How can people be so cruel ? - HotUKDeals
We use cookie files to improve site functionality and personalisation. By continuing to use HUKD, you accept our cookie and privacy policy.
Get the HUKD app free at Google Play

Search Error

An error occurred when searching, please try again!

Login / Sign UpSubmit

How can people be so cruel ?

snowtiger Avatar
8y, 7m agoPosted 8 years, 7 months ago
Charity Offer Reward For Pigeon Sniper

A £1,000 reward is being offered after several pigeons were spotted with metal darts impaled through their heads.

One of the injured pigeonsThe darts were apparently fired from a blow gun, lodging directly behind the birds' eyes without penetrating their brains.

Animal rights charity Peta is offering the reward for information that may lead them to the person responsible in the US city of Seattle.

It says the darts make the birds very susceptible to painful infections and could lead to further injury.

As pigeons often gather closely together, other birds can also be blinded by the protruding points.

The injured pigeons have avoided capture by rescuers because they are still mobile and able to fly.

"Animal abusers are cowards," says Peta manager Martin Mersereau.

"They take their issues out on the most defenceless beings available to them.
snowtiger Avatar
8y, 7m agoPosted 8 years, 7 months ago
Options

All Comments

(58) Jump to unreadPost a comment
Comments/page:
Page:
#1
Who in their right mind could do this ? It's so very sad .....

[CENTER]http://static.sky.com/images/pictures/1673783.jpg[/CENTER]


Until the authorities step up and do what is necessary, this will continue to happen and the cruelty will get worse. Upon capture, what will the so called sniper get - our equivalent of an asbo which they will probably think is cool telling their mates. The authorities need to step up and hit them where it hurts. Heavy fine and custodial sentence. Animal cruelty is animal cruelty regardless of the type of animal.
#2
Nobody in their right mind is doing it.......Monsters :x
banned#3
cruel

just kill them all humanely instead

their vermin
#4
alternatively, the culprits could have a metal dart fired through their heads

i kinda have an 'eye for an eye' view on punishment
#5
I got as far as PETA and stopped reading.
#6
Shengis;1992365
I got as far as PETA and stopped reading.

We're talking here about the cruelty of the animal/bird not why or who is offering a reward !
#7
Bet it's kids, they don't always seem to be wired to recognise right from wrong....I used to try and shoot pigeons and crows with an air rifle until I learnt some humanity...I wouldn't have said I was a bad kid, just a little morally loose as it were....those loose morals changed in my teens!
#8
snowtiger
We're talking here about the cruelty of the animal/bird not why or who is offering a reward !


Cheap advertising. PETA do it all the time. There's nothing to debate on the cruelty front, it's wrong, but try putting peta and kill into google and you'll understand my hatred for this bunch of nazi's:thumbsup: Actually scrub that, i've got more respect for nazi's.
banned#9
blame the parents!

its not just these though, how often has some little **** done it too cats & dogs etc
#10
Shengis;1992428
Cheap advertising. PETA do it all the time. There's nothing to debate on the cruelty front, it's wrong, but try putting peta and kill into google and you'll understand my hatred for this bunch of nazi's:thumbsup: Actually scrub that, i've got more respect for nazi's.

Don't mean to be rude Shengis but the fact is these birds are getting injured & killed, ok maybe in your opinion PETA are jumping on the wagon for publicity but this doesn't change the fact that this IS happening ... I for one have never heard of PETA before now & probably wouldn't of thought no more of them if you hadn't high-lighted their name ! There is plenty to debate on the cruelty front & I'm not just taking about birds either.
#11
I don't take it as rude st ;-) Like I said, as far as cruelty goes, there is no debate. It's wrong, end of. It just gets my back up when PETA come out all saintly on these things when they have healthy animals PTS every day. So much for 'animal rights'.

OT but on the subject of pigeons though, ODB is right, they're manky vermin. Check google for the diseases they spread. (having said that, I do like pigeons, being a manky vermin myself and all.... :lol:).
#12
YEAH who in there right mind could do this


i mean want to put this fntastic person in prison for getting rid of these annoying flapping pest carrying rodents. go on m8! snipe one for me ;-) ( sorry i hate these things an i feel they get everything they get)
#13
jackt010;1992600
YEAH who in there right mind could do this


i mean want to put this fntastic person in prison for getting rid of these annoying flapping pest carrying rodents. go on m8! snipe one for me ;-) ( sorry i hate these things an i feel they get everything they get)

NO COMMENT :x AS I DON'T WANT TO BE BANNED
#14
I'm with Shengis on this one.
The only people who are worth listening to when it comes to Animal issues are Vegans that run Animal Sanctuaries.

