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Medical Advice needed please

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guys my uncle passed away last week of an anerusym (thats what the hospital told my mum), anyways things are starting to not add up, heres the story, my mum got a phone call from his decorater to …
keli Avatar
7y, 11m agoPosted 7 years, 11 months ago
guys my uncle passed away last week of an anerusym (thats what the hospital told my mum), anyways things are starting to not add up, heres the story,

my mum got a phone call from his decorater to say he had gone out to put his tools in the van and when he came back in my uncle stan was on the floor by the time they got him to hospital he had passed away from this anerusym she then had to go up and collect his belongings

she was given his house keys and no wallet, (she thought this was strange as he had a wallet) thinking it may be in the house she thought not to much of it, well it wasnt nor was the small change in the jar that his neighbours say he used to have on the side.

Another relative went to see him in the chapel of rest yesterday and was talking today about his experience, saying my uncle had a gash about an inch long across his forehead one on his eyelid one underneath his eye his nose was gashed straight down and also he had a cut across his face below his cheek, and his knuckles and fingers where black and blue bruised like.
now i could be being paranoid and getting carried away but firstly i wonderd how can you detect an anerysm without an autopsy and secondly are these marks common in such a situation, i think i would of took this as a sad death had the few things not been missing.

i dont want to start making a big fuss about it but would hate it if anything bad had happend but i have to tread carefully as the last thing i want to do is start freaking my mum out and others for no reason (hope that made sense)
keli Avatar
7y, 11m agoPosted 7 years, 11 months ago
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#1
If he just keeled over its likely he hit his face on the floor
#2
not that i know to much about this but for things like brain anersyms i thought they alays did a autopsy
#3
Titchimp
If he just keeled over its likely he hit his face on the floor


see i agree with that but all those marks???
#4
First of all I'm really sorry to hear your bad news. I would have thought that the hospital should have been questioning the cuts and bruises. If it was me, I think I would be asking some more questions. However, this may just drag things out and make things worse for the rest of the family. Very difficult to know what is the right thing to do.
#5
japsapa
not that i know to much about this but for things like brain anersyms i thought they alays did a autopsy


thats partly my issue surely you cannot look at someone when they get into the hospital assess them they then die and you say oh anseruysm i thought been as he was fine earlier in the day they would of automatically done one, if he had had one then i wouldnt be making an issue as a full medical examination would of been evidential however he didnt have one
#6
tinkers
First of all I'm really sorry to hear your bad news. I would have thought that the hospital should have been questioning the cuts and bruises. If it was me, I think I would be asking some more questions. However, this may just drag things out and make things worse for the rest of the family. Very difficult to know what is the right thing to do.


thank you for your kind words x

i know i have already upset my mum slightly suggesting this, see the funeral is wednesday and he is being cremated i am not accusing anyone but would hate for me to have these suspicions and nothing to be confirmed i thought about pretending to be my mum on monday and phone the hospital questioning how they detected the cause of death and why they didnt do an autopsy
#7
I can't work this out.
You say a few things are missing and if it hadn't of been for that, then this would just be a sad death.
Are you saying the hospital nicked the stuff?
I would have thought that if anyone had nicked anything, it would be the decorator as no one else was there presumably to see him.
But then, perhaps it was the helpful neighbour who knew about the small change in the jar.

I really don't know 'cos I wasn't there, but it sounds like a sad death to me and you have my sympathies.
I should imagine the hospital deal with these types of cases all the time and would be pretty confident on what they say was the cause of death.
I very much doubt the hospital would go round robbing from the dead.
#8
japsapa
not that i know to much about this but for things like brain anersyms i thought they alays did a autopsy


They only do an autopsy if the circumstances indicate foul play, or the person is of a young age.

If you are concerned that items are amiss, i.e. the wallet then ask the appropriate people, the decorator, the hospital etc and suggest it to them that you may "log" it with the police. My money is on the decorator.
#9
Jumpingphil
I can't work this out.
You say a few things are missing and if it hadn't of been for that, then this would just be a sad death.
Are you saying the hospital nicked the stuff?
I would have thought that if anyone had nicked anything, it would be the decorator as no one else was there presumably to see him.
But then, perhaps it was the helpful neighbour who knew about the small change in the jar.



