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Some advice please - Mortgage & Separation

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My sister has been with her husband for around 4 years, the relationship has been tough due to his unreasonable behaviour and he has now turned nasty :( He has told her he is staying in the house a… Read More
LaoTzu Avatar
8y, 2w agoPosted 8 years, 2 weeks ago
My sister has been with her husband for around 4 years, the relationship has been tough due to his unreasonable behaviour and he has now turned nasty :(
He has told her he is staying in the house and demanded that she move out within the next few weeks and remove her name from the mortgage.
She is moving into a rented property and from next month she will be paying rent. He is planning to get his parents to take over her share of the mortgage if they get the ok from mortgage company - which we doubt will happen in this climate - and he is going to get a lodger. He wants her removed from the mortgage so that if in a few years time if the market goes up then she can't make him sell to get the equity - currently they have no equity and if they sell they would lose money.
I think my sister should contact the mortgage company NOW and let them know the situation as she will no longer live there and will have no financial interest in the property, get the process running ASAP. Other family members think she should wait til she has moved out.
I know everyone may feel that she is letting him dictate to her but seriously this guy is a psychopath and we really don't know what his next move may be, normally we would defend to the hilt but it is her wish to keep things cool.

There is obviously lots more detail to this story but I am mindful that if I put too much info, one you would get bored of reading and two he may be reading!!!!

I would appreciate if anyone knows the situation with regards the mortgage and what happens, if he can't get his parents to take over mortgage and can't get a lodger he WILL make her pay the mortgage even though he has effectively thrown her out.

HELP!!

Thanks in advance (rep given for sensible, helpful advice!!)
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LaoTzu Avatar
8y, 2w agoPosted 8 years, 2 weeks ago
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1 Like #1
Go see a solicitor asap,if shes not working she will get Legal Aid.
banned 1 Like #2
yes she should get to see the mortgage advisor immediately, whilst her name remains on the mortgage she is responsible for it whether she lives there or not

No children where mentioned so have assumed there arent any, it sounds like shes going to be well rid, and if the really isnt an collateral in the property its best she moves on asap
1 Like #3
As SS said, solicitor is the way to go 1st so she knows exactly where she stands
1 Like #4
Hi sweetie, sorry to hear about your sister's problems.

I understand she must feel scared of her partner and that is why she has agreed to move out but she mustnt let go of her rights too quickly.

Has she been to see a solicitor regarding arrangements with the home and drafting a LEGAL separation and then a divorce? She may also wish to think about apply for some kind of anti-molestation order to make sure her partner cannot come near her or harm her in any way. If he attempted to, the police who have to arrest him if such an order were in place.

In my opinion, the fairest way to separate would be to put the home up to be sold and the proceeds of the sale to be split equally between both of them.

She mustnt let him control her actions now. He is bullying her into having his own sense of security and not allowing her any at all.
#5
she does work and she has financially provided about 70% more than him
Everyone but me thinks she shouldn't involve solicitors, they think she should just walk away, I believe that if he is that psychotic he will get her financially and not let her come off the mortgage just to spite her and ruin her life. Arrrggggggghhhhhh :(
1 Like #6
ClarityofMind
Hi sweetie, sorry to hear about your sister's problems.

I understand she must feel scared of her partner and that is why she has agreed to move out but she mustnt let go of her rights too quickly.

Has she been to see a solicitor regarding arrangements with the home and drafting a LEGAL separation and then a divorce? She may also wish to think about apply for some kind of anti-molestation order to make sure her partner cannot come near her or harm her in any way. If he attempted to, the police who have to arrest him if such an order were in place.

In my opinion, the fairest way to separate would be to put the home up to be sold and the proceeds of the sale to be split equally between both of them.

She mustnt let him control her actions now. He is bullying her into having his own sense of security and not allowing her any at all.


That of course all changes if he really is psychotic. Safety comes first
1 Like #7
arson is your friend........



but seriously go see citizens advice asap

best to stay clear of any confrontation
#8
WoolyM
That of course all changes if he really is psychotic. Safety comes first


If she feels frightened in any way she can apply to the courts for them to protect her with an injunction. He wont be told that is what she is doing until after it is done and he is served with the papers.

