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Little work related advise

stefromuk Avatar
5y, 10m agoPosted 5 years, 10 months ago
Hi.
After a little advise for my wife.
she's worked as a Occupational therapist for 2 years now for the NHS and about 2 months ago she had a accident where a old lady fell on her and it really hurt her back.
She filled in all the relevant accident reports at the time and carried on working but her pain was getting worse an worse.
She eventually got put on light duties,but it got worse again so eventually went for a MRI scan which found she had 3 Herniated disc's and as she has had 6 weeks of therapy with no results it was decided a operation was needed and is waiting a appointment date think maybe late march.
She went on sick leave on the last week of December as she could no longer do the job.
But in the middle of january she received a letter from her manager saying she has had 4 incidences of sickness and is now going down the route of dismissal due to ill health.
2 of these incidences were due to this injury and another was when she had a bad cold but went in work but she got sent home by the nurse.
She went for a meeting last week to discuss it and her manager had not even mentioned the the woman from HR anything about this accident and is suggesting the back problem happened elsewhere.
Ive looked into on google and from what i can make out the are allowed to dismiss her for ill health but the guidelines suggest showing compassion,which i think should be shown seen as it happened at work.
She has looked into the union but it seems like we cant afford to join it to seek advise.
She is also going to the CAB tomorrow to ask them there advise,
Just want to know if anyone on here may know where she stands on the subject,she does want to work an hates being on sick but the manager says there are NO light duties ,but has offered light duties to other staff.
Its not a issue about the money its just i dont want her to lose the job she enjoys doing for having a accident at work (which by the way was risk accessed wrongly)
Cheers
stefromuk Avatar
5y, 10m agoPosted 5 years, 10 months ago
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#1
Try ACAS the advisory/conciliation service - they're really helpful with job related problems - they'll not only give you advice but will often step in and help if they can - CLICK HERE FOR THEIR WEBSITE
#2
have you had an accident in your workplace? soiunds pretty unreasonable to start dissmissal due to a work related injury, surely the union provide free advice on the situation, if all else go american on there ass an sue :P

thats my uneducated opinion

Edited By: joeprosho on Feb 07, 2011 20:21
#3
i would let them dismiss me,then i would have the op take the opropriate recovery time and when im near better i would seek leagal advice,then i would take them to court for unfair dismissle,then fingers crossed u get an out of court settlement then find an employer who might care just alittle
1 Like #4
If she's filled out the accident report form, surely that provided evidence of the incident that caused her work related illness?

Did she follow the guidance on the patient specific risk assessment regarding manual handling - i.e. if the patient required two people to move her instead of one?
#5
chillyyyy
i would let them dismiss me,then i would have the op take the opropriate recovery time and when im near better i would seek leagal advice,then i would take them to court for unfair dismissle,then fingers crossed u get an out of court settlement then find an employer who might care just alittle


Yeah, good luck with getting further employment in the NHS after you've sued a Trust.
#6
there are other organisations other than the nhs
moob
chillyyyy
i would let them dismiss me,then i would have the op take the opropriate recovery time and when im near better i would seek leagal advice,then i would take them to court for unfair dismissle,then fingers crossed u get an out of court settlement then find an employer who might care just alittle
Yeah, good luck with getting further employment in the NHS after you've sued a Trust.
#7
sorry forgot to add your main concern is to get ur wife bettre,think about all the above after,hope shes on the mend soon,
1 Like #8
She went for a meeting last week to discuss it and her manager had not even mentioned the the woman from HR anything about this accident and is suggesting the back problem happened elsewhere.


When your wife filled out the accident report form did she also get a copy? or was it just reported to management? any accident at work should be forwarded to HR.
2 Likes #9
You can use the Unions even if you are not a member for something serious like this. You can have legal or work colleagues to represent you in all meetings.

Its a difficult situation as in the NHS all members of staff have manual handling training yearly. If a patient is to fall they should not be caught but lowered to the floor and the comment about it being risk assessed wrongly is inconsistent as the OT's are constantly risk assessing the patient, that is their job!

I would strongly recomend she check through the hospitals policies as I know where I work if you have more than 3 sickness you have a disciplinary meeting, but they can't fire you, the meeting is purely to discuss where to go from that point. Maybe there has been a misunderstanding in communication.

