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    Education the strongest indicator of voting to Leave the EU.

    The level of education had a higher correlation with the voting pattern than any other major demographic measure from the census

    180 Comments

    Original Poster

    bbc.co.uk/new…034

    The BBC has obtained a more localised breakdown of votes from nearly half of the local authorities which counted EU referendum ballots last June.
    This information provides much greater depth and detail in explaining the pattern of how the UK voted. The key findings are:
    The data confirms previous indications that local results were strongly associated with the educational attainment of voters - populations with lower qualifications were significantly more likely to vote Leave. (The data for this analysis comes from one in nine wards)
    The level of education had a higher correlation with the voting pattern than any other major demographic measure from the census
    The age of voters was also important, with older electorates more likely to choose Leave
    Ethnicity was crucial in some places, with ethnic minority areas generally more likely to back Remain. However this varied, and in parts of London some Asian populations were more likely to support Leave
    The combination of education, age and ethnicity accounts for the large majority of the variation in votes between different places
    Across the country and in many council districts we can point out stark contrasts between localities which most favoured Leave or Remain
    There was a broad pattern in several urban areas of deprived, predominantly white, housing estates towards the urban periphery voting Leave, while inner cities with high numbers of ethnic minorities and/or students voted Remain
    Around 270 locations can be identified where the local outcome was in the opposite direction to the broader official counting area, including parts of Scotland which backed Leave and a Cornwall constituency which voted Remain
    Postal voters appear narrowly more likely to have backed Remain than those who voted in a polling station


    One more time for old time's sake. X)

    I can see this thread going downhill quickly.

    I voted remain but the most successful and well educated person i know voted leave.

    Pretty irrelevant now, it's in the government's hands.

    Anyone that regrets doing too little to sway the vote their way before the referendum only have themselves to blame, no matter how much they try to blame others.

    People are sick of educated people, people who read, and experts, nowadays. They prefer non-thinking, shouting, angry thoughts and shiny things.

    Original Poster

    CoeK

    I can see this thread going downhill quickly.I voted remain but the most … I can see this thread going downhill quickly.I voted remain but the most successful and well educated person i know voted leave.



    If someone chooses to be offended then that's their choice, but this is a story in the national press and will be of interest to many.

    Of course there will be a number of individuals who don't conform as there are in all things.

    HotEnglishAndWelshDeals

    If someone chooses to be offended then that's their choice, but this is a … If someone chooses to be offended then that's their choice, but this is a story in the national press and will be of interest to many.Of course there will be a number of individuals who don't conform as there are in all things.



    I think we both know there is only one way this post will go and it won't be in the direction of reasonable discourse and enjoyable debate.

    It's been done to death on here in my opinion and i haven't even been posting here that long.

    Original Poster

    CoeK

    I think we both know there is only one way this post will go and it won't … I think we both know there is only one way this post will go and it won't be in the direction of reasonable discourse and enjoyable debate.It's been done to death on here in my opinion and i haven't even been posting here that long.



    I understand that, but I think it's also fair to say that Brexit is a defining point in British history and it split the country down the middle.

    A lot of people with a sense of curiosity will want to know why that was. This is part of that discussion and it makes some sense.

    HotEnglishAndWelshDeals

    I understand that, but I think it's also fair to say that Brexit is a … I understand that, but I think it's also fair to say that Brexit is a defining point in British history and it split the country down the middle.A lot of people with a sense of curiosity will want to know why that was. This is part of that discussion and it makes some sense.



    Well good luck then

    I was going to post this on here earlier and then decided that it would be utterly pointless.

    this should be entertaining.

    Read the article through, and you will quickly see the analysis is flawed and the reporting bias. The areas of concentration in the article taken to prove their point has been cherry picked, and the 'educated/race' areas mutually exclusive.

    One of the areas mentioned in the article, which has the third highest concentration of Remain votes also has poor education levels, however the article only mentions that the area has a high portion of ethnic minorities, deftly avoiding the 'education' argument.

    I could probably pick 20 areas of the UK carefully, and create an analysis that is the complete opposite of what the author of the article mentioned. Totally daft!

    HotEnglishAndWelshDeals

    If someone chooses to be offended then that's their choice, but this is a … If someone chooses to be offended then that's their choice, but this is a story in the national press and will be of interest to many.Of course there will be a number of individuals who don't conform as there are in all things.



    ​polls are a waste of time (like this thread) as usual baiting people.

    Original Poster

    shadey12

    this should be entertaining.



    It's hardly going to surprise. Some will question the source, some will provide anecdotal evidence to the contrary but most will probably see that it makes sense.

    The conclusions will be interesting. For me it suggests that Brexit is 52% of the country voting for something that the other 48% will have to make work, but also that not much will change.

    People who voted to leave voted for change yet change will only come through their own endeavour. If education is linked to attainment then those who were thriving pre-Brexit will continue to after Brexit.

    Original Poster

    jpxdude

    Read the article through, and you will quickly see the analysis is flawed … Read the article through, and you will quickly see the analysis is flawed and the reporting bias. The areas of concentration in the article taken to prove their point has been cherry picked, and the 'educated/race' areas mutually exclusive.One of the areas mentioned in the article, which has the third highest concentration of Remain votes also has poor education levels, however the article only mentions that the area has a high portion of ethnic minorities, deftly avoiding the 'education' argument.I could probably pick 20 areas of the UK carefully, and create an analysis that is the complete opposite of what the author of the article mentioned. Totally daft!



    You say it's bias (sic) but then point out that the article acknowledges anomalies in it's own findings. It states that education wasn't the only factor, but had the strongest correlation. As I've said, many will want to dispute this as it links education to voting patterns and people might not like that.

    But if you accept that immigration driving down wages for low-skilled work was one of the larger factors (if not the largest) then it makes sense. Of course that isn't palatable to a lot of people because it suggests that they might be responsible in some way for their lot in life.

    HotEnglishAndWelshDeals

    It's hardly going to surprise. