car accident help plz!!!

117
Found 24th Feb 2016
I'm not sure if I can even post this here, so please expire if irrelevant. I need some advice. I lent my friend my car to borrow ( stupid I know, but in hindsight ) and she had an accident on the motorway. circumstances were that she was in the right hand lane third party in middle and third party tried to get into her lane but we're too close hence crash. my car is damaged but cosmetically paintwork etc although the wheel looks disturbed. on the other hand their car is caved in from the back passenger. bare in mind my car was an BMW m4 and theirs a vauxhall corsa. initially they apologised and admitted fault saying they didn't judge it well, they also said they would not want to go through insurance so they swapped details etc with my friend claiming they'd call the following day with a settlement. no call from them but their insurance called denying liability and claiming that my friend was at fault because she was speeding and didn't see them. the question is can this go through my insurance since my friend has none. Obviously my insurance company will be made aware of the truth (lies lead to more lies etc etc) but does my friend having no insurance mean that I will be held liable? there is also a witness who saw everything we have his details, he said there was no way that could have been avoided only by them not trying to overtake and continuing in the middle lane. Any help would be appreciated since I do not know what happens now. I have certainly learnt my lesson no more Mrs nice guy because this could have ended very tragically had someone got hurt and regardless of legal blame I would not be able to live with myself.

thankyou in advance and of course if deleted I'll continue looking through the net.
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117 Comments
Your friend had no insurance and you lent them a high performance sports car in which they were speeding and were in a crash, I am quite shocked.

I am guessing at some point the police will be involved. Your friend could probably get a driving ban, hopefully your friend at least has a driving license?

You have no claim on your insurance because the policy didn't cover your friend to drive.
zarina. your friend not having issuance not only means you are liable (because the car is not allowed on the road without issuance) but it is illegal which will result in you taking likely 6 points and possibly community service. I'm not judging but to allow someone to borrow your cart under illegal circumstances is more than stupid. accept liability and how the police don't get involved. BTW I'm a solicitor so I know how this works
Yes be fined for no insurance driving

people can drive ur car usually 3rd party with your permission if ur fully comp and got this in your policy

By the sounds of this you let your friend drive your car knowing full well that they didn't have insurance?

Correct me if I am wrong or are they covered by your insurance policy. Each policy is different so you would need to check yours.
Also if you willingly lent your car to someone and didn't check they had insurance you will also receive points and a fine as well as the driver.
^^^^ exactly - and expect the third parties insurer to recover their losses directly from you. Plus, you will have to pay for your own repairs on top.

This is going to be a very costly lesson. I would also be surprised if the police didnt issue you with a minimum £200 fine plus 5 points on your licence.

Also, remember that you will lose your NCB and also an increase in premiums due to the 5 points.

How could you have been so stupid to let someone drive your car without insurance?
Edited by: "chocci" 24th Feb 2016
adamsedge

..people can drive ur car usually 3rd party with your permission if ur … ..people can drive ur car usually 3rd party with your permission if ur fully comp and got this in your policy


Thats not right. The driver has to have cover on their own insurance to drive other cars with TPFT cover.
davewave

Your friend had no insurance and you lent them a high performance sports … Your friend had no insurance and you lent them a high performance sports car in which they were speeding and were in a crash, I am quite shocked.I am guessing at some point the police will be involved. Your friend could probably get a driving ban, hopefully your friend at least has a driving license?You have no claim on your insurance because the policy didn't cover your friend to drive.



​she has a licence but although you have stated the obvious from what I have read ( obviously I'm unsure hence why I am asking) the insurance is on the car I. e if your car was stolen involved in a crash you would be liable. as far as the speeding issue goes it's speculative, after having BMW have a look the circumstances were confirmed by them, basically if it were speeding then the third party car would be hit from behind not side. if it was me driving I would have no issues but because it was her I am worried. I have spoken to accident claims companies and they have all said that in cases like this the highway code is implemented and in motorway driving you only overtake when it is safe to do so. I don't doubt the validity of my friends claim but it's whether insurance will continue the case. there is so much confusion for example BMW side the claim would be through my insurance since I'm the owner/keeper of the car, they didn't even ask whether the driver was insured.
adamsedge

Yes be fined for no insurance drivingpeople can drive ur car usually 3rd … Yes be fined for no insurance drivingpeople can drive ur car usually 3rd party with your permission if ur fully comp and got this in your policy



I thought it was the other way around, usually the main holder of an insurance policy can drive anybody else’s car (with permission of course) insured by their own insurance cover but under third party cover.