Also if she has experienced violence at his hands she must keep evidence, visit the gp and have it recorded even if it is just bruises.
#9
ClarityofMind
Hi sweetie, sorry to hear about your sister's problems.

I understand she must feel scared of her partner and that is why she has agreed to move out but she mustnt let go of her rights too quickly.

Has she been to see a solicitor regarding arrangements with the home and drafting a LEGAL separation and then a divorce? She may also wish to think about apply for some kind of anti-molestation order to make sure her partner cannot come near her or harm her in any way. If he attempted to, the police who have to arrest him if such an order were in place.

In my opinion, the fairest way to separate would be to put the home up to be sold and the proceeds of the sale to be split equally between both of them.

She mustnt let him control her actions now. He is bullying her into having his own sense of security and not allowing her any at all.


Thanks for your words :)

These are all the things I feel, she is planning to take hardly anything so as not to upset him/make him angry. Their house is teetering on negative equity, if they actually manage to sell it, it will cost them in fees etc. etc. Money neither of them have. I used to work for a Women's Refuge so I understand so much about all this, I understand about anti-mol etc. the only thing is that it's just a bit of paper effectively, it would make no difference to him, he has already told her he would do time if he found out she was seeing someone cos he would kill.

She has let him control her and now she just wants to creep away and lose everything, I can kind of see what she means but I don't think it's right.
[mod] 1 Like #10
Get her to see a solicitor and ask them to see whether she is elegible for legal aid. They will have a keycard which will they will use to give her an answer over the telephone.

Family law is my least favourite so I really dont want to be giving any advice which could be misconstrued etc but I will say that it is vital that she does not agree to anything until she has received legal advice.

If you let me know which area your sister lives in I can give you some names of solicitors which are reputable and offer a free initial interview.

Good luck.
#11
ClarityofMind
If she feels frightened in any way she can apply to the courts for them to protect her with an injunction. He wont be told that is what she is doing until after it is done and he is served with the papers.

Also if she has experienced violence at his hands she must keep evidence, visit the gp and have it recorded even if it is just bruises.


no he is too clever for that, never physical, always emotional
#12
ClarityofMind
If she feels frightened in any way she can apply to the courts for them to protect her with an injunction. He wont be told that is what she is doing until after it is done and he is served with the papers.

Also if she has experienced violence at his hands she must keep evidence, visit the gp and have it recorded even if it is just bruises.


But if he is psychotic we could be talking about life threatening...........


Was typing when last post appeared....
#13
LaoTzu
Thanks for your words :)

These are all the things I feel, she is planning to take hardly anything so as not to upset him/make him angry. Their house is teetering on negative equity, if they actually manage to sell it, it will cost them in fees etc. etc. Money neither of them have. I used to work for a Women's Refuge so I understand so much about all this, I understand about anti-mol etc. the only thing is that it's just a bit of paper effectively, it would make no difference to him, he has already told her he would do time if he found out she was seeing someone cos he would kill.

She has let him control her and now she just wants to creep away and lose everything, I can kind of see what she means but I don't think it's right.


She obviously takes his threats seriously so she must take steps to ensure her own safety. She totally needs legal advice and help. I understand a piece of paper is just that, but once she has it she can make sure he cannot be around to harm her, if you see what I mean.

If he is going to be a danger to her then she must protect herself.
#14
LaoTzu, as much as you love her and as much advice as you or anybody gives her, she will at the end go the way she feels is best. Just support her whatever her decision.
#15
LaoTzu
no he is too clever for that, never physical, always emotional


If he is emotionally abusive then she needs must " cowboy up" and ride out the threats and manipulations to get what she needs to get out of the relationship sweetie. It doesn't change the fact that she needs legal advice.

