Afghan Policeman Shoots Five UK Soldiers Dead - HotUKDeals
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Afghan Policeman Shoots Five UK Soldiers Dead

FilthAndFurry Avatar
banned7y, 2m agoPosted 7 years, 2 months ago
Does anyone actually think there is any point in us staying there any longer?
FilthAndFurry Avatar
banned7y, 2m agoPosted 7 years, 2 months ago
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#2
yes I heard this earlier and its heartbreaking for the families of these soldiers.

And in answer to your question - NO
#3
NO............
#4
Blair has a lot to answer for
[mod]#5
No.........we should leave.

If all is harmonious all well and good...........if they all shoot each other then all well and good. Not our problem.
#6
we shouldnt have been there in the first place we should have left ages ago
#7
Syzable
No.........we should leave.

If all is harmonious all well and good...........if they all shoot each other then all well and good. Not our problem.


+1
#8
I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.
banned#9
No we shouldn't be there, but we have to be, we can't let them take Pakistan then India, they will have Nuclear weapons for christs sakes!
#10
Rule of thumb.....NEVER trust the AMP.
The enrolment process to become AMP is to pop along to the local town hall and pick up a uniform...shocking!
banned#11
turn it into a big pond
banned#12
Before the elections, we were told we were there to make sure they passed off peacefully. Instead they were so corrupt the opposition dropped out of a run-off.

Now we have troops being killed by the people they're supposed to be training to take over.

This is an unwinnable war.
#13
this is such a sad story ...those parents must feel terrible. The young men/women get killed and the mps that send them there sit at home and rip off expenses
#14
this whole thing leaves a rather sour tatse in my mouth especially obama congratulaing the "election" of karzai.
banned#15
lumoruk
No we shouldn't be there, but we have to be, we can't let them take Pakistan then India, they will have Nuclear weapons for christs sakes!


That's a bit extreme. Greater co-operation with Pakistan is needed, rather than just strafing the north-west regions with 'surgical strikes'.

Afghanistan is what happens when people are ignorant of history.
[mod]#16
FilthAndFurry;6777750

This is an unwinnable war.


This is the problem ^^^^

It will be never ending.
#17
fairy
this is such a sad story ...those parents must feel terrible. The young men/women get killed and the mps that send them there sit at home and rip off expenses


They signed up to serve. Yeh it's sad but that's there job.

I don't think we should of gone there to secure oil.:whistling: But whether it was BNP/Labour/Tories, wouldn't of made any difference would of gone there anyway.

Terrorism is the new cold war.
suspended#18
I'd like to think the army would pull out.

But cant see it happening, its a sad day
banned#19
Adam2050
They signed up to serve. Yeh it's sad but that's there job.



I agree to a certain extent. But there is a contract between 'us' and the soldiers who volunteer.

They do things we wouldn't, so long as we don't take the mick.
#20
FilthAndFurry
I agree to a certain extent. But there is a contract between 'us' and the soldiers who volunteer.

They do things we wouldn't, so long as we don't take the mick.


I have total respect for any one who serves, whether I agree with where there serving or not. As you said there doing things we wouldn't/can't. They are only following orders.:)
#21
The service personnel are doing an excellent job in an unwinnable war. The problem is the politicians - we are supporting a corrupt government in Afghanistan that lied and cheated in the recent elections. When Mugabe did the same in Zimbabwe he was criticised by Mr Brown and President Obama and sanctions imposed but in Afghanistan the President gets congratulated by the West and the UN.
#22
Same old Brown lies:-

The Prime Minister insisted he remained committed to ensuring his country's troops had "the best possible support and equipment - and the right strategy, backed by our international partners, and by a new Afghan government ready to play its part in confronting the challenges Afghanistan faces."

We have a massive disproportional prescence here compared to our NATO 'partners' and put our troops in the most dangerous areas.

GET OUT NOW!
#23
sad day - terrible for all those families - the mums and dads wives - little kiddies left without their dad

government saying they are there for our security!!!!

bring them home - then they can do the job over here - better checks at airports - etc

to stop the terrorists getting in - hunting out the ones already here

then hopefully we wont have another day like today
***************

look what people power did in U.S when they were in Vietnam

well this is our vietnam now and its about time government represented this country - not one 5 - 6000 miles away
#24
Adam2050
They signed up to serve. Yeh it's sad but that's there job.

I don't think we should of gone there to secure oil.:whistling: But whether it was BNP/Labour/Tories, wouldn't of made any difference would of gone there anyway.

Terrorism is the new cold war.


There is NO real stocks of oil or gas in Afghanistan. (see below)

The US and Britain (supposedly) invaded Afghanistan to liberate the people from the Taliban and hunt down Bin Laden and Al Qaeda.

However one could be cynical and join the conspiracy theorists in thinking that the US, primarily, wanted the Taliban overthrown after they took power, and a puppet government installed.
Why ? Because the Taliban refused to allow an oil and gas pipeline to be built that crossed the whole of Afghanistan.
The stocks of Oil and Gas are in North East Asia.

