe just charge to keep the website on a good server??)

Everbody will be welcome to put some effort it. but it'll be HUKD only thing.

But we have to start somewhere, so what we need initially is for someone who's designed a website before to make up a user requirements thing (I hate those damn things!).

I'm leaning towards MySql + PHP for server side and HTML (obviously!) & CSS for client.
#7
Its the sort of thing that could grow very rapidly though and this would be a problem, it would end up detract from the point of HUKD (there would be endless self-promotion etc) and unless heavily moderated (staffed) it would become a breeding ground for scammers and fraudsters..
#8
Instead of reinvening the wheel, why not just use one of the many pre-existing auction scripts out there
#9
JayBird
Instead of reinvening the wheel, why not just use one of the many pre-existing auction scripts out there


what i was thinking. Use a template instead. BUT we need to go about this like we are going to design it ourselves. So we can get a good idea of what we want.

And then we can have a look at what is available and use it/extend it.
#10
Just to note, lots of forums have a marketplace of some description (AVForums have a good moderated one) it does involve a heavy amount of admin work however.
#11
rash;1677855
I'm not going to say no, but I would like to keep it free initially. (Maybe just charge to keep the website on a good server??)

Everbody will be welcome to put some effort it. but it'll be HUKD only thing.

But we have to start somewhere, so what we need initially is for someone who's designed a website before to make up a user requirements thing (I hate those damn things!).

I'm leaning towards MySql + PHP for server side and HTML (obviously!) & CSS for client.

This post made me chuckle for so many lil reasons.

I'm glad you'd like to keep it free. I'd like to make PS3's free too but it's not always practical. HUKD is a free for all, so anyone can join to be part of HUKD. If an auction site was to be incorportated into it, it would basically be for anyone out there in all the wwws because HUKD is not exclusive. You actually sound like this is going to happen, I highly doubt it will.

Perhaps, you should make your own up? If it worked, and free of course - I'd join!
#12
Its a nice idea and some good feedback.

BUT this site is a business and whilst our feedback is appreciated (I'm sure) and can influence decisions HUKD are not going to just do something like this it would need to be part of their stratergy.

If they thought it would detract or reduce the number of affilate click to purchases they would get then it would be a no straight away although it could help drive traffic....
#13
It would be great if it were free however I think that most people would'nt mind paying (so long as it's cheaper than ebay) providing it is well staffed and secure.
#14
highguyuk
This post made me chuckle for so many lil reasons.

I'm glad you'd like to keep it free. I'd like to make PS3's free too but it's not always practical. HUKD is a free for all, so anyone can join to be part of HUKD. If an auction site was to be incorportated into it, it would basically be for anyone out there in all the wwws because HUKD is not exclusive. You actually sound like this is going to happen, I highly doubt it will.

Perhaps, you should make your own up? If it worked, and free of course - I'd join!


What I mean by HUKD only is developing, I'm not even taling about who is going to use it.

What we need from HUKD is people who can program, not users yet.

BTW Linux is free and it's damn good, so I see no reason why this cannot be a success. It is mere an extentsion to already For Sale/Trade section.
#15
This is a good idea, eBay is becomming like abig shop rather than auction site now (useful to compare high street priceses when looking for bargains).. I remember that DABS had its own auction and I think Currys, morganauctions and others have a auction site.

Go for it..

Roy
#16
sounds good, sensible people running a fair site, simple ethics eh?

good on ya sport!!!
#17
roy.jay
This is a good idea, eBay is becomming like abig shop rather than auction site now (useful to compare high street priceses when looking for bargains).. I remember that DABS had its own auction and I think Currys, morganauctions and others have a auction site.

Go for it..

Roy


My sentiments exactly, undoubtedely you can always pick up a bargain, but not like it used to be.
#18
Ok, now that we've got that settled.

Are there any coders here? If so then what languages can you program in?

(I suspect if you can do >2 couple then it should take you about a day to a week to learn a new one.)

We also need people with other skills such as image manipulation etc. but programming are the obvious ones yet.

I'll start of.

I can do Java, SQL, Webstuff (XML, XSLT, CSS, JavaScript), some C/C++ and C#.

OK whos next?
#19
I could probably spare some time for this. Here is my skillset.
#20
JayBird
I could probably spare some time for this. Here is my skillset.


Thats brill! We've got a pro. people! We'll be looking to you for guidance!
#21
Sounds brilliant in theory... but I can't see it happening. Wish it would, but just being realistic.
#22
donbreach
Sounds brilliant in theory... but I can't see it happening. Wish it would, but just being realistic.


