Best place to upgrade to combi boiler

16
Posted 14th Sep
Hi guys. Getting my bathroom done right now and replaced the electric shower with thermostatic shower that has ceiling mount rain shower.
Problem is our system is gravity fed and bathroom fitter said thermostatic shower will not work. I will get a 2nd hand pump temporarily as no electric shower.

I want to change to combi boiler so was enquiring where the best place would be for boiler plus fitting.
Thanks in advance
Community Updates
Ask

Groups

16 Comments
Sounds you have open system boiler. If it is old just swap it with new one suitable for sealed system and install invented hot water cylinder. The water pressure would come from mains then and your shower problems would be solved. I went for Valliant/Gledhill combination.
Avoid combi boiler, more expensive to run and is not recommend for larger homes.
senukas14/09/2019 12:51

Sounds you have open system boiler. If it is old just swap it with new one …Sounds you have open system boiler. If it is old just swap it with new one suitable for sealed system and install invented hot water cylinder. The water pressure would come from mains then and your shower problems would be solved. I went for Valliant/Gledhill combination. Avoid combi boiler, more expensive to run and is not recommend for larger homes.


"Avoid combi boiler , more expensive to run " ??? . Think you have that the wrong way round !!

Also a combi boiler has an integrated pump that will run a thermostatic shower fine .

Unless you have 3 bathrooms (and use three showers simultaneously ) a combi (with sufficient output ) is by far the most efficient option .

Try these northerngasheating.com/ . they fitted mine 6 years ago in a day, were competitively priced and no complaints in the 6 years since fitment .
Edited by: "rogparki" 14th Sep
Ask fitter as will know local boiler fitter or stop and ask for business card if you see plumbing van. Good way to gauge the trade before you invite
deleted90213914/09/2019 13:06

"Avoid combi boiler , more expensive to run " ??? . …"Avoid combi boiler , more expensive to run " ??? . Think you have that the wrong way round !!Also a combi boiler has an integrated pump that will run a thermostatic shower fine .Unless you have 3 bathrooms (and use three showers simultaneously ) a combi (with sufficient output ) is by far the most efficient option . Try these https://www.northerngasheating.com/ . they fitted mine 6 years ago in a day, were competitively priced and no complaints in the 6 years since fitment .


4 bed house with 1 small bathroom and a cloakroom toilet.
Worcester Bosch Gold Accredited Installers will give you up to 10 warranty including parts and labour.
montana7814/09/2019 13:44

4 bed house with 1 small bathroom and a cloakroom toilet.



Pretty obvious a combi will be best , not sure where that first comment came from . Suggest you get 3 quotes one from Northern gas (who were best price when I had mine done ) and two from a couple of local "gas safe" plumbing firms (old Corgi registered) .

I have a 3 bed semi and it was between a 30kwh and a 35 kwh one . I went for the 35kwh as there wasn't much price difference and the larger the output the larger the hot water flow rate.

Obviously a combi is instant hot water so you don't waste money keeping a tank full of gradually cooling hot water hot .

Don't know how old or where your current boiler is sited but I took the opportunity to move it from the kitchen to the airing cupboard (in place of the redundant hot water tank ).

I've since fitted a "Hive " smart thermostat , simple to DIY so if you haven't already got one (or similar) might be an idea to get one fitted at the same time as it replaces the normal thermostat (so would save you a few quid ).

The gas guy will explain options including the boiler rating you need (it'll probably be a 35KW-38KW model ) . Finally don't scrimp on the make of boiler . Worcester Bosch and Vaillant I believe are still the most reliable brands and come with a 7 -10 year warranty (saves on extortionate Homeserve cover ). Worth paying a few quid more for a good boiler - my Vaillant hasn't missed a beat in over 6 years and saved me a fortune in gas bills .
Edited by: "rogparki" 14th Sep
Be careful there are some types of pumps you cannot use with combi boilers. Check with a gas fitter.
Edited by: "cmdr_elito" 14th Sep
cmdr_elito14/09/2019 15:26

Be careful there are some types of pumps you cannot use with combi …Be careful there are some types of pumps you cannot use with combi boilers. Check with a gas fitter.



Don't need a pump with a combi , it has its own integral pump .
Edited by: "rogparki" 14th Sep
deleted90213914/09/2019 13:06

"Avoid combi boiler , more expensive to run " ??? . …"Avoid combi boiler , more expensive to run " ??? . Think you have that the wrong way round !!Also a combi boiler has an integrated pump that will run a thermostatic shower fine .Unless you have 3 bathrooms (and use three showers simultaneously ) a combi (with sufficient output ) is by far the most efficient option . Try these https://www.northerngasheating.com/ . they fitted mine 6 years ago in a day, were competitively priced and no complaints in the 6 years since fitment .


I'm pretty sure about my experience - moving from 3 bed house with one bathroom and cloakroom on combi boiler to 4 bed with two bathrooms and cloakroom and system boiler cut my gas usage nearly 20%.
Combi boiler is ok for flats and micro houses but for normal family use is a no no. Ask any self respected plumber....
senukas14/09/2019 18:52

I'm pretty sure about my experience - moving from 3 bed house with one …I'm pretty sure about my experience - moving from 3 bed house with one bathroom and cloakroom on combi boiler to 4 bed with two bathrooms and cloakroom and system boiler cut my gas usage nearly 20%.Combi boiler is ok for flats and micro houses but for normal family use is a no no. Ask any self respected plumber....



