Alfie Evans

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Found 14th AprEdited by:"OllieSt"
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catbeans4 h, 48 m ago

The kids dead, people need to stop giving them money and everybody needs …The kids dead, people need to stop giving them money and everybody needs to move on. RIP.


Disgusting
catbeans3 h, 47 m ago

The kids dead, people need to stop giving them money and everybody needs …The kids dead, people need to stop giving them money and everybody needs to move on. RIP.


A nice happy and positive message that is, I hope you never lose a child and people tell you to just move on. Also who are you to tell me what I need to do with my money? Dictating what we all need to stop doing and what we need to do
25 Comments
catbeans1 h, 10 m ago

The kids dead, people need to stop giving them money and everybody needs …The kids dead, people need to stop giving them money and everybody needs to move on. RIP.


Very strange why the hospital wouldn't allow the parents to take their child away even though they had legal papers that said they could.
There were health officials from another country ready to take over and transport the child to Italy to try other treatments.
The hospital called the police to stop it.

It's not the first time this hospital has done this. For a so called specialist child hospital I find it disgusting.
Edited by: "Darzen" 14th Apr
Darzen1 h, 21 m ago

Very strange why the hospital wouldn't allow the parents to take their …Very strange why the hospital wouldn't allow the parents to take their child away even though they had legal papers that said they could. There were health officials from another country ready to take over and transport the child to Italy to try other treatments. The hospital called the police to stop it.It's not the first time this hospital has done this. For a so called specialist child hospital I find it disgusting.


They don't have legal papers to take their child, they fought it all the way to the European court of human rights and lost, the highest court and experts have said the kids gone.

From the Wiki of the Hospital that wants to take him;

"A 2017 Associated Press investigation reported that the hospital changed its focus to prioritize profit over the health of the children there. The report found that overcrowding and poor hygiene contributed to deadly infection, including one 21-month superbug outbreak in the cancer ward that killed eight children.[3] It also found that in order to save money, disposable equipment and other materials were at times used improperly, with a one-time order of cheap needles breaking when injected into tiny veins.[3] The report also stated that doctors were so pressured to maximize operating-room turnover that patients were sometimes brought out of anesthesia too quickly.[3] All of these alleged incidents were reported to have occurred between the years 2008 and 2015.[3]The hospital responded in a statement, describing the investigation as a "hoax" and saying that it "contained false, dated and gravely defamatory accusations and conjectures that had been denied by an independent report of the Holy See."[4]

A secret three-month Vatican-authorized investigation in early 2014 gathered testimony and documentation from dozens of current and former staff members and confirmed that the mission of "the pope's hospital" had been lost and was "today more aimed at profit than on caring for children."[3] The Vatican refused to make the report public."
catbeans3 h, 47 m ago

The kids dead, people need to stop giving them money and everybody needs …The kids dead, people need to stop giving them money and everybody needs to move on. RIP.


A nice happy and positive message that is, I hope you never lose a child and people tell you to just move on. Also who are you to tell me what I need to do with my money? Dictating what we all need to stop doing and what we need to do
catbeans4 h, 48 m ago

The kids dead, people need to stop giving them money and everybody needs …The kids dead, people need to stop giving them money and everybody needs to move on. RIP.


Disgusting
catbeans4 h, 54 m ago

The kids dead, people need to stop giving them money and everybody needs …The kids dead, people need to stop giving them money and everybody needs to move on. RIP.


Ashya King
jayonline854 h, 34 m ago

A nice happy and positive message that is, I hope you never lose a child …A nice happy and positive message that is, I hope you never lose a child and people tell you to just move on. Also who are you to tell me what I need to do with my money? Dictating what we all need to stop doing and what we need to do


andy1861863 h, 33 m ago

Disgusting





Positive message? Its reality mate. completely understand the parents lack of objectivism and the fact they can't see the woods through the trees. However what I don't understand are people not related that encourage such behaviour, encouraging this is what's disgusting. What's disgusting is fetishising a child's corpse and parents grief, and making it in to some weird idol of hope and prolonging both.