The first steps I would suggest are 1) call occupational health and discuss with them. 2) speak to HR. 3) speak to hospital matron or manager 4) contact Union and see if they can help.
#10
chillyyyy
there are other organisations other than the nhs
moob
chillyyyy
i would let them dismiss me,then i would have the op take the opropriate recovery time and when im near better i would seek leagal advice,then i would take them to court for unfair dismissle,then fingers crossed u get an out of court settlement then find an employer who might care just alittle
Yeah, good luck with getting further employment in the NHS after you've sued a Trust.


Or course, however, they are by far the main employer for this vocation, thereby narrowing your opportunities somewhat, no?

Let's not discount the fact that you're jumping the gun advocating suing someone when an amicable agreement can still be reached which would mean a better outcome for all.
#11
do you really think that the nhs will settle this amicably,im not so sure,they,re trying to dismiss this woman who was only doing her duties,i dont see them as being compaasoniate and understanding her needs and illnesses,if they were they would of sat her down and told her to take as much time off as she needs to recover,then this person wouldnt be voicing his concerns for his wife
3 Likes #12
HI
If you want to private message me I can give you my email address and could have a chat.I am a Nurse in NHS and have had similar experience since being assaulted. Maybe we can help each other out!
Gem x
2 Likes #13
chillyyyy
do you really think that the nhs will settle this amicably,im not so sure,they,re trying to dismiss this woman who was only doing her duties,i dont see them as being compaasoniate and understanding her needs and illnesses,if they were they would of sat her down and told her to take as much time off as she needs to recover,then this person wouldnt be voicing his concerns for his wife

In the NHS you are a number...nothing else
#14
chillyyyy
do you really think that the nhs will settle this amicably,im not so sure,they,re trying to dismiss this woman who was only doing her duties,i dont see them as being compaasoniate and understanding her needs and illnesses,if they were they would of sat her down and told her to take as much time off as she needs to recover,then this person wouldnt be voicing his concerns for his wife


How about the fact you have been presented with one side of the story here and have taken it as being 100% depiction of events thus far? You are relying on that information being correct then stating the only way forward is for litigation.

You really haven't thought this through at all.
#15
this is true for many organisations,not just the nhs,just hate the thought of this person being left to just get on with it,no job, awaiting an op sounds really unfair to me
gemmyw
chillyyyy
do you really think that the nhs will settle this amicably,im not so sure,they,re trying to dismiss this woman who was only doing her duties,i dont see them as being compaasoniate and understanding her needs and illnesses,if they were they would of sat her down and told her to take as much time off as she needs to recover,then this person wouldnt be voicing his concerns for his wife
In the NHS you are a number...nothing else
banned 1 Like #16
moob
How about the fact you have been presented with one side of the story here and have taken it as being 100% depiction of events thus far? You are relying on that information being correct then stating the only way forward is for litigation.You really haven't thought this through at all.

I read it as litigation was only suggested after OP's wife gets dismissed.

Edited By: slamdunkin on Feb 07, 2011 21:11
#17
maybe i havent and your proberbly are so right,i have worked in the nhs be it only as a porter and i do understand how they can treat certain people within that organisation,they are a law unto themselfs,and when they want you gone your gone,they can be so ruthluss
moob
chillyyyy
do you really think that the nhs will settle this amicably,im not so sure,they,re trying to dismiss this woman who was only doing her duties,i dont see them as being compaasoniate and understanding her needs and illnesses,if they were they would of sat her down and told her to take as much time off as she needs to recover,then this person wouldnt be voicing his concerns for his wife
How about the fact you have been presented with one side of the story here and have taken it as being 100% depiction of events thus far? You are relying on that information being correct then stating the only way forward is for litigation.You really haven't thought this through at all.
#18
slamdunkin
moob
How about the fact you have been presented with one side of the story here and have taken it as being 100% depiction of events thus far? You are relying on that information being correct then stating the only way forward is for litigation.You really haven't thought this through at all.


I read it as litigation was only suggested after OP's wife gets dismissed.


No.

He suggested he allow his wife to get fired and then take litigation. That's kinda different.
#19
chillyyyy
maybe i havent and your proberbly are so right,i have worked in the nhs be it only as a porter and i do understand how they can treat certain people within that organisation,they are a law unto themselfs,and when they want you gone your gone,they can be so ruthluss
moob
chillyyyy
do you really think that the nhs will settle this amicably,im not so sure,they,re trying to dismiss this woman who was only doing her duties,i dont see them as being compaasoniate and understanding her needs and illnesses,if they were they would of sat her down and told her to take as much time off as she needs to recover,then this person wouldnt be voicing his concerns for his wife
How about the fact you have been presented with one side of the story here and have taken it as being 100% depiction of events thus far? You are relying on that information being correct then stating the only way forward is for litigation.You really haven't thought this through at all.