Put this to her... he isn't going to know if she goes to see a solicitor tells him the issues and sees what he has to say. Just because she sees someone the legal advisor wont do ANYTHING unless she agrees thats what he should be doing for her. A solicitor will serve her, not take control out of her hands.
1 Like #16
she needs to be out of the house now!!

get legal advice from cab and inform the police about any threats.
1 Like #17
you cant take someone off a mortgage - it has to be done where he re-mortgages or she will always be responsible, even in years to come, even if he said he would cover it, whilst her name is on that debt she will be responsible and the only way to get it off is for him to re-mortgage in his name only
1 Like #18
I would strongly recommend legal advice.

I know people that have been in similar situations and although they seem like psychopaths and say they'll kill anyone that gets in there way, they do get scared as soon as the police get involved.

Someone I knows ex husband used to constantly make these threats and even kill the police if they got involved but the second the police went round to his house, he turned into a pussycat.

One of my friends parents have made threats and refused to move out and threatened to kill everyone in the household for several months and turned everyone's life into hell but they rid the storm and they've finally got rid of him without a whimper once they a dective was on the scene.

It's completely upto your sis which avenue she wants to take, as no one can force her but she must decide if she's willing to let this guy dicate her life and ruin her or if she's up for the challenge to shut him up.
#19
Personally I'd see this as a challenge.. he thinks he can control her and make her go whimpering away like a frightened mouse. It makes me angry. She should be fighting back, guns blazing not letting him contol the outcome of her life.

Psychopaths really do exist but she can use the law to her advantage and protect herself not just with the injunction itself but with all the weight that carries with the police and the courts. If a man doesn't obey the terms of an injunction ( which can certainly be to leave the house and not return to it for as long as they decide is necessary ) the police HAVE to arrest him and take him away until a judge can see him and listen further to the case.
#20
ClarityofMind
She obviously takes his threats seriously so she must take steps to ensure her own safety. She totally needs legal advice and help. I understand a piece of paper is just that, but once she has it she can make sure he cannot be around to harm her, if you see what I mean.

If he is going to be a danger to her then she must protect herself.


I do know what you are saying :)
#21
starsparkle2311
I have to butt in here, thing is, yeh they crawl off once the police are involved, but they usually stomp back even madder after the police have gone, all tears and niceness at first, but the fact the police have been involved usually stokes their fire of abuse up even more, they get crafty.


Very crafty and you have to be prepared for that and plan for it and even be prepared to fight them in their own terms if thats what it takes. If they are prepared to take away everything of yours that you ever held dear then you have to be prepared to go to the same lengths that they are *and even further* to protect yourself, your children ( when there are any )and your future.
#22
hellfire
LaoTzu, as much as you love her and as much advice as you or anybody gives her, she will at the end go the way she feels is best. Just support her whatever her decision.


Just been having that conversation with the other half, I am very much like that, I believe that you can advise however ultimately it's up to her and what she wants to do even if 99.9% of the population would think she was crazy!! I do support her, I would support her if she changed her mind and decided to stay with him :w00t: although I would fear for her. At the moment I am just trying to ensure that she has the right information to make as informed decision as possible about what she does next. I would kick myself - and she would probably kick me! - if in a few months time she finds out that had she done this or that now she wouldn't be in doodoos later on.
#23
ClarityofMind
If he is emotionally abusive then she needs must " cowboy up" and ride out the threats and manipulations to get what she needs to get out of the relationship sweetie. It doesn't change the fact that she needs legal advice.

Put this to her... he isn't going to know if she goes to see a solicitor tells him the issues and sees what he has to say. Just because she sees someone the legal advisor wont do ANYTHING unless she agrees thats what he should be doing for her. A solicitor will serve her, not take control out of her hands.


That is my intention to tell her there is no harm in getting advice from a solicitor, they know her rights and they will only do what she tells them to
#24
octobergirl
you cant take someone off a mortgage - it has to be done where he re-mortgages or she will always be responsible, even in years to come, even if he said he would cover it, whilst her name is on that debt she will be responsible and the only way to get it off is for him to re-mortgage in his name only


that's what I thought and feared, she could find herself having to pay rent and a mortgage which I don't think she realises based on all the advice everyone else is giving her
#25
realfriendlyman
I would strongly recommend legal advice.