OllieSt3 h, 27 m ago

Ashya King


completely different case, irrelevant.
Although the wording used by a certain poster ITT is disgusting the fact that the parents have been allowed to spend millions in tax payers money to fight their case in the highest courts whilst making the NHS spend millions more of tax payers money forcing the NHS to provide care seems disgusting (just like the wasted £11million in the Madeleine McCann case - the majority of the population have their own opinion on what happened but because there is no evidence they cannot be prosecuted).


Yes the NHS should provide the best medical treatment until it goes to the first court of appeal and then if that court agrees with the hospital the parents should be made to fund any additional care in cases like this.


Yes I feel sorry for the parents (are they still living together or is this just another publicity stunt to get their names famous?) their baby is brain dead and if he survives he won't have any quality of life. I lost my first born should I seek media support and waste millions in a court case or like generations before me accept that sometimes life is cruel and move on.
OllieSt7 h, 4 m ago

Ashya King



No - the NHS said it so it must be true. We must praise NHS and all their godly decisions. They are the best health care system in world.... we must believe this..... honest.... we must.

I hope the parents get a chance to take him abroad - so many condition we let fester in this country people that suffer the same abroad get treatment.

Of course british media vilified parents time and time agein for not just taking the opinion of the NHS....

They should be able to take their child to get treatment wherever they want....
joanddan71 h, 16 m ago

They should be able to take their child to get treatment wherever they …They should be able to take their child to get treatment wherever they want....


No, its not about the parents wants.

The child is a person and has rights that comes with that and society and our system has a responsibility to that child.

A parents wants cannot supersede the advice of experts.

The experts are acting in the best way for the patient, the child, not with the overbearing paternal instinct that does not understand medicine.
Edited by: "groenleader" 14th Apr
groenleader32 m ago

No, its not about the parents wants. The child is a person and has rights …No, its not about the parents wants. The child is a person and has rights that comes with that and society and our system has a responsibility to that child. A parents wants cannot supersede the advice of experts.The experts are acting in the best way for the patient, the child, not with the overbearing paternal instinct that does not understand medicine.



You over estimate the NHS and also ignore the 1,000,000s cases that the NHS have failed to help patients yet they have found help abroad.

Its not about what the NHS wants that’s for sure.
catbeans5 h, 56 m ago

Positive message? Its reality mate. completely understand the parents lack …Positive message? Its reality mate. completely understand the parents lack of objectivism and the fact they can't see the woods through the trees. However what I don't understand are people not related that encourage such behaviour, encouraging this is what's disgusting. What's disgusting is fetishising a child's corpse and parents grief, and making it in to some weird idol of hope and prolonging both.completely different case, irrelevant.


Its all very bizarre, I can understand the parents grabbing on to any sign of hope, but the "Army" of moronic grief tourists I cannot understand at all.
joanddan739 m ago

You over estimate the NHS and also ignore the 1,000,000s cases that the …You over estimate the NHS and also ignore the 1,000,000s cases that the NHS have failed to help patients yet they have found help abroad. Its not about what the NHS wants that’s for sure.


I don't think anyone is over estimating the NHS. Yes they have made mistakes and so have many other government departments (police/fire, parliament, justice system and child protection to name a few) but I doubt in this instance taking into account the many court cases I'm guessing external medical professionals would have been brought in to assess the NHS's own prognosis/diagnosis and this isn't your every day failure by "professionals".

IMHO the Vatican has got involved purely for the media attention - where are they with Syrian children being gassed with chemical agents? where are they for the starving/malnourished in Africa? where are they with grooming gangs? actual children that could be saved and have a quality of life and potentially be productive
I watched a series recently which dealt with such issues from the medical perspective and the family point of view. Some heart breaking stuff on there and we are all so lucky these are decisions we don't have to make. I'm fairly sure I know what I would do but it isn't my baby and I've lived a lot longer and seen a lot more stuff than the parents.
philphil6114th Apr