Some research is needed. ;-)
#25
Yes, every point, leaving them now would be a disaster far worse than at present.
banned#26
The Afghans have never been beaten. The British were involved in wars between 1870 and 1921 and we lost two very badly and the third ended in a poor compromise which failed within two or three years. The Afghan situation cannot ever be solved by Western forces. We should just get the hell out and let them stew in their own ****.
The people of Afghanistan are fighting in their own country and know all about the land and all it's peculiarities. Bear in mind, us British got our ars*s kicked all the way from Kabul, through the Khyber pass and into India slightly over 100 years since, yet the Yanks are determined that we ALL stay there. Eventually America and Britain will leave, the sooner the better in my opinion so that no more of our brave troops die defending something which we hv nothing to do with!
banned#27
pghstochaj
Yes, every point, leaving them now would be a disaster far worse than at present.


So when do we leave? What is a 'win'?
#28
FilthAndFurry;6778179
So when do we leave? What is a 'win'?


when the government has fulfilled their interests and told us we have won?

then we can have a massive celebration (great for the markets btw) and pat ourselves on the back for doing such a grand job....
banned#29
....whilst I agree with u that, "when the government has fulfilled their interests", the fact is that WAR is actually good for the markets (I assume u mean Stock), as it creates debt & as we know debt is good for the markets. Create debt (the reason behind most wars thru-out history) and u create control (the Third World is a prime living, breathing example of this.....). Have control & u can do anything u more or less like!
1 Like #30
pabloescobar
The Afghans have never been beaten. The British were involved in wars between 1870 and 1921 and we lost two very badly and the third ended in a poor compromise which failed within two or three years. The Afghan situation cannot ever be solved by Western forces. We should just get the hell out and let them stew in their own ****.
The people of Afghanistan are fighting in their own country and know all about the land and all it's peculiarities. Bear in mind, us British got our ars*s kicked all the way from Kabul, through the Khyber pass and into India slightly over 100 years since, yet the Yanks are determined that we ALL stay there. Eventually America and Britain will leave, the sooner the better in my opinion so that no more of our brave troops die defending something which we hv nothing to do with!


Exactly right and agreed to a point.

The problem comes when rogue governments/leaderships start killing and raping their own land and people.
The cry then comes for somebody to step in and stop it, quite rightly in my opinion.

The thing that infuriates me is why the U.N. are not allowed to do the job it was created for. Just why do the U.S. and British Governments think they have a right to invade countries ??
#31
FilthAndFurry
So when do we leave? What is a 'win'?


I didn't use the word win, careful.

My view would be to leave once the country has a sustainable and democratic political system which can internally police itself whilst allowing individuals to have basic human rights.

Regardless of the justification for going to war, it would be foolish to walk out now.
#32
This is sad and very unfortunate for the people killed and worse for the families concerned.

I think Afghanistan is a "catch 22" situation but leaving seems the most appropriate route after a situation like this.
#33
pabloescobar;6778523
....whilst I agree with u that, "when the government has fulfilled their interests", the fact is that WAR is actually good for the markets (I assume u mean Stock), as it creates debt & as we know debt is good for the markets. Create debt (the reason behind most wars thru-out history) and u create control (the Third World is a prime living, breathing example of this.....). Have control & u can do anything u more or less like!


you think we need more debt...... and you even suggest this is a good thing?

The "war" is actually proving extremely costly for the uk.

on the other hand

The people we are fighting can steal equipment, break laws, bypass bureaucracy and generally do what they want.

at the drop of a hat..... they can drop arms and become "civilians" who we are to protect.

It's all very wasteful and arguably idiotic.
banned#34
pghstochaj
I didn't use the word win, careful.

My view would be to leave once the country has a sustainable and democratic political system which can internally police itself whilst allowing individuals to have basic human rights.

Regardless of the justification for going to war, it would be foolish to walk out now.


Can you put a realistic timeframe on that? Next election isn't going to be for a few years and we certainly can't say that they have democracy now, so you're implying 5 years at the very least.

That's without expecting 'basic human rights'. I think maybe you have to lower your expectations.

(If you don't want to put a timeframe on it, then maybe a body count to the nearest 100).
banned#35
phatboy123

The people we are fighting can steal equipment, break laws, bypass bureaucracy and generally do what they want.

at the drop of a hat..... they can drop arms and become "civilians" who we are to protect.

It's all very wasteful and arguably idiotic.


Good point. We're not fighting on an equal footing. They're guerilla fighters whilst we're trying to stick to international law.

Again, those who are ignorant of history are doomed to repeat it.
[mod]#36
What sort of primative creature got us into this mess...............oh hang on..........

http://totallylookslike.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/9george-bush.jpg
#37
Shouldnt be there in the first place.

LMAO at the picture and to think people were still supporting him in america.
#38
Out of curiosity what's the pay like for serving in the army?
#39
FilthAndFurry;6778827
Good point. We're not fighting on an equal footing. They're guerilla fighters whilst we're trying to stick to international law.

Again, those who are ignorant of history are doomed to repeat it.


indeed like the great Spaniard George Santayana said

Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.
#40
FilthAndFurry
Can you put a realistic timeframe on that? Next election isn't going to be for a few years and we certainly can't say that they have democracy now, so you're implying 5 years at the very least.

That's without expecting 'basic human rights'. I think maybe you have to lower your expectations.

(If you don't want to put a timeframe on it, then maybe a body count to the nearest 100).


No, I can't, I am not in a position to do that and I would not use the limited information that a member of the public has to make such a decision. That would be inherently flawed.

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