The important bit is that the other person is the main driver, not a named driver, and it has nothing to do with the car owners existing insurance policy.

It’s usually only very specialist insurance policies that allow anybody to drive the car under their insurance and that isn't all too common, and I think more often found on insurance companies for the older generations incase they get taken sick/unable to drive back for whatever reason. For example my neighbour who is quite elderly has an insurance policy that allows anyone (with a driving license of course) whether they have their own car/insurance or not to drive their car and it doesn’t have to be pre-arranged or notified, but it is very rare to have that, and it definitely is not standard on car insurance policies.

Edited by: "Gynx" 24th Feb 2016
I would contact the guilty party's insurer again. it makes no difference whether you are insured or not to them. Nor that they say you were speeding, they cannot prove what speed you or anyone else was going. You have a witness who can back you up. The damage on the cars should also back up what your friend says. Be strong with them and stand your ground. The guilty party still has a duty of care to drive safely and avoid accidents. If you get nowhere with them, do you have legal protection on your policy for uninsured loses?, if so try them, your insurer can put you in touch with them. If the police are involved what they do is a different matter to the insurance side.
could you not just claim that you was driving?
Edited by: "jfoxon" 24th Feb 2016
adamsedge

Yes be fined for no insurance drivingpeople can drive ur car usually 3rd … Yes be fined for no insurance drivingpeople can drive ur car usually 3rd party with your permission if ur fully comp and got this in your policy



Wildly inaccurate.
jfoxon

could you not just claim that you was driving?



A little too late, and could land the OP in even more hot water. Terrible advice.
Does your friend have any insurance cover on any car? If so they may be covered TPFT on your car.

If not then I think you are going to have to say that your friend took your car without your consent to stand any chance of avoiding a fine and getting your car repaired.
Edited by: "paul123edwards" 24th Feb 2016
The only liability in this accident is with you as your vehicle shouldnt have been on the road at all thus preventing the accident, irrespective of the corsas actions. Unfortunately youre going to learn a pretty harsh lesson with the law book being thrown at you and possibly more expensive insurance going forward due to points and possible convictions coupled with no NCB and thats if the insurance company dont void your insurance as that will go against you going forward. Slap on your forehead moment in this case.
miikeyblue

Wildly inaccurate.


Obviously this is true when your peddling a go kart around
paul123edwards

If not then I think you are going to have to say that your friend took … If not then I think you are going to have to say that your friend took your car without your consent to stand any chance of avoiding a fine and getting your car repaired.



The OP is going to have to tell the truth, not make up lies.
paul123edwards

Does your friend have any insurance cover on any car? If so they may be … Does your friend have any insurance cover on any car? If so they may be covered TPFT on your car.If not then I think you are going to have to say that your friend took your car without your consent to stand any chance of avoiding a fine and getting your car repaired.


This opens a can of legal worms as the insurance will want a full police report and conviction. Then the insurance will take their friend to court to recover monies.
paul123edwards

Does your friend have any insurance cover on any car? If so they may be … Does your friend have any insurance cover on any car? If so they may be covered TPFT on your car.If not then I think you are going to have to say that your friend took your car without your consent to stand any chance of avoiding a fine and getting your car repaired.



Again, terrible advice. If they're really a "friend" they'll probably not want to land their mate in jail, and possibly themself for attempting to pervert the course of justice if they get found out.
Really quite amazed by the idiocy of some people in this thread.
miikeyblue

Really quite amazed by the idiocy of some people in this thread.