I've worked for them as well, for 10 years.

Bottom line is that they are an employer and must have a legal team that understands employment law, should they breach that they leave themselves open to litigation which can be costly and embarrassing.
banned#20
Do you mean he allows his wife to be wrongfully dismissed and then sue.
#21
Hi
Thanks for all the replies.

Shellywelly
If a patient is to fall they should not be caught but lowered to the floor and the comment about it being risk assessed wrongly is inconsistent as the OT's are constantly risk assessing the patient, that is their job!

Yeah she did follow the guidelines for handling, what it is,the woman had been risk assesed that she was unable to go up steps on her own but it was NEVER documented in any of the wifes notes so she never knew and when on a home visit the woman fell backwards on the steps onto the wife and her colleague it hurt both there backs and got properly documented and the written documents sent to some office HR i think!
Her direct manager is saying even if it is a accident at work that will have to be taken up as a different matter and not related to this,and the woman from HR who was at the last meeting agreed with her.
She also spoke to the union rep who said they cant do much as shes not a member but the rep does feel the manager has gone about the procedure all the wrong way.
#22
slamdunkin
Do you mean he allows his wife to be wrongfully dismissed and then sue.


Well...what do you think?
#23
sounds to me they.ve made there minds up on this one,so dismissle is only a matter of time,the fact that there saying this accident happend somewhere else and by this calling this person a liar is so so wrong
banned#24
I think she should start a personal injury claim now. They would be very foolish to sack her while the claim was on-going.
#25
Get some proper advice ! See my first post - ACAS will have dealt with many similar problems and will advise exactly what you need to do, what documents you need, and your chances of an acceptable outcome.
#26
On to that right now
thanks vraptorchick
Oh my wifes just actually told me something apparently her sickness policy works on a rolling year not from jan-jan so if thats so shes not even had 4 incidences in that time

vraptorchick
Get some proper advice ! See my first post - ACAS will have dealt with many similar problems and will advise exactly what you need to do, what documents you need, and your chances of an acceptable outcome.
#27
good luck and do let us know how it all goes
stefromuk
On to that right now thanks vraptorchickOh my wifes just actually told me something apparently her sickness policy works on a rolling year not from jan-jan so if thats so shes not even had 4 incidences in that time
vraptorchick
Get some proper advice ! See my first post - ACAS will have dealt with many similar problems and will advise exactly what you need to do, what documents you need, and your chances of an acceptable outcome.
#28
Thanks chillyyy will do
#29
If you wife works in the NHS she should join UNISON. They cannot officially represent her on a matter that has already began when she becomes a member, however they may be able to give you advice and some unofficial help. Also if she does get through this she will need support in the future and I think after so many months they can represent her (she will need to check this info).

As for how to go forward your wife should make notes as best she can of what has occurred to date. Incuding as much detail as possible (dates, names, what was said, etc). She is also entitled to some kind of representation or help and if you cannot get somebody from an official body she should also be entitled to have somebody accompany her to the official meetings even a friend or family member (this is useful for keeping notes and maintaining moral. It can also make a manager think twice about how they are dealing with an issue when they see somebody across the room taking notes on what they are saying.)

She should get hold of a copy of the sickness, disciplinary, bullying and complaints procedure and should study them. Most managers do not understand them fully and if you start to quote at the approprate times they may back down.

Finally the bottom line is your wifes health issues were caused by an industrial injury that if what you say is true may have been caused by a lack of communication to her by her managers. She should maintain this view and express it at every opportunity to ensure that if the worst happens she may be entitled to enhanced compensation/ severance.
#30
moob
If she's filled out the accident report form, surely that provided evidence of the incident that caused her work related illness?Did she follow the guidance on the patient specific risk assessment regarding manual handling - i.e. if the patient required two people to move her instead of one?

^^^^^This^^^^^

Assuming everything you have said is correct, then there is documented evidence that the accident occurred whilst your wife was at work, regardless of what her manager says.

Also, again assuming that your wife followed the correct procedure, I would have thought that she may have a case for compensation for injuries suffered, regardless of whether she stays in the job or not.

One other thing - all of this, if true, would be very bad publicity for the NHS trust she works for. It might be worth her mentioning that to her manager. After all, no-one wants to work for an organisation that treats its' employees in this way, do they???
#31
Thanks plum an civms47 some great advise cheers ,going to look into it all myself its all getting on top of the wife cheers
#32
if you are unable to find the accident report, contact the lady who was involved in the fall.

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