no the thought of the hospital taking the wallet never crossed my mind it was only the decorater that was with him but i dont want to accuse anyone apparently the jar was on the side by his telly seen by all and a few neighbours have said it, see i know these things can just happen and you dont know 8/10 you have an anerysm but he was fine an hour before as he was on a date (lol), i just dont know thats my thing i guess i have posted this post in hope of a miracle answer or just to get all horrible suspicions out my head
I really don't know 'cos I wasn't there, but it sounds like a sad death to me and you have my sympathies.
I should imagine the hospital deal with these types of cases all the time and would be pretty confident on what they say was the cause of death.
I very much doubt the hospital would go round robbing from the dead.
#10
StevenA2000_uk
They only do an autopsy if the circumstances indicate foul play, or the person is of a young age.


but my hubbies nana and grandad had one even though his grandad dies in hospital and his nana had viewable symptons i guess this is why i am questioning why my uncle didnt have one i thought if people just died you know there and then you had one automatically
1 Like #11
keli
but my hubbies nana and grandad had one even though his grandad dies in hospital and his nana had viewable symptons i guess this is why i am questioning why my uncle didnt have one i thought if people just died you know there and then you had one automatically


http://www.exploreforensics.co.uk/performing-an-autopsy.html

An autopsy was carried out on my brother because he was only 34 when he died, but one wasnt carried out on my father as he was 70 and was in hospital at the time he died.
#12
They will carry out a post mortem if they are suspicious at all. If they are concerned about the cuts and bruises then that will be looked in to. If you think the decorator had something to do with his passing or stole from him, that 's for the police to look in to. I doubt very much the hospital will tell you anything over the phone.
My sympathies are with you. Just remember the good times you shared.
#14
I'm no expert, but I think you are going through what a lot of people go through when they lose someone close.
We look for blame in other people and we accuse others of all sorts of things, including not doing enough to help.
There could be a simple explanation for everything and if you go accusing people of things and it turns out they were completely innocent, it would only end up upsetting a lot of people for no reason.
As hard as it may be, try and think better of the people and hope that they did all they could to help.
Once again sorry for your loss.
#15
Jumpingphil
I'm no expert, but I think you are going through what a lot of people go through when they lose someone close.
We look for blame in other people and we accuse others of all sorts of things, including not doing enough to help.
There could be a simple explanation for everything and if you go accusing people of things and it turns out they were completely innocent, it would only end up upsetting a lot of people for no reason.
As hard as it may be, try and think better of the people and hope that they did all they could to help.
Once again sorry for your loss.


+1

this is very true. especially when the person having these thoughts was not present and with the person when they passed away.

Truth is we all want to help loved ones as much as possible, and not being there when something as tragic as this happens, always will cause the mind to go into over-drive "what if" etc....

I'm not a big fan of sympathy but I do empathyse with you on what you are explaining. The brutal truth of the matter is that nothing that could be done now will ever bring that loved one back, no matter how insidious things may appear. All that will happen is self torture.

Times and efforts are better spent accepting the loss and mourning the loved one, and remembering them day-in-day-out. While they will never appear before you in person again, they will always appear in your thoughts whenever you want them to be there. :)
#16
I agree with the above post.
You could try contacting the hospital and sayingthat you have some unanswered questions. They will explain why they felt an autopsy was not appropriate. Perhaps they did a retrospective CT scan to detect or another non invasive test. This would be unusual but not entirely impossible.
I would try to not worry about the wallet and small change. Perhaps the decorator has taken it, maybe not. thats for their conscience. You will never find out and can only be upsetting to think about.
Hope you get over this sad loss soon.
#17
Check that his credit cards have been cancelled and there haven't been any transactions since he passed away. That should put your mind to rest.
#18
aw, so sorry for your loss. it is pretty bad if someone has stolen his possessions,taking advantage of the situation. i hope they are feeling guilty, whoever they are. the injuries sound like ones he would have got from the fall. wishing you luck if you take this further x
banned#19
if things are missing from his home then you should tell the police, they would do a little investigation and see if things were worth pursuing

sorry for your loss, its even worse when things like this wont let you mourn and start to move on
#20
i'm disappointed, i thought it was gonna be a bel-air post!
1 Like #21
I agree with Tinkerbell58. I was a theatre nurse before i had my little ones, and people came in who were fine one minute and the aneurysm just - for want of a better discription-'popped' and they suddnely went unconscious. You can have them in any blood vessel, but in older people then tend to be in the aorta which means as soon as they rupture the blood fills the abdomen rather than going where it should go-so they can become unconscious very quickly. This might explain the marks if he fell.