Just hate to think theyre driving next tom me on motorway with that mindset. Scary.
zainarafiq

​she has a licence but although you have stated the obvious from what I h … ​she has a licence but although you have stated the obvious from what I have read ( obviously I'm unsure hence why I am asking) the insurance is on the car I. e if your car was stolen involved in a crash you would be liable. as far as the speeding issue goes it's speculative, after having BMW have a look the circumstances were confirmed by them, basically if it were speeding then the third party car would be hit from behind not side. if it was me driving I would have no issues but because it was her I am worried. I have spoken to accident claims companies and they have all said that in cases like this the highway code is implemented and in motorway driving you only overtake when it is safe to do so. I don't doubt the validity of my friends claim but it's whether insurance will continue the case. there is so much confusion for example BMW side the claim would be through my insurance since I'm the owner/keeper of the car, they didn't even ask whether the driver was insured.


the fact remains the car had no insurance so without doubt, the other car will win any claim for damages and you will be personally liable for your damages, the other cars repairs, loss of NCB, increased premiums due to the claim and points, and a police fine for no insurance. She will get prosecuted too of course.
You're stupid for letting your friend borrow your car with out insurance and your friend is even stupider for driving without insurance.

Your insurance will probably cover the third party but your friend could be prosecuted and the insurance may seek to recover the cost/s from you.

I don't think you will be as it's your friends responsibility to make sure she is legal to drive.
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deleted79467
jfoxon

could you not just claim that you was driving?


wow and the witness to this accident will have to join in this conspiracy
I'm lost!
To the OP - have you checked your policy as to what it says regarding insurance cover for other drivers? Does it say ONLY you are covered? Does it say ANY driver (fully comp or third party). Your original question only said your friend had no insurance which I took to mean in their own right.
uk.answers.yahoo.com/que…94h. no one has mentioned that insurance follows the car not the driver. I wish their was more accurate info. if this link is correct then I am OK. kendal thankyou for the advice. exactly my sentiments and after reading the highway code you should only move when safe to do so. mirror signal manoeuvre. gstar87 I don't see why I should lie down and accept responsibility for something that even another motorist said was stupid. the damage correlates directly to the third party trying to "push in". I made an error in judgement by lending her the car however anyone could have been in those circumstances. I have seen multiple drivers especially on the motorway leaving the tiniest of gaps and squeezing in, and unfortunately if you are ever being one of these pusher-shovers and hit them from behind ( not because you are speeding!! but because they shoved in an left little distance causing you to brake and hit them) you are automatically liable. in one sense I am lucky that the car was hit from the side showing they moved into the right hand lane. jfoxon I am too scared that would be one fat lie and I couldn't carry it on for long plus I strongly believe insurance companies have lie detector systems in place. regardless of how bad a situation is I believe honesty is the best policy no matter the consequences, at least I'll have learnt a very harsh life lesson. do not help no one.
I cannot believe someone would lend a £50k+ car to someone with them having no insurance (and a HIGH) performance one at that.

Insurance companies are VERY WELL KNOWN to not want to pay out for whatever minimal reason they can find...

You however gave them a BIG reason not to payout!

This is going to be a very costly lesson for you, and thats before the other party also claim personal injury damages from the accident (which you have no insurance to protect you against either).
shauneco

You're stupid for letting your friend borrow your car with out insurance … You're stupid for letting your friend borrow your car with out insurance and your friend is even stupider for driving without insurance.Your insurance will probably cover the third party but your friend could be prosecuted and the insurance may seek to recover the cost/s from you.I don't think you will be as it's your friends responsibility to make sure she is legal to drive.


I would be amazed if the insurance paid out for the third party- the car was being driven illegally

Edited by: "chocci" 24th Feb 2016
If your friend had no insurance then her and yourself are responible regardless

If however she was covered by your insurance or third party from a policy of her own then thats different
chocci

I would be amazed if the insurance paid out for the third party- the car … I would be amazed if the insurance paid out for the third party- the car was being illegally and not even by the insured driver.