I'm also not sure I believe anyone is THAT accurate with any sort of weapon at a distance ??

Where's the link to the article snowtiger please. :)
#15
yeah you would have to be a pretty good shot to miss the brain and eye! plus PETA are well known for over exaggerating animal injuries and have been accused of actually putting animals into contraptions for a photo opportunity.

I'm against animal cruelty but i cant believe anything PETA say, they are nearly as bad as the ALF
#16
hottoshop;1992656
I'm with Shengis on this one.
The only people who are worth listening to when it comes to Animal issues are Vegans that run Animal Sanctuaries.

I'm also not sure I believe anyone is THAT accurate with any sort of weapon at a distance ??

Where's the link to the article snowtiger please. :)

SKY NEWS

Words can't describe the mentality of this person. The level of intelligence is such that they probably can't even hold a conversation or interact with other human beings therefore they impose on those less able - in this case - a pigeon. Outstanding - well done - proud? you should be - you're a total waste of space. Simple solution - harsher penalites for idiots such as this. Or even better, see how they cope with a dart between the eyes... please let me have the first shot!

Posted by Eve Ryan from London
#17
Thanks ST I traced the original article to here:
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2004379860_pigeons29m.html

Still find it hard to believe these "darts" were fired. More like they were inserted manually which makes it even worse in my opinion.
#18
snowtiger
Words can't describe the mentality of this person. The level of intelligence is such that they probably can't even hold a conversation or interact with other human beings therefore they impose on those less able - in this case - a pigeon. Outstanding - well done - proud? you should be - you're a total waste of space. Simple solution - harsher penalites for idiots such as this. Or even better, see how they cope with a dart between the eyes... please let me have the first shot!


So from that quote, do we now advocate the torture of retards? If you agree the person doing this is mentally deficient, then obviously they can't be held fully accountable for their actions. So by giving 'just punishment' are we better than them, being of sound mind?
#19
Shengis;1992808
So from that quote, do we now advocate the torture of retards? If you agree the person doing this is mentally deficient, then obviously they can't be held fully accountable for their actions. So by giving 'just punishment' are we better than them, being of sound mind?

I think it all boils down to this ... anyone who deliberately causes unnecessary pain & suffering to an animal for their own sick satisfaction or amusement (yes even vermin as there are plenty of other more humane ways to reduce their population ) deserves to be severely 'punished' or depending on the person & reasons for commiting such an ugly act rehabilitated for their actions. It isn't a case of 'being better' than them just being more empathatic towards animals.
#20
it is sad people do this to animals, however if it was rats that were found instead of pigeons would it stir up such a resonse. unlikely.
working in pest control im aware that ferol pigeons actually carry more diseases that can be transfered to humans than sewer rats carry.
i prefer just to shoot them with a .22 myself.
#21
In GTA IV hidden packages are replaced by shooting pigeons, ac coincidence?
#22
yea your right, lets attribute violence in video games to all real life problems.

ban all forms of video games!! the devils toys!!

we never had violence before the introduction of the ZX81 !!
#23
3 words:

It's A Pidgeon.
#24
Mclovin
3 words:

It's A Pidgeon.


Strange, I always used to spell pigeon like that, in fact for more years than I care to remember !!
What age group are you Mclovin if you dont mind me asking
under 25
25 to 50
over 50 ?
#25
under 25 althought cant see why that matters.
#26
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Damn dirty pigeons... we should be using that £1000 to pay people to do this! lol
#27
dcx_badass
Shame it's not cats.

Yeah why is everyone spelling pidgeon wrong?


amen to the cats
#28
dcx_badass
Shame it's not cats.

Yeah why is everyone spelling pidgeon wrong?


I don't know... why have u spelt pigeon wrong?
#29
http://liveandbeyond.com/wp-content/uploads/pigeon.jpg
Damn lazy pigeon!
#30
gav989
alternatively, the culprits could have a metal dart fired through their heads

i kinda have an 'eye for an eye' view on punishment


yeah gotta agree with that. Can't do the time don't do the crime.
#31
Mclovin
under 25 althought cant see why that matters.


