Found 4th Mar 2010
Looking to buy a Freeview HD built in TV, as I can receive the signal from the Crystal Palace transmitter

With a 50hz lcd tv, do fast moving sports i.e Formula one suffer motion blur compared to a 100hz LCD tv ?

Thanks

  1. Misc
  2. LCD TV
  3. TV
45 Comments

There isnt much selection for these tvs at the moment.

And Formula 1 isnt in HD the now and wont be until 2011 at the earliest. So wouldnt worry about that sport!

Original Poster

Comet have 2 sony & 1 Panasonic tv's for sale at the moment
comet.co.uk/sho…box

Banned

hippyharry;8012495

There isnt much selection for these tvs at the moment.And Formula 1 isnt … There isnt much selection for these tvs at the moment.And Formula 1 isnt in HD the now and wont be until 2011 at the earliest. So wouldnt worry about that sport!


most people expect a new TV to last a few years you know :-D

I have a 50" 50hz TV and really wish I'd opted for a 100hz as I do notice blur on sports (I am quite fussy though).

Aren't the blur-free TVs 200hz? LG Trumotion & Sony Motionflow.

I was reading up on this last week & some of the blur-free TVs are better for sports, the others are better for action movies.

Banned

hippyharry;8012495

There isnt much selection for these tvs at the moment.And Formula 1 isnt … There isnt much selection for these tvs at the moment.And Formula 1 isnt in HD the now and wont be until 2011 at the earliest. So wouldnt worry about that sport!


Whats HD got to do with Hz anyway? There are loads of 100hz tvs too and many 600hz ones now.

In theory, you might get more blur with a 100hz set than a 50hz set, but it really depends on the set itself, and whether you notice these things.............best to go and view the sets in store somewhere before you buy.

What size are you buying because if you buying 37inch plus then get a panasonic plasma as they don't suffer from motion blur like LCDs.

LG 47LH7000 Was considering this but went SKY HD so didn't need the freeview HD Tuner.

Good TV and Not silly money

Original Poster

I was looking around the 32"-37" size I noticed with some LCD's the motion blur on football was quite pronounced, I think I will have to go instore and have a look at the picture quality.

Painkiller;8012688

Aren't the blur-free TVs 200hz? LG Trumotion & Sony Motionflow.I was … Aren't the blur-free TVs 200hz? LG Trumotion & Sony Motionflow.I was reading up on this last week & some of the blur-free TVs are better for sports, the others are better for action movies.


Those are engines in the TV that help handle sports and fast action on screen as well. Some merely use it as a marketing technique. But of course the major brands generally do build it into their engines as otherwise a review would just show its a sham.

flamingcarrot;8012816

In theory, you might get more blur with a 100hz set than a 50hz set, but … In theory, you might get more blur with a 100hz set than a 50hz set, but it really depends on the set itself, and whether you notice these things.............best to go and view the sets in store somewhere before you buy.


That is true, it is more to do with the engine as well as the actual hardware of the set.

Thus I got a plasma set...no worry about motion blur then.

Went with a panasonic TX-32LXD85 last year when it was £400. Cracking TV, want something bigger tho.

trustedreviews.com/tvs…/p1

Adam2050;8012875

Went with a panasonic TX-32LXD85 last year when it was £400. Cracking TV, … Went with a panasonic TX-32LXD85 last year when it was £400. Cracking TV, want something bigger tho.http://www.trustedreviews.com/tvs/review/2008/05/13/Panasonic-Viera-TX-32LXD85-32in-LCD-TV/p1



Yeah I'd love a Panny, but in the end just over a year ago we went for a LG 42PC56 which is based on the same as this:

]LG 42PC1D

Awesome set, can't fault it. Although the warranty run out days ago so now I'm thinking of some sort of extended warranty as if anything happens to it I'm screwed!

jcsymons;8012866

I was looking around the 32"-37" size I noticed with some LCD's the … I was looking around the 32"-37" size I noticed with some LCD's the motion blur on football was quite pronounced, I think I will have to go instore and have a look at the picture quality.



If i was you I would seriosly look at this ]tv And then buy a seperate freeview hd box.

dananana;8012956

If i was you I would seriosly look at this ]tv And then buy a seperate … If i was you I would seriosly look at this ]tv And then buy a seperate freeview hd box.



Only HD ready thought anything about 32 inches which wasn't Full HD would suffer?

Don't you still get 25fps though? How does it reduce blur as surely it's just showing the same frame 4 times rather than 2. It can't invent new frames in the middle can it?

Adam2050;8012975

Only HD ready thought anything about 32 inches which wasn't Full HD would … Only HD ready thought anything about 32 inches which wasn't Full HD would suffer?