Opposite experience for me - had a system boiler then changed (same house 3 bed semi) to a combi = 30 % - 40% saving. TBF probably at least half of that was probably due to a newer more efficient boiler . Remember the main part of your gas bill is heating and that bit of a system and combi boiler are the same . Its the HW side of a combi that saves money (no need to heat a tankful ,just what you need ).

I would suspect your new house is better insulated , or maybe a newer boiler has led to your lower bills ? Boiler efficiency has increased from 65% to 90% in the last 10 -12 years .

Must admit I'm a bit worried as to your statement "ask any self respecting plumber" . I know exactly what the answer would be unless you have a large house with at least 5 or 6 people living there . I did (asked several in fact) and that was the answer I got from them all . Maybe you need to find a "real" self respecting plumber for advice should you be thinking of replacing your boiler at any point .
Edited by: "rogparki" 14th Sep
deleted90213914/09/2019 19:12

Opposite experience for me - had a system boiler then changed (same house …Opposite experience for me - had a system boiler then changed (same house 3 bed semi) to a combi = 30 % - 40% saving. TBF probably at least half of that was probably due to a newer more efficient boiler . Remember the main part of your gas bill is heating and that bit of a system and combi boiler are the same . Its the HW side of a combi that saves money (no need to heat a tankful ,just what you need ).I would suspect your new house is better insulated , or maybe a newer boiler has led to your lower bills ? Boiler efficiency has increased from 65% to 90% in the last 10 -12 years .Must admit I'm a bit worried as to your statement "ask any self respecting plumber" . I know exactly what the answer would be unless you have a large house with at least 5 or 6 people living there . I did (asked several in fact) and that was the answer I got from them all . Maybe you need to find a "real" self respecting plumber for advice should you be thinking of replacing your boiler at any point .


We moved from from combi boiler which was about 5 years old to system boiler which was 16 years old (was still running fine). Upgraded this to latest Valliant and very happy with the set up plus even more saving with more efficient equipment.
As for combi vs system boiler OP should just google it and come up with own conclusions, all I can say I would NEVER recomend combi to family house.
senukas14/09/2019 19:36

We moved from from combi boiler which was about 5 years old to system …We moved from from combi boiler which was about 5 years old to system boiler which was 16 years old (was still running fine). Upgraded this to latest Valliant and very happy with the set up plus even more saving with more efficient equipment. As for combi vs system boiler OP should just google it and come up with own conclusions, all I can say I would NEVER recomend combi to family house.



Sounds like you believed your "self respecting plumber" . He probably is right if there are 6+ people in a large house . Remember the CH part of a combi is exactly the same as a system boiler so no savings there. Effectively the only difference is a system boiler heats a tankful of water which can be more efficient as a housefull of people do more washing , washing up bathing etc, and maybe want to do it at the same time (the only disadvantage of a combi ) . In a small household (5 people or less) the most efficient boiler is a combi .

A system boiler is probably right for you in a large house - 2 bathrooms ,a cloakroom , a kitchen - so that's at least 8 hot water outlets , a combi would struggle if more than 3 were used at once .

Sadly the majority of us don't live in 4 bedroom multiple bathroom houses - so it isn't one size fits all .
deleted90213914/09/2019 20:06

Sounds like you believed your "self respecting plumber" . He …Sounds like you believed your "self respecting plumber" . He probably is right if there are 6+ people in a large house . Remember the CH part of a combi is exactly the same as a system boiler so no savings there. Effectively the only difference is a system boiler heats a tankful of water which can be more efficient as a housefull of people do more washing , washing up bathing etc, and maybe want to do it at the same time (the only disadvantage of a combi ) . In a small household (5 people or less) the most efficient boiler is a combi .A system boiler is probably right for you in a large house - 2 bathrooms ,a cloakroom , a kitchen - so that's at least 8 hot water outlets , a combi would struggle if more than 3 were used at once . Sadly the majority of us don't live in 4 bedroom multiple bathroom houses - so it isn't one size fits all .


Many houses on my road have changed their a few bedrooms to en-suite. I've seen the floor plans when they put house on sale after. If you think of how long you will spend in your bedroom and how long in the bathroom it's silly wasting so much space. The bedrooms become L shaped. I'm not making any en-suite. If I did it would be and extension to the house.
I would look into further before investing into a combi system. For a 4 bedroom house I would agree that a system boiler is more suitable especially if there is a possibility of a extension in the future. Down side to a combi is that it can only function hot water or heating at any one time. Also the hot water is on demand. You also have a option of changing your hot water tank to a indirect tank. That will allow you to keep the system as it is but take away the tanks in the loft and give you mains pressure hot water without the need for pumps. I would suggest this would be the better route and a lot cheaper then a upgrade to a combi. Tanks are around £500 to buy and around £200 - £300 to fit. I would only suggest a combi boiler if you needed the space as they are good space savers. I'm also not sure if the cost on saving gas would be a saving on the overall installation cost :/ mrcentralheating.co.uk/blo…ler
Good place to buy and find installers. Good idea would be to know which boiler you wanted first.
deleted90213914/09/2019 18:07

Don't need a pump with a combi , it has its own integral pump .



Most combis only have pumps to pump the central heating water around. It has no function on increasing the hot water flow. A few do come with hot water pumps but only certain models.
Gravity hot (with tanks) can run a thermostatic shower... mine runs an Aqualisa - with the low pressure valve body and a cold water tank feed.

The problem if the shower head is ceiling mounted (and upstairs or in a bungalow) is there would be a much lower head than for a wall mounted position.

In my case, the head height was increased by a clever plumber mounting the feed tank on a platform as high as it could go in the loft... pretty much doubling the height between shower head and tank.
Post a comment
Avatar
@
    Text

    Discussions

    Top Merchants