Sorry McLovin it wasn't a personal thing I was just interested as I had read an article recently about popular misspellings and where they had originated from.
The article inferred that a lot of misspelt words were actually taught at school and I wondered whether you were in the same age group as I. (You aren't, lucky you !)

Pidgeon is a very popular misspelling so it must have come from somewhere , indeed it is also used as a surname spelling in many instances.

So there we have it, an innocent request and apologies if I offended, wasn't meant to .
I'll go now before my anorak slips :oops:

Peace :)
#32
Abvance
In GTA IV hidden packages are replaced by shooting pigeons, ac coincidence?


Given that this happened before the release of GTA IV, one can only conclude that real life is influencing computer games. So for the sake of our kids - ban real life!!!!!!111!!1 :w00t:
#33
nightswimmer
Given that this happened before the release of GTA IV, one can only conclude that real life is influencing computer games. So for the sake of our kids - ban real life!!!!!!111!!1 :w00t:


lol ! Now there's a debate ! Morning nightswimmer, nice to see your username !! :thumbsup:
#34
hottoshop
lol ! Now there's a debate ! Morning nightswimmer, nice to see your username !! :thumbsup:


Morning hts, good to see you too. :)

I take it you are not a fan of GTA? ;-)
#35
I wouldn't have a problem with GTA or any other "game" in that genre providing they were marketed and played by the correct audience.

I do have a problem with the fact that the content is in my opinion so wrong for the kids that end up playing it. I'm afraid I subscribe to the view that these type of games DO influence young minds and I think there are just too many parents who give in to pressure and let their kids have the game.

I can understand the pressure parents have but I really don't think society understands or even has the full facts to realise what these type of games are doing to our youngsters.
The general view appears to be it wont happen to my kid, my kid understads it's just a game, my kid is intelligent enough etc etc and hopefully that will be the case.
In my case though i wouldn't dare risk it. It's too near to real life and it sets all sorts of alarm bells ringing to me.

Trouble is I abhor censorship and this subject has intrigued me for a long time. It's a real wrestle with my consience job but I can't agree it's right to subject kids to the sort of content in GTA4 and others of this genre.

The avatar was just meant to get peoples minds working. If it has done that to just one parent it will have been worth it IMO.

God that reads so wrong , so snobby, it's not meant to and I'm sure you understand what I mean nightswimmer :)

I'm wilting !!
#36
hottoshop
I wouldn't have a problem with GTA or any other "game" in that genre providing they were marketed and played by the correct audience.


I'm not sure about marketing. As far as I can tell Rockstar haven't really marketed it at a younger audience. There is a total misperception in the media that computer games are just for kids though. Games have been in popular culture for almost 30 years and the average age of a computer gamer is in their mid to late 20s, yet according to the meeja only young kids or teenagers play them.

I do have a problem with the fact that the content is in my opinion so wrong for the kids that end up playing it. I'm afraid I subscribe ot the view that these type of games DO influence young minds and I think there are just too many parents who give in to pressure and let their kids have the game.


The trouble is, the knee jerk reaction is always to ban the games. It's never to get the parents to stop the kids from playing the games. If I release a book that contains graphic violence and sex, you never see uproar in the press, yet a kid can get that easier than they can an 18 rated computer game. If you see an film has an 18 certificate, you know not to show it to kids. I just wish computer games could be seen in the same light.

Trouble is I abhor censorship and this subject has intrigued me for a long time. It's a real wrestle with my consience job but I can't agree it's right to subject kids to the sort of content in GTA4 and others of this genre.


I agree. I don't think it is right that kids should play these games, but IMHO the answer has to lie in education and getting adults to take responsibility for what they allow their kids to do/see, rather than any form of censorship.

God that reads so wrong , so snobby, it's not meant to and I'm sure you understand what I mean nightswimmer :)


hehehe, yeah I understand what you mean. It is good to get people to think about these things. :)

I'm wilting !!


:w00t:
#37
Well balanced reply and I respect and understand what you write. My comments are made through personal involvement and experience so that's all I can go on.