Mine is only HD Ready so 720p at 42" and mine is fine, it just depends on the source of your material and how far away you sit.
Ideally here are some guidelines:
Plasma TV Size(inch) Optimal Distance for 720p (inch) Optimal Distance for 1080p (inch)
42 99 66
50 118 79
55 130 86
60 141 94
65 153 102

Adam2050;8012975

Only HD ready thought anything about 32 inches which wasn't Full HD would … Only HD ready thought anything about 32 inches which wasn't Full HD would suffer?



Benjimoron;8013040

Don't you still get 25fps though? How does it reduce blur as surely it's … Don't you still get 25fps though? How does it reduce blur as surely it's just showing the same frame 4 times rather than 2. It can't invent new frames in the middle can it?



25fps = 50Hz due to interlacing though. Then for HD stuff you do get more on some feeds such as BBC R&D have tried 300fps for sports, so thus would equate to 600Hz.

awoodhall2003;8013125

25fps = 50Hz due to interlacing though. Then for HD stuff you do get more … 25fps = 50Hz due to interlacing though. Then for HD stuff you do get more on some feeds such as BBC R&D have tried 300fps for sports, so thus would equate to 600Hz.



So it's only of any use if there's more than 25fps being broadcast? How many things are broadcast at more than 25fps?

Benjimoron;8013140

So it's only of any use if there's more than 25fps being broadcast? How … So it's only of any use if there's more than 25fps being broadcast? How many things are broadcast at more than 25fps?



well all HD feeds such as Sky HD/BBC HD etc are 50fps @ 720p or 25fps @ 1080i (due to interlacing so it splits the 25fps over interlaced fields so 50hz still).

Adam2050;8012975

Only HD ready thought anything about 32 inches which wasn't Full HD would … Only HD ready thought anything about 32 inches which wasn't Full HD would suffer?



I believe it's 37/42+ that would suffer if not 1080.

We have a panny 42 S10 and it's magnificent - mainly watch SD, and the PQ is fantastic. Playing the Xbox through it is mindblowing Quite looking forward to eventually watching a blu-ray through it.

awoodhall2003;8013175

well all HD feeds such as Sky HD/BBC HD etc are 50fps @ 720p or 25fps @ … well all HD feeds such as Sky HD/BBC HD etc are 50fps @ 720p or 25fps @ 1080i (due to interlacing so it splits the 25fps over interlaced fields so 50hz still).



So effectively everything is 50Hz at the moment? (so the motion blur tv's don't really do anything at the moment?). But in the (near?) future they'll be broadcasting faster so they will be of use?

Thanks.

Original Poster

I found this @ play
play.com/Ele…tml
Any good ?

Whoever mentioned 600hz that has nothing to do with motion it relates to brightness on a plasma. OP if u can afford go for one of the high end sony models with 200hz if u see it side by side with a 100 and a 50hz tv u will realise why u pay the premium for it

numptyj;8013267

Whoever mentioned 600hz that has nothing to do with motion it relates to … Whoever mentioned 600hz that has nothing to do with motion it relates to brightness on a plasma. OP if u can afford go for one of the high end sony models with 200hz if u see it side by side with a 100 and a 50hz tv u will realise why u pay the premium for it



What so your saying Hz has nothing to do with refresh rates :w00t:

Benjimoron;8013194

So effectively everything is 50Hz at the moment? (so the motion blur tv's … So effectively everything is 50Hz at the moment? (so the motion blur tv's don't really do anything at the moment?). But in the (near?) future they'll be broadcasting faster so they will be of use?Thanks.



Ummmm no...as the higher Hz rated TVs with a decent engine will create frames inbetween those 50fps say for example to 200hz so between every 'real' frame you will have 3 extra frames, which will calculate and interpolate between the frame before it and after it to show a smoother image especially noticeable in fast moving sports.

awoodhall2003;8013429

Ummmm no...as the higher Hz rated TVs with a decent engine will create … Ummmm no...as the higher Hz rated TVs with a decent engine will create frames inbetween those 50fps say for example to 200hz so between every 'real' frame you will have 3 extra frames, which will calculate and interpolate between the frame before it and after it to show a smoother image especially noticeable in fast moving sports.



Yep read small articles and its obvious that its not true frames, as the human eye cant even pick up. It will just appear smoother. Not aimed at you Andre.

Adam2050;8013450

Yep read small articles and its obvious that its not true frames, as the … Yep read small articles and its obvious that its not true frames, as the human eye cant even pick up. It will just appear smoother. Not aimed at you Andre.