I know people that have been in similar situations and although they seem like psychopaths and say they'll kill anyone that gets in there way, they do get scared as soon as the police get involved.

Someone I knows ex husband used to constantly make these threats and even kill the police if they got involved but the second the police went round to his house, he turned into a pussycat.

One of my friends parents have made threats and refused to move out and threatened to kill everyone in the household for several months and turned everyone's life into hell but they rid the storm and they've finally got rid of him without a whimper once they a dective was on the scene.

It's completely upto your sis which avenue she wants to take, as no one can force her but she must decide if she's willing to let this guy dicate her life and ruin her or if she's up for the challenge to shut him up.


starsparkle2311
I have to butt in here, thing is, yeh they crawl off once the police are involved, but they usually stomp back even madder after the police have gone, all tears and niceness at first, but the fact the police have been involved usually stokes their fire of abuse up even more, they get crafty.


Very true but that's why both of the scenarios mentioned have got an injunction on the partners, so the second they attempt to do anything, the police are on the scene and won't take any crap and will haul their asses in. :)
#26
LaoTzu
that's what I thought and feared, she could find herself having to pay rent and a mortgage which I don't think she realises based on all the advice everyone else is giving her


you can use this fact to elucidate how necessary getting legal advice actually is.
#27
realfriendlyman
I would strongly recommend legal advice.

I know people that have been in similar situations and although they seem like psychopaths and say they'll kill anyone that gets in there way, they do get scared as soon as the police get involved.

Someone I knows ex husband used to constantly make these threats and even kill the police if they got involved but the second the police went round to his house, he turned into a pussycat.

One of my friends parents have made threats and refused to move out and threatened to kill everyone in the household for several months and turned everyone's life into hell but they rid the storm and they've finally got rid of him without a whimper once they a dective was on the scene.

It's completely upto your sis which avenue she wants to take, as no one can force her but she must decide if she's willing to let this guy dicate her life and ruin her or if she's up for the challenge to shut him up.


He would follow through, my sister was once in the car with him when there was a road rage incident between him and another bloke, he single handedly stopped an entire motorway of traffic to front this guy. When he goes there is no stopping him, police are mice to him, he wouldn't care what he lost or what the implications of his actions were.

I don't think she wants him to dictate her life however she is fearful for her life if she does anything that may cause him to lose it.
#28
realfriendlyman
Very true but that's why both of the scenarios mentioned have got an injunction on the partners, so the second they attempt to do anything, the police are on the scene and won't take any crap and will haul their asses in. :)


The police wont necessarily see this as an emergency and wont necessarily be there the next minute after it is called in. Also, if the person isnt still on the scene they wont necessarily believe the person who calls in the crime. Frustrating huh?
#29
ClarityofMind
Personally I'd see this as a challenge.. he thinks he can control her and make her go whimpering away like a frightened mouse. It makes me angry. She should be fighting back, guns blazing not letting him contol the outcome of her life.

Psychopaths really do exist but she can use the law to her advantage and protect herself not just with the injunction itself but with all the weight that carries with the police and the courts. If a man doesn't obey the terms of an injunction ( which can certainly be to leave the house and not return to it for as long as they decide is necessary ) the police HAVE to arrest him and take him away until a judge can see him and listen further to the case.


I see exactly what you are saying however the reality is potentially one of the stories you see on the TV where she tells the police, she gets injunctions and all that and then one day it's all over and he gets her :(
#30
LaoTzu
When he goes there is no stopping him, police are mice to him, he wouldn't care what he lost or what the implications of his actions were.


This fact you can use to work for you.
1 Like #31
LaoTzu
I see exactly what you are saying however the reality is potentially one of the stories you see on the TV where she tells the police, she gets injunctions and all that and then one day it's all over and he gets her :(


Your first concern has to be her safety. It doesnt guarantee her safety if she just sits back and lets him have what he wants. She has to stand up for herself.

