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Trident Missile Failure

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Seems we like to laugh at others when it happens to them (N Korea) but not so funny when it happens to us and we try and pretend it didn't happen. A lot of other countries reporting on it but we're… Read More
Towelie Avatar
2m, 4w agoPosted 2 months, 4 weeks ago
Seems we like to laugh at others when it happens to them (N Korea) but not so funny when it happens to us and we try and pretend it didn't happen.

A lot of other countries reporting on it but we're just burying the heads going 'la la la la la never happened la la la la la'.

Surprised there isn't already a thread on this so is it worth spending the £40bn to replace it when we are in times of austerity and questions if it even works or should there be no price considered when it comes to security?

If you haven't heard already then take your pick from below:

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=trident+misfire&oq=tride&aqs=chrome.3.0l2j69i57j0.4184j0j4&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8
Towelie Avatar
2m, 4w agoPosted 2 months, 4 weeks ago
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(1)
7 Likes
The issue isn't that it failed. The issue is that it failed and May failed to disclose this during the debate on Trident.

Read a newspaper some of you.

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4 Likes #1
6 sources of the same news story just from your link alone so not sure how you think we're "just burying our heads"
2 Likes #2
meh
2 Likes #3
stuarthanley
6 sources of the same news story just from your link alone so not sure how you think we're "just burying our heads"

I was referring to the government who are denying it has happened and the link was offered so you can pick your own source as linking one usually gets you labelled one way or another.
2 Likes #4
Ridiculous waste on money imho. The only sensible argument for trident is the jobs it would create, though I'm sure those dependant upon the scheme could be retrained at a cost far lower than £40bn!
1 Like #5
Theresa May's interview on the subject with Marr was a trainwreck. The woman is an embarrassment and there are serious questions to be answered.

We need a functioning nuclear deterrent more than ever in my opinion.
1 Like #6
Towelie
stuarthanley
6 sources of the same news story just from your link alone so not sure how you think we're "just burying our heads"
I was referring to the government who are denying it has happened and the link was offered so you can pick your own source as linking one usually gets you labelled one way or another.
" A lot of other countries reporting on it but we're just burying the heads going 'la la la la la never happened la la la la la'."
We're reporting on it.
2 Likes #7
Towelie
stuarthanley
6 sources of the same news story just from your link alone so not sure how you think we're "just burying our heads"
I was referring to the government who are denying it has happened and the link was offered so you can pick your own source as linking one usually gets you labelled one way or another.

They've not denied anything have they? they refused to comment, which is standard procedure on such matters.
Personally I could care less, if it failed, well thats why they do the tests isn't it?
#8
Towelie
stuarthanley
6 sources of the same news story just from your link alone so not sure how you think we're "just burying our heads"

I was referring to the government who are denying it has happened and the link was offered so you can pick your own source as linking one usually gets you labelled one way or another.


Corbyn would prefer everything is out in the open for his friends in Russia, so come on let's publish everything and dismantle capitalism because Corbyn doesn't appreciate defense of the UK.

or maybe not as per today's statement from the government .


jog on Corbyn, back to Islington.
1 Like #9
Do we keep Trident or rely on Trump to protect us?

I know what I prefer. Trident is a complicated piece of machinery so is bound to have problems. Look at how many times there were catastrophic failures with the space shuttle and they were the ones we heard about.
1 Like #10
The whole point of testing is to find the limitations of a certain product, if you buy a new washing machine or car or television or babies pushchair, the same model would have been tested to destruction in the lab, you can watch on youtube videos of manufactures testing their products until they fail so they can be confident under normal usage conditions they will be safe for the end user.

No difference here, these missiles will be tested above and beyond normal operating conditions so if and when they are ever needed we can be sure of their reliability in the real world.
1 Like #11
Major news: Missile fails under a test.