I read it somewhere, I can't remember where, I could be wrong though on that part.
zainarafiq

https://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100506095558AAhr94h. no … https://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100506095558AAhr94h. no one has mentioned that insurance follows the car not the driver. I wish their was more accurate info. if this link is correct then I am OK. kendal thankyou for the advice. exactly my sentiments and after reading the highway code you should only move when safe to do so. mirror signal manoeuvre. gstar87 I don't see why I should lie down and accept responsibility for something that even another motorist said was stupid. the damage correlates directly to the third party trying to "push in". I made an error in judgement by lending her the car however anyone could have been in those circumstances. I have seen multiple drivers especially on the motorway leaving the tiniest of gaps and squeezing in, and unfortunately if you are ever being one of these pusher-shovers and hit them from behind ( not because you are speeding!! but because they shoved in an left little distance causing you to brake and hit them) you are automatically liable. in one sense I am lucky that the car was hit from the side showing they moved into the right hand lane. jfoxon I am too scared that would be one fat lie and I couldn't carry it on for long plus I strongly believe insurance companies have lie detector systems in place. regardless of how bad a situation is I believe honesty is the best policy no matter the consequences, at least I'll have learnt a very harsh life lesson. do not help no one.



Insurance generally follows the driver. I am insured to drive my car and others. My wife is not insured to drive my car, and her doing so would be against the law.

I think you need to face up to the fact you could be in a fair bit of trouble. Don't attempt to manipulate the facts when dealing with police or your insurers, you'll only make it worse.
I cant tell whether this is a joke or not......
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deleted79467
zainarafiq

https://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100506095558AAhr94h. no … https://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100506095558AAhr94h. no one has mentioned that insurance follows the car not the driver. I wish their was more accurate info. if this link is correct then I am OK. kendal thankyou for the advice. exactly my sentiments and after reading the highway code you should only move when safe to do so. mirror signal manoeuvre. gstar87 I don't see why I should lie down and accept responsibility for something that even another motorist said was stupid. the damage correlates directly to the third party trying to "push in". I made an error in judgement by lending her the car however anyone could have been in those circumstances. I have seen multiple drivers especially on the motorway leaving the tiniest of gaps and squeezing in, and unfortunately if you are ever being one of these pusher-shovers and hit them from behind ( not because you are speeding!! but because they shoved in an left little distance causing you to brake and hit them) you are automatically liable. in one sense I am lucky that the car was hit from the side showing they moved into the right hand lane. jfoxon I am too scared that would be one fat lie and I couldn't carry it on for long plus I strongly believe insurance companies have lie detector systems in place. regardless of how bad a situation is I believe honesty is the best policy no matter the consequences, at least I'll have learnt a very harsh life lesson. do not help no one.



why not check your insurance policy rather than random info on the internet ?
zainarafiq

https://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100506095558AAhr94h. no … https://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100506095558AAhr94h. no one has mentioned that insurance follows the car not the driver. I wish their was more accurate info. if this link is correct then I am OK. kendal thankyou for the advice. exactly my sentiments and after reading the highway code you should only move when safe to do so. mirror signal manoeuvre. gstar87 I don't see why I should lie down and accept responsibility for something that even another motorist said was stupid. the damage correlates directly to the third party trying to "push in". I made an error in judgement by lending her the car however anyone could have been in those circumstances. I have seen multiple drivers especially on the motorway leaving the tiniest of gaps and squeezing in, and unfortunately if you are ever being one of these pusher-shovers and hit them from behind ( not because you are speeding!! but because they shoved in an left little distance causing you to brake and hit them) you are automatically liable. in one sense I am lucky that the car was hit from the side showing they moved into the right hand lane. jfoxon I am too scared that would be one fat lie and I couldn't carry it on for long plus I strongly believe insurance companies have lie detector systems in place. regardless of how bad a situation is I believe honesty is the best policy no matter the consequences, at least I'll have learnt a very harsh life lesson. do not help no one.



The third party could argue that your uninsured friend moved into the middle lane all the same, It would cause a similar amount of damaged etc.. The fact is your friend was uninsured and you voluntarily allowed her the use of your car.

If she had a fully comp insurance policy on another car she may be covered, Usually it is third party only though so you would still lose out.

What you should of done is added your friend as a named driver, You won't win your case.
Here is my view on the insurance part.

I. Insurance will only cover the proposer to drive unless you specify anyone over the age of 21 or 25 etc. Or that you specify ANYONE can drive, or even specifed him/her as a named driver. If you did that when you took out the insurance then your friend is legally able to drive your car provided he/she meets the above criteria and has a FULL VALID UK LICENCE.
2. If your friend has insurance on his/her own car, they can look at their own policy to see if they are allowed to drive any other car with owners permission of course but this will be TPFT only.