It's not going to be easy, but it would be quite easy to make a quick mock up just for HUKD, then as time goes on we can develop it further.
#23
its gonna be so hard to pull off, you gonna need full time staff to manage it. if you can pull this off then you are a GOD
#24
JayBird
I could probably spare some time for this. Here is my skillset.

Ooo.. a fellow PHPDN mod. Fancy meeting you here!

:w00t:
#25
JayBird
I could probably spare some time for this. Here is my skillset.


"Also I have done VR design and some other 3D stuff. But hey, it's not a competition" :giggle:
#26
i think there should be an annual fee. Like £20 one off fee for a year
#27
rash
It's not going to be easy, but it would be quite easy to make a quick mock up just for HUKD, then as time goes on we can develop it further.


You seem to be under the impression that the hard part is the coding. Have you stopped to think what the legal ramifications would be for those running such a site? If the site runs without a single hitch, if every seller is honest, if every buyer is honest and if every item for auction is legit, then there wouldn't be a problem, but there's more chance of finding Elvis still alive and living on the moon than that hapening. ;-) As a result those running HUKD would potentially be open to a great deal of litigation, so would need a professional legal team to deal with such matters, as well as the financial resources to cover such costs. That's not to mention the amount of work involved with actually running such a service and providing support for it's users.

If anything, the coding is the easy bit.
#28
nightswimmer
You seem to be under the impression that the hard part is the coding. Have you stopped to think what the legal ramifications would be for those running such a site? If the site runs without a single hitch, if every seller is honest, if every buyer is honest and if every item for auction is legit, then there wouldn't be a problem, but there's more chance of finding Elvis still alive and living on the moon than that hapening. ;-) As a result those running HUKD would potentially be open to a great deal of litigation, so would need a professional legal team to deal with such matters, as well as the financial resources to cover such costs. That's not to mention the amount of work involved with actually running such a service and providing support for it's users.

If anything, the coding is the easy bit.


Ebay seems to be doing fine....and people still complain, we're not going to deal with payments, thats the payment methods' (e.g. paypal) problem.

But your post seems a bit unclear, could you please give me an example of what problems legal problems we might come across? I'm not a legal expert so couldn't begin to guess, maybe you could shed some light on this.

Oh and another thing HUKD already has a FS/FT section, there don't seem to much legal stuff there??? We just wanna extend it and provide a better service....
1 Like #29
rash
Ebay seems to be doing fine....and people still complain,


They do fine because they skate a very delicate line between the legalities of online selling, rules governing auction houses (so far they have succesfully been able to not be classified as an online auction house), the laws regarding selling counterfeit goods, tax laws, etc. But they have only been able to do this thanks to some very creative legal practices, practices which are constantly having to be altered to keep them ahead of the ever changing laws of various countries (e.g. see the recent changes eBay have announced re. Distance Selling Regulations).

Also, take a look at their User Agreement and Policies sometimes, and at just the shear length of them (there are pages and pages), and think how many billable hours it took to deliberate and come up with everything written there.

But your post seems a bit unclear, could you please give me an example of what problems legal problems we might come across? I'm not a legal expert so couldn't begin to guess, maybe you could shed some light on this.


I am not a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV ;-) so I can not give you exact examples including case law but from what little I know, here's three quick examples:

Lets say someone starts selling fake Nike Trainers, HUKD could potentially be held liable for this.

Lets say someone starts selling Nike Trainers and someone complains that they are fake when they are not. HUKD ban said member for selling fakes. That person could potentially sue HUKD for loss of earnings, or if HUKD stated anywhere in public that the person had been banned for selling fakes, they could also potentially be sued for libel.

Lets say someone is selling an expensive item. Something goes wrong with the site causing people not to be able to bid, so the finishing price ends low. Upon investigation, it turns out that the glitch was down to poor coding. If the right policies are not in place, then HUKD could end up being sued for loss of earnings.

If you want more real life example,s put "ebay" "sued" or "ebay" "lawsuit" into google and see what kinds of things they have been sued for in the past.

Oh and another thing HUKD already has a FS/FT section, there don't seem to much legal stuff there???


That's because the way it is now (simple and small scale), they can get away with not that many rules, as to all intents and purposes they are not involved with the mechanism of the transaction itself. As soon as you introduce auctions, then they are involved in the mechanism of the transaction and things start to get a lot more complicated.

We just wanna extend it and provide a better service....


Don't get me wrong, it's a great idea in theory, I was just pointing out that I don't think it is as simple to introduce/run as you seemed to think it would be. For all I know, I could well be wrong. :)
#30
onion
Ooo.. a fellow PHPDN mod. Fancy meeting you here!