Regarding the post mortem i think the rules are to do with how recently he saw a doctor and what he is thought to have died of. It might be that although the family weren't aware, your Uncle had been diagnosed with an aneurysm-many people live with them-and it ruptured suddenly, so they knew the cause of death. Usually a scan would have told him if he had one -or an X Ray.

It is awful to think something might have been missed, and i really feel for you and your family. Maybe you could ask to speak to the A&E Consultant and they will check out his notes and what happened when he arrived at the unit? But you would need to emphasize you would like a fast response, and it would probably need to come from the next of kin.

Hope this helps.
#22
A matter to be reported to the Coroner's office or Procurator Fiscal if in Scotland, through local Police Force.
This sounds like a suspicious, unexpected, unexplained death with no history. I'd say, persuade next of kin to report it.
#23
StevenA2000_uk
They only do an autopsy if the circumstances indicate foul play, or the person is of a young age.

If you are concerned that items are amiss, i.e. the wallet then ask the appropriate people, the decorator, the hospital etc and suggest it to them that you may "log" it with the police. My money is on the decorator.


Autopsy is an American word, used on tv and in Hollywood movies.

In Scotland it' s called a Post-Mortem, this should reveal the cause of death.

Everyone who dies in Scotland receives a post-mortem, unless the GP is willing to grant a death certificate, so lots of medical history is needed to convince a doctor to do this, and even then they tend not to issue death certificates in order to cover their backs.

Following a sudden death a police officer will have to complete a report and summary of the circumstances of the death and history of the deceased.

The body is then taken by police to the police surgency, and a post-mortem carried out on behalf of the procurators fiscal. The pathologist will then issue the death certificate, stating cause/causes of death.

If you have any doubts regarding a sudden death, make the local police aware of them.
#24
The OP is clearly suspicious and the accompanying circumstances make it sound suspicious. The cause of death may well be as certified but given all the other circumstances, the family may wish to have the matter reconsidered.
#25
tinker, I think you'll find the posters have forensic knowledge rather than medical. I'm not clear if this is an aortic or cerebral aneurism and it's certainly not clear that there is a medical history of a related condition.
We'll respect your medical knowledge if you will just reread the OP.
A lot would depend on the post mortem bruising and injuries described. I am frankly surprised that the hospital felt able to issue a death certificate unless there is a lot of information they had that we or the OP do not know. Would normally be a full forensic PM to establish cause given an unwitnessed, unexpected, unexplained death with injuries/bruising especially with the suspicions about missing property. Blueness of hands is obviously common but bruising is described. I'm not trying to startle anyone but I do think the OP needs to be satisfied that everything is ok and a good starting point would be the NOK. If suspicions remain, report the circumstances. You may well be quite correct in what you assume but there is room for doubt.
1 Like #26
thanks guys for all your comments and help especially tinkerbell58 and lucerysmum, we are not aware of a medical history or diagnosis of anerusym but i appreciate these can go undetected and suddenly just happen, i think it was just the bruising and marks that worried me and then with the wallet and change missing i guess i jumped to conclusions
#27
tinkerbell28;4644589
Sorry for your loss.........xxxxFirstly if you are concerned you can phone the hospital and ask the how they confirmed it was aneurysm that caused the death. From a medical point of view......Many live with an aneurysm for a while living on a knife edge that is could go at anytime others don't even know they have a aneurysm and it's a very sudden onset. The older the patient and the health of the patient is the biggest factor in determining outcome. Unfortunately the older the patient the more likely they are to die initially. Either way an aneurysm can cause a very sudden death, which if he fell nastily would explain the marks. It does sound like it was a very sudden tragic death xxI know it's a shock but an aneurysm can be very sudden, one minute you can be fine, then the next minute you have passed. It's a shock and yes it can be that sudden sadly. The hospital have ways and means of confirming the cause of death, my experience is child branch, but I presume it's the same with adults. I will say no more, but wish you condolances.If stuff is missing from the house and you think the decorater may have taken it report it to the police.


No, you cannot phone the hospital and ask them questions about the death. They will not discuss that with you, in the same way they would not discuss your neighbours operation for piles. Health details are confidential and cannot be discussed like this.

If the family is concerned, next of kin can contact the hospital and ask for a meeting where these matters can be discussed and explained. GP may also have more information and may be willing to discuss this with next of kin. If next of kin does not want to, then unlikely you will get anywhere

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