You will have I'm sure realised that I am of the older generation, way to old in some peoples opinion to be commenting on video games but for one reason or another I have had an active interest for a long time. I have also been lucky enough to be in a family environment with a young lad for the past 12 years so have followed closely the evolution of gaming.

I remember what an innovation Sonic was and how much fun that game produced and then the fantastic Mario games and onwards to Zelda etc etc. I was so taken with Zelda Ocarina of Time on the N64 and to this day I think that game changed the whole face of gaming. As you say it became OK for "older" people to play video games.

The thing that has concerned me though is that as technology advances and games get more and more lifelike they also get more and more violent and constantly push the boundaries of good taste. I don't really have a problem with that as long as we understand as a society what it does to the potential audiences.

Just seems to me that the line between fact and fiction is getting closer and to young minds I honestly think that's a problem. I remember watching some young lads playing a WWF game and afterwards practising some of the moves on each other. Harmless fun ? Well yes until you looked a bit more closely at the game footage and see it involves stamping on peoples heads, kicking them between the legs etc etc.

Lastly I'm sorry but I think these games are blatantly marketed and advertised to hook in the younger player. They are considered well cool, or wicked, or whatever the saying is this month and the kids no exactly when they are being released and what is in the game through the net, magazines etc.
They know they will be considered cool if they have the game and thats where the pressure on parents comes from.
As for parents, to be honest I don't think many of them understand properly what is in these games and realise that buying it is going to keep little Johhnny (or Jane) out of their hair for a good few hours !!

Cynical ? Maybe but I know it's happening, I have seen it first hand many many times.

I don't think they should be banned but I do think there should be tough penalties for selling or allowing under age children to play them. I also agree with you entirely that education of parents is the way forward, if only they would listen !!

Now I'm definitely going to get my head down for an hour or so, lol

regards Nightswimmer nice to debate with you :)
#38
hottoshop
The thing that has concerned me though is that as technology advances and games get more and more lifelike they also get more and more violent and constantly push the boundaries of good taste. I don't really have a problem with that as long as we understand as a society what it does to the potential audiences.


Whilst that is true, you could equally argue that games are becoming more and more diverse. With the advent of the Wii for example, you are getting a lot more family orientated type of games that now also involve a level of physicalty. There are countless puzzle and strategy games. There are your Rockstar/Singstar type games, etc. And lets not forget the most popular game of all time The Sims, which is the computer equivalent of playing with dolls.

As for games becoming more lifelike, whilst that is true, I am not sure what actual impact that has. :thinking: For example, when I first played Doom, I thought the graphics were very realistic. I remember one magazine at the time calling them photorealistic, and in our imaginations they were that real. However if you look at Doom now, you would laugh at the thought of anyone finding it in the least bit realistic. It's all pixelated dots compared to computer games of today. The same will hold true when we look at today's games 5 or 10 years down the line. The point is though, is that at each point in time, our *perception* was that those images were real, so if that perception doesn't change, does the improvement in graphics/realism actually have much baring on any effect the game may be having on our psyches?

Just seems to me that the line between fact and fiction is getting closer and to young minds I honestly think that's a problem. I remember watching some young lads playing a WWF game and afterwards practising some of the moves on each other. Harmless fun ? Well yes until you looked a bit more closely at the game footage and see it involves stamping on peoples heads, kicking them between the legs etc etc.


Hasn't that always been the same though, it's just that the medium has changed? For example, back when I was at school we would copy exactly those same moves from World of Sport Wrestling. Or we would have play fights based on the Cowboy and Indian films we'd seen at the weekend, etc.

Lastly I'm sorry but I think these games are blatantly marketed and advertised to hook in the younger player. They are considered well cool, or wicked, or whatever the saying is this month and the kids no exactly when they are being released and what is in the game through the net, magazines etc.
They know they will be considered cool if they have the game and thats where the pressure on parents comes from.


I would argue that this is as a result of societal changes rather than specific marketing though. Gone are the days when 'cool' and 'trendy' was restricted to teenagers, and once you became an adult you worked and no longer did/had such frivolous things. Now people in their 20s, 30s, 40s etc. also have 'cool' and 'trendy' things and want the latest products etc. So a game like GTA IV that's aimed at adults will inevitably get marketed on the Internet, in magazines, TV etc.

For example, if you look at the threads on here with people clammering to get the game on day one of it's release (i.e. the people most likely to have been influenced by all the marketing 'hype'), the vast majority are over 18.