No worries, I find Plasma technology is easier to get your head round as less 'marketing' as such. Although the new 600Hz Plasma is here, which every 'pixel' has 10 sub'pixels' thus 600Hz. But I agree that is exactly what it is trickery to the eye, so its not real, but its appears better to the eye...and although it is a trick if it looks better to the eye then its all good.

Adam2050;8013279

What so your saying Hz has nothing to do with refresh rates :w00t:



Hz just refers the amount of times an event occurs every second, but panasonic when they bought their 600 hz sets out they used that clever tennis ball advert to make people think it referred to motion and therefore was superior to 200hz

numptyj;8013551

Hz just refers to something that happens every second but panasonic when … Hz just refers to something that happens every second but panasonic when they bought their 600 hz sets out they used that clever tennis ball advert to make people think it referred to motion and therefore was superior to 200hz



Well they weren't technically lying. If the TV can refresh sub pixels and main pixels faster then the pictures going to appear smoother as discussed above. Surely what your on about is contrast ratio?

Banned

get at leasty 100 hz for sports but you dont need it for gaming

Adam2050;8013590

Well they weren't technically lying. If the TV can refresh sub pixels and … Well they weren't technically lying. If the TV can refresh sub pixels and main pixels faster then the pictures going to appear smoother as discussed above. Surely what your on about is contrast ratio?



it referred to brightness as far as im aware (that could include contrast) I cant remeber the full ins and out of the technology used but someone who knows more about plasmas can probably input. The 600hz sets stil have 100hz for motion, but they way they were advertising was in a slighty grey area because you would watch the fast action and think ooh 600hz thats much be better than 100/200 hz. Even Panasonic reps Ive spoken to have said the advert was a little dodgy, just like Samsung and their LED tvs.....even though they didnt mention it was an LCD with a different lighting technology, slightly different wording an advertising to fool the customer

what you said about it refreshing, maybe it will help to make it look slightly smoother, but the 50hz/100hz the OP is referring to is the more conventional ones we are accustomed to where extra frames are added to make the image appear smoother

numptyj;8013892

it referred to brightness as far as im aware (that could include … it referred to brightness as far as im aware (that could include contrast) I cant remeber the full ins and out of the technology used but someone who knows more about plasmas can probably input. The 600hz sets stil have 100hz for motion, but they way they were advertising was in a slighty grey area because you would watch the fast action and think ooh 600hz thats much be better than 100/200 hz. Even Panasonic reps Ive spoken to have said the advert was a little dodgy, just like Samsung and their LED tvs.....even though they didnt mention it was an LCD with a different lighting technology, slightly different wording an advertising to fool the customer



Yep don't get me wrong I agree on the way it advertised to sell.:) I personally wouldn't go out and spend top dollar on one for the sake of the 600hz selling point.

Adam2050;8013915

Yep don't get me wrong I agree on the way it advertised to sell.:) I … Yep don't get me wrong I agree on the way it advertised to sell.:) I personally wouldn't go out and spend top dollar on one for the sake of the 600hz selling point.



go for a 200hz sony instead (strong sony fanboy btw lol) they are awesome tvs though

Ain't a fan of sony's atm, think there cheap and cheerful.

Adam2050;8014028

Ain't a fan of sony's atm, think there cheap and cheerful.



new 3d models are looking nice, a slight B&O look to them

Adam2050;8014028

Ain't a fan of sony's atm, think there cheap and cheerful.


They sure are, gone down over the last few years, but as below...
numptyj;8014047

new 3d models are looking nice, a slight B&O look to them


...they will be leading the 3d tv and the quality of sets does look to improve.
dcx_badass;8013971

HZ isn't everything, a lot of people turn it off, because the TV guesses … HZ isn't everything, a lot of people turn it off, because the TV guesses the extra frame and it can look rubbish with random pictures sometimes.


Yep, its usually good for Sports and some films, but for examples games it can add upto 50ms of response time, which might seem like nothing but when playing a game, serious gamers will realise it.

Its a bit like the xD engine on my LG its great, but only if you manually set it up and for certain sources. Leaving it on dynamic for example can lead it to changing its setting several times whilst for example watching a film...so suddenly it will go darker or lighter etc. Its terrible when left to do as it pleases.

Banned

Adam2050;8014028

Ain't a fan of sony's atm, think there cheap and cheerful.



probably because your looking at the low end entry models.......nearly as poor as lg etc

casparwhite;8014260

probably because your looking at the low end entry models.......nearly as … probably because your looking at the low end entry models.......nearly as poor as lg etc



I find LG very good...my LG looks better then 3 samsungs that ive set up for family, and ive had less problems.

casparwhite;8014260

probably because your looking at the low end entry models.......nearly as … probably because your looking at the low end entry models.......nearly as poor as lg etc



Not sure which models but most I have seen on display were very poor.
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