Although the wording used by a certain poster ITT is disgusting the fact …Although the wording used by a certain poster ITT is disgusting the fact that the parents have been allowed to spend millions in tax payers money to fight their case in the highest courts whilst making the NHS spend millions more of tax payers money forcing the NHS to provide care seems disgusting (just like the wasted £11million in the Madeleine McCann case - the majority of the population have their own opinion on what happened but because there is no evidence they cannot be prosecuted).Yes the NHS should provide the best medical treatment until it goes to the first court of appeal and then if that court agrees with the hospital the parents should be made to fund any additional care in cases like this.Yes I feel sorry for the parents (are they still living together or is this just another publicity stunt to get their names famous?) their baby is brain dead and if he survives he won't have any quality of life. I lost my first born should I seek media support and waste millions in a court case or like generations before me accept that sometimes life is cruel and move on.


Well they could have saved us all a fortune if the hospital had allowed the child to go to Italy at the start of all this. It's what the parents wanted and it shouldn't have come to this.
I remember a few years back, the dragged out court case refusing proton beam therapy to a child as it was relatively untested, wasting many months when the the child's condition was worsening and the chance of cure was diminishing. We now have centres built and being built here. It does seem to me that if the NHS can't provide the answer our government doesn't want us to find out there's better care elsewhere.
I don't think this child had a long future either way but who's to say the day after they switch off his life support some kind of gene therapy won't be announced that would have saved him or even reversed his condition. One day it may well be possible, maybe not tomorrow but without trying we never advance.
liamf123 h, 15 m ago

Well they could have saved us all a fortune if the hospital had allowed …Well they could have saved us all a fortune if the hospital had allowed the child to go to Italy at the start of all this. It's what the parents wanted and it shouldn't have come to this.I remember a few years back, the dragged out court case refusing proton beam therapy to a child as it was relatively untested, wasting many months when the the child's condition was worsening and the chance of cure was diminishing. We now have centres built and being built here. It does seem to me that if the NHS can't provide the answer our government doesn't want us to find out there's better care elsewhere. I don't think this child had a long future either way but who's to say the day after they switch off his life support some kind of gene therapy won't be announced that would have saved him or even reversed his condition. One day it may well be possible, maybe not tomorrow but without trying we never advance.


I agree with the latter part of your comment regarding unknown cures AFAIK some have been allowed to go to distant shores for that potential trial/cure.

That said I already stated ITT external medical professionals would have been dragged in to analyse the medical diagnosis/prognosis - I doubt the highest courts in the UK and even the ECHR would allow evidence only from our NHS professionals.

I don't know all the case so I'm mostly speculating but apologise if I get anything wrong but
Why did the parents wait until after the appeals failed to start publicly going on about the Vatican offer?
When did the Vatican get involved?
Why did the Vatican get involved (this is one life and the child is brain dead what about the millions being abused and starved who aren't brain dead)?

Before millennials and social media people accepted fate and got on with their lives but now we must try to save every worthless life because it's the right thing to do..............

and how many millions of children could we have helped just from the cost of the Madeline McCann case?

Yes offer the best medical treatment available, yes challenge that medical prognosis/diagnosis if needed but accept the decision, grieve, move on - not cost the tax payers millions for your selfish gain. The child is brain dead he will have no quality of life.
liamf1215th Apr

Well they could have saved us all a fortune if the hospital had allowed …Well they could have saved us all a fortune if the hospital had allowed the child to go to Italy at the start of all this. It's what the parents wanted and it shouldn't have come to this.I remember a few years back, the dragged out court case refusing proton beam therapy to a child as it was relatively untested, wasting many months when the the child's condition was worsening and the chance of cure was diminishing. We now have centres built and being built here. It does seem to me that if the NHS can't provide the answer our government doesn't want us to find out there's better care elsewhere. I don't think this child had a long future either way but who's to say the day after they switch off his life support some kind of gene therapy won't be announced that would have saved him or even reversed his condition. One day it may well be possible, maybe not tomorrow but without trying we never advance.


Aysha King was allowed to go for therapy after the first court case, of an unrelated curable condition. Proton Beam therapy is available in the UK and is becoming more Common now.