I'm guessing they couldnt find any s*** to throw on Donald Trump today then?
Still, makes a change from the biased garbage they usually show.
4 Likes #12
Wasn't it a test? Isn't that what 'tests' are for? To indentify and sort out problems, it was when I were a lad.
Given the cost of one of these things I'd have thought that if they knew it was going to behave perfectly then there would have been no need for a 'test' and save a bucketful of money.
2 Likes #13
Rather it failed in a test than in a real situation.
2 Likes #14
Sometimes failures are needed to make improvements, if every test was successful it is easy to become complacent with the system, as long as we learned lessons from the test and engineered the faults out before a time comes when the system is needed.

I am more worried that this has come to light to the public, these tests should be secret so weaknesses aren't made obvious to potential enemies.
7 Likes #15
The issue isn't that it failed. The issue is that it failed and May failed to disclose this during the debate on Trident.

Read a newspaper some of you.
1 Like #16
they've made a few minor adjustments to the guidance system & now they can actually hit a cows arrRR's with a banjo from 5000 miles...Impressive X)
#17
AN empty missile went AWOL. I presume they were testing post refit to check things were working and to find out what was not!
#18
athunder
Towelie
stuarthanley
6 sources of the same news story just from your link alone so not sure how you think we're "just burying our heads"
I was referring to the government who are denying it has happened and the link was offered so you can pick your own source as linking one usually gets you labelled one way or another.
They've not denied anything have they? they refused to comment, which is standard procedure on such matters.
Personally I could care less, if it failed, well thats why they do the tests isn't it?

So you care at least a little bit?
1 Like #19
A very costly test, costs as much as a non test :D If it was a test they have no reason to hide anything, but not confirming anything and avoiding it shows it was more than just a test. Where was it heading I wonder oO
1 Like #20
HotEnglishAndWelshDeals
The issue isn't that it failed. The issue is that it failed and May failed to disclose this during the debate on Trident.
Read a newspaper some of you.

The real issue is that the alleged failure is public knowledge. The systems strongest use is that of a deterent to make potential threats to think twice before attacking, the advertisement of faults and weaknesses lessens the strength of the deterent therefore making it more likely we will have to use it.
banned 1 Like #21
Rockets can break & rockets can explode.

This happens if they are attached to a nuclear weapon or a space shuttle.

What is all the fuss?
#22
How is it a national issue of importance that has to be declared/debated in parliament just because a test went wrong? As has been said, had it been a 'live fire' in a state of 'war' and it had failed (think of the consequences) then fair enough. Are they expecting a running commentary on 'everything?'
Better than listening to the normal drivel that we hear in the 'house' I suppose.
1 Like #23
HotEnglishAndWelshDeals
The issue isn't that it failed. The issue is that it failed and May failed to disclose this during the debate on Trident.
Read a newspaper some of you.

Do you think discussing the limitations of our nuclear deterrent in public would be a smart move?

I am sure that any tests or movement of our operational forces would be on a need to know basis maybe the privy council would have been notified but a test failure of a missile should not have been a matter of discussion for parliament.
#24
HotEnglishAndWelshDeals
The issue isn't that it failed. The issue is that it failed and May failed to disclose this during the debate on Trident.
Read a newspaper some of you.

We do the Daily Mail. :(
1 Like #25
groenleader
AN empty missile went AWOL. I presume they were testing post refit to check things were working and to find out what was not!
https://media.tenor.co/images/830800d4e0fc56b7fd6ccf465c9575fc/raw
#26
no mention of where it came down or if they had to hit the self destruct button just in time like an 80s Bond film :D
4 Likes #27
coys67
HotEnglishAndWelshDeals
The issue isn't that it failed. The issue is that it failed and May failed to disclose this during the debate on Trident.
Read a newspaper some of you.
Do you think discussing the limitations of our nuclear deterrent in public would be a smart move?
I am sure that any tests or movement of our operational forces would be on a need to know basis maybe the privy council would have been notified but a test failure of a missile should not have been a matter of discussion for parliament.

Yes, because we're a parliamentary democracy as unfashionable as that might be. When discussing the funding of something, the question 'does it work' is probably pertinent.
#28
Am I correct to say that the misfired Trident is current well established generation of missiles? Namely it was not the new ones under prototyping. I suppose it is fair Q&A for the buyer to know if "it" could work when proven stuff that should work just failed.
.
As for PM May, whether she should have stated this misfire, then it is up to the protocol agreed for such incidents.