:w00t:


Haha, hey mate, small world :w00t:
#31
nightswimmer
They do fine because they skate a very delicate line between the legalities of online selling, rules governing auction houses (so far they have succesfully been able to not be classified as an online auction house), the laws regarding selling counterfeit goods, tax laws, etc. But they have only been able to do this thanks to some very creative legal practices, practices which are constantly having to be altered to keep them ahead of the ever changing laws of various countries (e.g. see the recent changes eBay have announced re. Distance Selling Regulations).

Also, take a look at their User Agreement and Policies sometimes, and at just the shear length of them (there are pages and pages), and think how many billable hours it took to deliberate and come up with everything written there.



I am not a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV ;-) so I can not give you exact examples including case law but from what little I know, here's three quick examples:

Lets say someone starts selling fake Nike Trainers, HUKD could potentially be held liable for this.

Lets say someone starts selling Nike Trainers and someone complains that they are fake when they are not. HUKD ban said member for selling fakes. That person could potentially sue HUKD for loss of earnings, or if HUKD stated anywhere in public that the person had been banned for selling fakes, they could also potentially be sued for libel.

Lets say someone is selling an expensive item. Something goes wrong with the site causing people not to be able to bid, so the finishing price ends low. Upon investigation, it turns out that the glitch was down to poor coding. If the right policies are not in place, then HUKD could end up being sued for loss of earnings.

If you want more real life example,s put "ebay" "sued" or "ebay" "lawsuit" into google and see what kinds of things they have been sued for in the past.



That's because the way it is now (simple and small scale), they can get away with not that many rules, as to all intents and purposes they are not involved with the mechanism of the transaction itself. As soon as you introduce auctions, then they are involved in the mechanism of the transaction and things start to get a lot more complicated.



Don't get me wrong, it's a great idea in theory, I was just pointing out that I don't think it is as simple to introduce/run as you seemed to think it would be. For all I know, I could well be wrong. :)


That only applies where the person is paying to use a service????? Since we won't charge (hopefully it won't apply).

To begin with I'm thinking of a Buy it now option only - just like we have now, except a bit easier.
#32
I'm a little unclear about what you're trying to achieve here. You seem to be suggesting it'll be 2 things at once. On the one hand you've suggested it'll be a service to compete with eBay, cheaper and better with features that eBay doesn't offer, but on the other hand you seem to be implying that it'll just be a neatened up and streamlined version of the HUKD trading folder.

Unless you take a step back and come up with a clear vision detailing what you want to build you're going to fail.
#33
rash
That only applies where the person is paying to use a service????? Since we won't charge (hopefully it won't apply).


I don't think that's the case, any more than say copying a Game is legal just because you gave it away, or a statement in a free newspaper is any less libelous just because the paper is free, etc.

Again IANAL though so I could well be wrong. :)

To begin with I'm thinking of a Buy it now option only - just like we have now, except a bit easier.


How is that easier than it is now? If anything that seems to make things harder especially as there is no oppertunity for the seller to accept a lower price.
#34
[COLOR="Red"]This will never happen.[/COLOR]

(Famous last words that will be quoted one day)
#35
thesaint
[COLOR="Red"]This will never happen.[/COLOR]

(Famous last words that will be quoted one day)



;)
#36
highguyuk
Perhaps, you should make your own up? If it worked, and free of course - I'd join!


...and ebay would buy the site for a coupla hundred grand as soon as you got a bit of interest and a few thousand members- and then we'd be back to square one.
#37
It wont happen.

But if it was too, it would need to be a joint venture with some other sites like MSE, AVF etc.
banned#38
ooo good idea im for it
[admin]#39
What is the difference between BIN on eBay and the fs/ft section here?

Is it just the auction bidding capability that people want?
#40
I have to agree it all seems doomed before it begins.

I'd suggest that if you do go ahead with the project, make it open source. Sourceforge is well set up for open source projects like this one.

As for the legal problems, you will hit them. As far as tax issues are concerned you would bypass them if you didn't have any income or expenditure. The best way to do that would be for one individual to pay for the hosting personally.

As far as libel etc is concerned the usual laws apply. Don't say anything that is likely to **** anyone off and if you do be prepared for the consequences.

As far as people selling fakes you can be protected if you take measures to prevent it from occurring. I'm not a lawyer but I suspect you could take the same defence as web hosting companies do. After all, the website would merely be an interface for the transaction, no more responsible than a market would be for an unscrupulous stall.

I've got a load of PHP experience and if the project gets off the ground I'd happily chip in with the work..

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