That's not to say that younger people aren't affected by this either, especially as gone are the days when if an adult liked something it would automatically make it 'uncool' to the younger generation, but I think that's slightly different to saying that these games are being specifically marketed at young people.

I am not sure what you do about that though, apart from making it clear that computer games are a medium played by all ages and that some games just aren't suitable for children.

I always come back to the same thing though. Books and films can have titles aimed at all ages, or at younger ages, teenagers or adults, and no one has a problem with that, so why isn't the same true of computer games?

As for parents, to be honest I don't think many of them understand properly what is in these games and realise that buying it is going to keep little Johhnny (or Jane) out of their hair for a good few hours !!


This is a big problem with society today. I am not sure what you can do about it, and I do understand and sympathise with the pressure parents are under, but we have to learn that it is OK to say no and that young people are not entitled to have everything they want.

You wouldn't let a child go into a strange town by themselves, so why let them on the Internet by themselves? You wouldn't let your child watch an 18 movie, so why let them play an 18 computer game, etc.

I don't think they should be banned but I do think there should be tough penalties for selling or allowing under age children to play them.


Yep, I totally agree with that. :)

Not sure how much sense this made :o, but as you say it's been nice debating with you hts. And don't worry, you're talking to someone who thinks you're never too old to play computer games. ;-)
#39
nightswimmer
Whilst that is true, you could equally argue that games are becoming more and more diverse. With the advent of the Wii for example, you are getting a lot more family orientated type of games that now also involve a level of physicalty. There are countless puzzle and strategy games. There are your Rockstar/Singstar type games, etc. And lets not forget the most popular game of all time The Sims, which is the computer equivalent of playing with dolls.


[COLOR="Blue"]Totally agree with that. Nintendo have always been willing to gamble with the future of gaming and again they have struck gold. The DS and the Wii will I believe go down in history as changing peoples total perception of gaming. People who would not have dreamt of picking up a hand held console or a controller are now doing so with ease and delight.[/COLOR]
[COLOR="blue"]Extremely clever stuff from Nintendo even though the technology kind of took a step back or at least a side step. The whole marketing side of things has been pure genius[/COLOR].

As for games becoming more lifelike, whilst that is true, I am not sure what actual impact that has. :thinking: For example, when I first played Doom, I thought the graphics were very realistic. I remember one magazine at the time calling them photorealistic, and in our imaginations they were that real. However if you look at Doom now, you would laugh at the thought of anyone finding it in the least bit realistic. It's all pixelated dots compared to computer games of today. The same will hold true when we look at today's games 5 or 10 years down the line. The point is though, is that at each point in time, our *perception* was that those images were real, so if that perception doesn't change, does the improvement in graphics/realism actually have much baring on any effect the game may be having on our psyches?


[COLOR="blue"]I'll go along with all of that but remember my grumble is about the young and very young having access to one type of genre/game. All good games suck you in to the plot, even going back to the likes of Space Invaders and Asteroids inevitably you are the hero of the hour, beating the "baddies" and making the World/Universe a safer place.
The likes of GTA4 though are different, they blur the edges between bad and good and make things like stealing cars, blowing people away, drug deals and the like a little bit too "cool" for my liking.
Like i say I have little problem with the correct age groups accessing them, if they don't know the difference between right and wrong then it's too late anyway :w00t[/COLOR]:

Hasn't that always been the same though, it's just that the medium has changed? For example, back when I was at school we would copy exactly those same moves from World of Sport Wrestling. Or we would have play fights based on the Cowboy and Indian films we'd seen at the weekend, etc
.

[COLOR="blue"]To a point yes but the worst I remember was the likes of Mick McManus using a clenched fist or similar. I certainly don't remember anyone stamping on heads and kicking people in the groin area and goodness knows what other "special" moves there are nowadays :w00t:[/COLOR]

I would argue that this is as a result of societal changes rather than specific marketing though. Gone are the days when 'cool' and 'trendy' was restricted to teenagers, and once you became an adult you worked and no longer did/had such frivolous things. Now people in their 20s, 30s, 40s etc. also have 'cool' and 'trendy' things and want the latest products etc. So a game like GTA IV that's aimed at adults will inevitably get marketed on the Internet, in magazines, TV etc.