So just have warehouses of corpses on life support in case of a possible cure? Why not just freeze people so they wake up in the future. The NHS doesn't have enough money to look after the living.

Parents don't have a final say in what is right for their children for a reason. The hospital in Italy wants to take them for money and publicity, they are a poor quality religious hospital. What if parents said they wanted to stop all treatment of a child and use crystals to heal their child? where do you draw the line?
catbeans1 h, 50 m ago

Aysha King was allowed to go for therapy after the first court case, of an …Aysha King was allowed to go for therapy after the first court case, of an unrelated curable condition. Proton Beam therapy is available in the UK and is becoming more Common now. So just have warehouses of corpses on life support in case of a possible cure? Why not just freeze people so they wake up in the future. The NHS doesn't have enough money to look after the living. Parents don't have a final say in what is right for their children for a reason. The hospital in Italy wants to take them for money and publicity, they are a poor quality religious hospital. What if parents said they wanted to stop all treatment of a child and use crystals to heal their child? where do you draw the line?


If we're sentencing them to death anyway and it's not costing taxpayers money then why spend vast amounts of taxpayers and NHS money fighting it, that's all I was saying.
Aysha King wasn't allowed to be taken for treatment he was taken without permission from what I gather. I seem to remember the news reporting we should call 999 if we spotted the parents and police were stationed at all ports etc.
liamf126 h, 58 m ago

If we're sentencing them to death anyway and it's not costing taxpayers …If we're sentencing them to death anyway and it's not costing taxpayers money then why spend vast amounts of taxpayers and NHS money fighting it, that's all I was saying.Aysha King wasn't allowed to be taken for treatment he was taken without permission from what I gather. I seem to remember the news reporting we should call 999 if we spotted the parents and police were stationed at all ports etc.


The medical professionals and the courts (all courts up to the highest level possible) have decided from medical evidence that prolonging the life of the child is not in that child's best interest - they are not and have never have been sentencing the child to death.

People like you and those outside the hospital need to accept responsibility and accept that sometimes life is cruel.

Just reading the BBC news website

quote
"Judges said they were "dismayed and concerned" by reports of some protesters' actions.

One judge, Lord Justice Moylan, said staff had not been able to get into the hospital and that staff, patients and relatives had been frightened.

A relative of a patient at Alder Hey, which won a legal battle to withdraw Alfie's life support, had described visits as "intimidating and scary" because of some of the people protesting."

These "protesters" are nothing more than mostly religious or social media freaks who are out to get their 5 mins of being famous or just to cause trouble << just as bad as the anti abortionists who patrol outside some of hospitals..

Yes the unmarried parents have yet again gone back to court and lost again and although not recommended they have been given the right to appeal that decision by the Supreme Court and as the judge said "We cannot have a kind of legal 'Groundhog Day' where you come back again and again and again on the same point."


All that tax payers money wasted on numerous court cases and appeals and all that tax payers money providing around the clock care could be better invested in some of the disabled kids to enhance their life and hopefully make them more productive to society that someone who has no hope of even breathing for themselves.


Selfish parents IMHO
My reply to the last comment has been rejected as political and religious discussion is no longer tolerated.
I didn't mention politics or religion. I'm an atheist!
If you read my first comment you'll see how most money could be saved. Don't fight in court and don't pay for treatment.
There, no politics or relegion.
philphil619 h, 55 m ago

The medical professionals and the courts (all courts up to the highest …The medical professionals and the courts (all courts up to the highest level possible) have decided from medical evidence that prolonging the life of the child is not in that child's best interest - they are not and have never have been sentencing the child to death.People like you and those outside the hospital need to accept responsibility and accept that sometimes life is cruel. Just reading the BBC news websitequote "Judges said they were "dismayed and concerned" by reports of some protesters' actions.One judge, Lord Justice Moylan, said staff had not been able to get into the hospital and that staff, patients and relatives had been frightened.A relative of a patient at Alder Hey, which won a legal battle to withdraw Alfie's life support, had described visits as "intimidating and scary" because of some of the people protesting."These "protesters" are nothing more than mostly religious or social media freaks who are out to get their 5 mins of being famous or just to cause trouble << just as bad as the anti abortionists who patrol outside some of hospitals..Yes the unmarried parents have yet again gone back to court and lost again and although not recommended they have been given the right to appeal that decision by the Supreme Court and as the judge said "We cannot have a kind of legal 'Groundhog Day' where you come back again and again and again on the same point."All that tax payers money wasted on numerous court cases and appeals and all that tax payers money providing around the clock care could be better invested in some of the disabled kids to enhance their life and hopefully make them more productive to society that someone who has no hope of even breathing for themselves.Selfish parents IMHO