Edited By: splender on Jan 23, 2017 19:08
2 Likes #29
athunder
Towelie
stuarthanley
6 sources of the same news story just from your link alone so not sure how you think we're "just burying our heads"
I was referring to the government who are denying it has happened and the link was offered so you can pick your own source as linking one usually gets you labelled one way or another.
They've not denied anything have they? they refused to comment, which is standard procedure on such matters.
Personally I could care less, if it failed, well thats why they do the tests isn't it?
They have reported these tests with a huge fanfare in the past
the fact this failed one happened a few days before the commons vote
had nothing to do with this one being hushed up of course :{
edit;make that one month


Edited By: thewongwing101 on Jan 23, 2017 19:26: month
#30
To do a test firing costs £70,000,000
#31
Anyway why would well proven stuff from the 1960s fail? This is the key. In a test, they do unit/component test, partial integrated test, system test etc..... a whole series of tests for normal results before the final integrated system launch test. Doesn't inspire confidence that when Russia attacks then the British Trident misfire and drops itself in Paris or London, sound too much like Monty Python to me.
1 Like #32
no a test firing costs £17,000,000
1 Like #33
MUST BE DAMP! https://i.ytimg.com/vi/7MgSmh3vXaQ/maxresdefault.jpg

Edited By: raptorcigs on Jan 23, 2017 19:28
banned 1 Like #34
http://68.media.tumblr.com/9def3d96baa0c61ede3e232c5a134361/tumblr_o3uxl8gw421ukldkho1_500.gif
#35
I mean WTF the Russians will have known
During the 2012 launch, two Russian spy ships were in the vicinity, monitoring the launch.
the Russian commander sent a message afterwards: “Bravo November, this is Russian warship. We sincerely congratulate crew of your ship with the successful completion of the ballistic missile Trident II launch exercise.”

and yet we and our elected representatives are kept in the dark !
#36
HotEnglishAndWelshDeals
coys67
HotEnglishAndWelshDeals
The issue isn't that it failed. The issue is that it failed and May failed to disclose this during the debate on Trident.
Read a newspaper some of you.
Do you think discussing the limitations of our nuclear deterrent in public would be a smart move?
I am sure that any tests or movement of our operational forces would be on a need to know basis maybe the privy council would have been notified but a test failure of a missile should not have been a matter of discussion for parliament.
Yes, because we're a parliamentary democracy as unfashionable as that might be. When discussing the funding of something, the question 'does it work' is probably pertinent.

A failure during testing is not evidence that the system doesn't work, would you suggest a parliamentary enquiry for every item of expenditure that has failed in the testing phase of bringing new technology online, if it proves to be found the PM knew before or during the funding debate that there was an inherent problem with the trident system that was unfixable or would compromise safety or efficiency during operational deployment then of course that is a different matter but that does not seem to be the case here.
#37
We have plenty of them . Many Apple I Phones are duffers but they still sell them and millions of folks use them every day . To me it worked ,went askew on launch ,was successfully terminated before it did any harm - and Amazon Prime will deliver a new replacement by Lunchtime . No worries :D
#38
splender
Am I correct to say that the misfired Trident is current well established generation of missiles? Namely it was not the new ones under prototyping. I suppose it is fair Q&A for the buyer to know if "it" could work when proven stuff that should work just failed.
.
As for PM May, whether she should have stated this misfire, then it is up to the protocol agreed for such incidents.


Yep,the missiles used by trident are not new tech, the renewal that was recently agreed in parliament was for the subs to fire them, the missiles themselves are tried and tested but like everything i would imagine the testing of this system is ongoing.
#39
coys67

A failure during testing is not evidence that the system doesn't work

Exactly.

So you present the whole picture, not just pick and choose and people view it in this context.
2 Likes #40
Let's be honest some politicians cannot be trusted so the least of them knowing the better. Now imagine if all the bouncing bomb test had been made available I'd probably be spelling in German right now!

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