For example, if you look at the threads on here with people clammering to get the game on day one of it's release (i.e. the people most likely to have been influenced by all the marketing 'hype'), the vast majority are over 18.

That's not to say that younger people aren't affected by this either, especially as gone are the days when if an adult liked something it would automatically make it 'uncool' to the younger generation, but I think that's slightly different to saying that these games are being specifically marketed at young people.

I am not sure what you do about that though, apart from making it clear that computer games are a medium played by all ages and that some games just aren't suitable for children.

I always come back to the same thing though. Books and films can have titles aimed at all ages, or at younger ages, teenagers or adults, and no one has a problem with that, so why isn't the same true of computer games?


I[COLOR="blue"] think it is important to realise that times have changed so dramatically and so quickly it is difficult for parents to keep up. They give their kids TV's and Laptops and Games Consoles which invariably end up in the kids bedrooms. Kids arent silly they know the way round parental controls etc etc and in the main they aren't even interested in the things that parents are worried about, ie porn etc.
They are more interested in accessing what is going to make them look good to their peers and the advertisers and games manafacturers know this. Look around the net and see where these games are advertised and how. There are other subtle ways that advertisers get through to their targets.[/COLOR]
This is a big problem with society today. I am not sure what you can do about it, and I do understand and sympathise with the pressure parents are under, but we have to learn that it is OK to say no and that young people are not entitled to have everything they want.

You wouldn't let a child go into a strange town by themselves, so why let them on the Internet by themselves? You wouldn't let your child watch an 18 movie, so why let them play an 18 computer game, etc
.

[COLOR="Blue"]I wouldn't let a child watch an 18 movie but I fear there are just too many who would. In any case nowadays they only have to tur the telly on and see as bad and sometimes even befire the watershed.

To be honest I don't think there is an easy answer and not just one answer either[/COLOR].
#40
hottoshop
Extremely clever stuff from Nintendo even though the technology kind of took a step back or at least a side step. The whole marketing side of things has been pure genius


Yeah, they really found a different market with both the DS and the Wii. It's probably a good job because there was no way they could compete head to head with Sony and Microsoft on the main battlefield. Like you say, I think they will go down in history as a major changing point in how we interact with and think of games.

The likes of GTA4 though are different, they blur the edges between bad and good and make things like stealing cars, blowing people away, drug deals and the like a little bit too "cool" for my liking.


I can see what you are saying, but to me this is just a modern way of telling a story about an anti-hero. A device that has been used in literature throughout history. So like you, I personally don't have a problem with it as long as it isn't played by those who shouldn't be playing it.

I think it is important to realise that times have changed so dramatically and so quickly it is difficult for parents to keep up. They give their kids TV's and Laptops and Games Consoles which invariably end up in the kids bedrooms. Kids arent silly they know the way round parental controls etc etc and in the main they aren't even interested in the things that parents are worried about, ie porn etc.


I think that's a bit of a cop out though (not by you, by society :) ). If parents don't know how to use these things, or what they contain, then they shouldn't be giving the kids them until they get further advice/guidance. And they definitely should not be allowed in the bedroom.

They are more interested in accessing what is going to make them look good to their peers and the advertisers and games manafacturers know this. Look around the net and see where these games are advertised and how. There are other subtle ways that advertisers get through to their targets.

The only place I have seen GTA IV advertised is on gaming related websites. The only time I have seen it advertised on TV is passed the watershed. I'm not quite sure what more they are meant to do other than not advertise the game? :thinking:


To be honest I don't think there is an easy answer and not just one answer either.


That's the problem, there isn't an easy answer. I think we are pretty much in agreement about most of this hts. :) Having played computer games for getting on for nearly 30 years now, I must admit I get a little defensive when people start calling for a ban on computer games, or saying that they are bad for kids (I know you didn't :) ), rather than looking at the bigger picture or being prepared to take responsibility for their own actions (or lack of action). However I do strongly agree that certain games should only be played by those people over certain ages - it's just how do we get that to happen? :?

Post a Comment

You don't need an account to leave a comment. Just enter your email address. We'll keep it private.

...OR log in with your social account

...OR comment using your social account

Thanks for your comment! Keep it up!
We just need to have a quick look and it will be live soon.
The community is happy to hear your opinion! Keep contributing!