If neither of the above statements are true. Then you both are in for a world of hurt and in my personal opinion, deserve anything that happens regards to this.

The above is only what I interpret car insurance to be, I certainly could be wrong and if I am, am sure someone will correct me.

Edited by: "Deleteaccount" 24th Feb 2016
Unless you’re prepared to check your own insurance policy details, it’s fairly safe to say the following applies:

Your friend was not insured to drive.
She was illegally using a vehicle on the road.
You allowed her to illegally use a vehicle on the road she was not insured to use.

These all have serious repercussions for both you and your friend.


As for collision, damage claims etc.
Your insurance company will not fight the other insurance company unless by some amazing luck your insurance policy covers other drivers that are not named and don’t have to be notified. (Rare).

Can an uninsured driver claim against somebody else at fault? Technically, I think they can since you don’t need an insurance company to put a claim in, but you/she will have to fight your own battle with the third parties insurance company, some claim management firms will do this for you, providing witnesses, damage reports etc and I guess they’d fight it all the way to court.



It's a big mess. You need to start reading through your policy documents now, everything else is pointless.
I think you should stop talking to anyone and delete this thread right now. Have a read of your insurance policy.

Unlike other countries, the car insurance in the UK is on the driver, not the car. So each driver needs to have their own car insurance for any car they wish to drive. If your friends has fully comp insurance, their policy may cover them Third party to drive other cars, although I highly doubt this as I am assuming she is under 25 years old.

Meanwhile, if she was NOT insured to drive your M4 at the time of accident, then I'm afraid you have committed a criminal offence. Please read up the facts from Government website and reliable sources, not a childish website like Yahoo Answers.
You can't claim on your own insurance as she is not a named driver and you weren't the driver at the time. In truth she is responsible for the accident as she was illegally on the road at the time.
It also doesn't matter if the driver of the corsa admitted fault as its the insurance companies that pay for the damages and will try to fight liability.
Best thing to do is take the loss and move on or approach a claim company and ask them to deal with the claim for your friend. That way they will deal direct with the third party insurer and normally bypass your own insurer, being the fact your friend had no insurance. This will need to be done by your friend. Also the payments will go to her if she wins or any costs if she loses.
I wouldn't mention the fact that you knew she had no insurance as it puts you in it to as you gave the car knowingly.
Very likely this will go 50/50 if won as its very hard to prove who's at fault regarding who's at fault in side swipes on the motorway.
But as I said above fix your own car learn and move on. If she's a good friend she would just pay for the damage. Is she really a good friend ?
OP, where is your vehicle at present - in your possession or in the possession of the Police?
zainarafiq

​she has a licence but although you have stated the obvious from what I h … ​she has a licence but although you have stated the obvious from what I have read ( obviously I'm unsure hence why I am asking) the insurance is on the car I. e if your car was stolen involved in a crash you would be liable. as far as the speeding issue goes it's speculative, after having BMW have a look the circumstances were confirmed by them, basically if it were speeding then the third party car would be hit from behind not side. if it was me driving I would have no issues but because it was her I am worried. I have spoken to accident claims companies and they have all said that in cases like this the highway code is implemented and in motorway driving you only overtake when it is safe to do so. I don't doubt the validity of my friends claim but it's whether insurance will continue the case. there is so much confusion for example BMW side the claim would be through my insurance since I'm the owner/keeper of the car, they didn't even ask whether the driver was insured.



Surely the owner of the car cant be responsible if he reports the car stolen and it is subsequently involved in a crash - why would you think that?

In any case you didn't report the car as stolen you lent it to your freind so that ship has sailed even if someone wanted to be dishonest with the insurance company.

BTW if people are telling you to deceive the insurance company then I would be very careful, Insurance companies have small margins and investigate suspicious cases and in some cases people committing fraud can end up in prison!

I imagine that you will need to attest to who was driving the car at the time of the accident.

If someone is speeding then you cant blame the person entering the lane, I imagine a BMW M4 can accelerate and surprise someone who was safely entering a lane in a relatively slow Corsa.

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