Its like bullies at school. Tell em to go to hell and they suddenly realise this isn't gonna be an easy scare.
#32
ClarityofMind
Very crafty and you have to be prepared for that and plan for it and even be prepared to fight them in their own terms if thats what it takes. If they are prepared to take away everything of yours that you ever held dear then you have to be prepared to go to the same lengths that they are *and even further* to protect yourself, your children ( when there are any )and your future.


I think that he would go to any length, he would destroy all her belongings or even her just so he 'won'

I am trying to balance protection of her physical being as well as trying to prevent her from losing everything and being screwed over with no life to lead after him
#33
starsparkle2311
my ex used to run off with my bank card, nice considering I had 2 babies to feed, that was his way of getting back in the house, once the police had gone. We moved to Australia, he ran off with the passports, I got wise, I got them back and hid them regularly, along with the birth certificates etc. changing the hiding place at least once a fortnight, because, he watched my every move, he was sly as a fox man, I'm telling you, if I hadn't done that, I'd still be there, in fact, looking back to how bad it got, I probably wouldn't be here now, seriously!!!!!!!!!


I know what you mean.. those are crazy things to do and you must have felt very scared.

Suddenly the person you love and thought you could trust isnt a trustworthy character anymore and you have to protect yourself from them. It's a hard thing to come to terms with and the longer a woman stays in it the worse things get.
#34
ClarityofMind
you can use this fact to elucidate how necessary getting legal advice actually is.


I will, I am going to write it all down, I am going to see her tomorrow. When you say things sometimes you dont remember to say everything, people interrupt or what have you.

Most of what has been said is what I was thinking, you know when you suddenly think 'maybe it's me that's wrong and everyone else is right' I wanted to get points of view and better ways of explaining it all to her. You guys are doing a great job of helping me :thumbsup:
1 Like #35
LaoTzu
..... however she is fearful for her life if she does anything that may cause him to lose it.



is she still living with him now?

as has been said , safety first then worry about money etc
#36
loads more I want to reply to but I gotta go for a bit and sort me kiddies bath and bed out so be back in a bit!!

Thanks so far guys, much appreciated :)
#37
LaoTzu
I think that he would go to any length, he would destroy all her belongings or even her just so he 'won'

I am trying to balance protection of her physical being as well as trying to prevent her from losing everything and being screwed over with no life to lead after him


You need to have a good talk with her about what she is prepared to give up in terms of keeping her safety. I know she wants to just leave and get away from him, but she isn't going to be able to just hand over all the financial responsibilities and rights they shared in their former home to him. They would probably need to agree to remortgage or to sell. They probably also have other shared debts, bills, goods. Say for instance that they have a shared bank account or credit card or even electricity bill and he runs up thousands of pounds worth of debt on it to deliberately punish her. She is going to be equally responsible for that debt.

If she does choose to move away then he doesn't need to know where she moves to. She must be very careful that he doesn't follow her from work to her new home and that he cannot gain access to other family members to be able to emotionally manipulate her further.

If she is strong enough to stand up to him and protect herself then she can have him removed from the family home. If needs must that thye continue to share it, she can get a good strong lock and make sure he cannot reach her during the night or at times that she is vulnerable.

She really does need legal advice before she does anything further though.
1 Like #38
If there is no equity in the property she would be better off just walking away imo.

She will have enough to worry about with other stuff.
1 Like #39
Definitley the priority is legal advice to see what her options are to get the outcome she wants. Even if she has to pay, still money well spent for an initial appt.

The main problem here is intimidation / bullying. Not easy to deal with.
#40
starsparkle2311
my ex used to run off with my bank card, nice considering I had 2 babies to feed, that was his way of getting back in the house, once the police had gone. We moved to Australia, he ran off with the passports, I got wise, I got them back and hid them regularly, along with the birth certificates etc. changing the hiding place at least once a fortnight, because, he watched my every move, he was sly as a fox man, I'm telling you, if I hadn't done that, I'd still be there, in fact, looking back to how bad it got, I probably wouldn't be here now, seriously!!!!!!!!!


Glad you got out and you are able to get on with your life (as best as you can) Seems you found a strength to get you back. Well done :-D You should be proud

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