And what has unmarried parents got to do with this case so why even mention it?
liamf129 h, 33 m ago

And what has unmarried parents got to do with this case so why even …And what has unmarried parents got to do with this case so why even mention it?


When you answer the following

Why has the pope/Vatican got involved?
What can the pope/Vatican hospital do that our NHS can't?
Why are the parents appealing yet again - are they not subject to our laws?

I will answer your question but you won't be surprised because I've already hinted towards the reason.
philphil612 h, 53 m ago

When you answer the following Why has the pope/Vatican got involved?What …When you answer the following Why has the pope/Vatican got involved?What can the pope/Vatican hospital do that our NHS can't?Why are the parents appealing yet again - are they not subject to our laws?I will answer your question but you won't be surprised because I've already hinted towards the reason.


Yet again they're going to court and "wasting" taxpayers money. Let them go to Rome don't pay lawyers to contest and let the parents or those who wish to support them, pay the costs. No more expense for us and inevitably the child will die but won't cost you or I another penny.
Or we can repeat the legal thing time and time again at our cost case after case. If they wanted to carry out horrific procedures then stop them nut that's not the case.
Ironically the terminally ill and suffering who actually want a way out can't but some of those who don't can't remain alive. The only people making out of this is the legal teams and courts.
It's luck that Stephen Hawking was in Geneva in 1985. If he had been in the UK he would have died as ALS patients were refused tracheotomies in the UK. They were a no hope cause with a short life which expectancy not worth prolonging.
liamf124 h, 12 m ago

Yet again they're going to court and "wasting" taxpayers money. Let them …Yet again they're going to court and "wasting" taxpayers money. Let them go to Rome don't pay lawyers to contest and let the parents or those who wish to support them, pay the costs. No more expense for us and inevitably the child will die but won't cost you or I another penny.Or we can repeat the legal thing time and time again at our cost case after case. If they wanted to carry out horrific procedures then stop them nut that's not the case.Ironically the terminally ill and suffering who actually want a way out can't but some of those who don't can't remain alive. The only people making out of this is the legal teams and courts. It's luck that Stephen Hawking was in Geneva in 1985. If he had been in the UK he would have died as ALS patients were refused tracheotomies in the UK. They were a no hope cause with a short life which expectancy not worth prolonging.


I agree with everything you say in the last comment.

Yes the parents should pay for everything - let them take responsibility (they've probably earned enough from media coverage to fund a lavish lifestyle now) whilst letting another country/charity/religion pay for everything for their child.

No I'm not heartless - I feel for parents who lose their child - no parent should ever have to lose their child but as a planet we are nowhere near that even with all the medical expertise around the globe but these two IMHO have pushed too far for one purpose only and there actions were not in the best interest of their child.... but that's my opinion and some will try to slate me for it (but I ain't listening )

And yes the legal teams are minting it and so are the news cartels and social media but it's all the fault of the parents <<< again my opinion
Under the EU rules, the Italian Hospital who would keep all the machines on to keep the shell alive would cross charge back to the NHS in the UK.

We have to remember that everyone who has seen the scans and evidence has confirmed that his brain has turned to mush and that it is only the machines keeping the lungs working.


And to all the facebook warriors saying the HNS and Doctors are trying to play god by killing Alfie.
Let,s see how God deals with him when all the intervention is turned off. If is the Hospital playing god that has kept his shell technically alive so far.
Alfie passed away this morning at 2.30
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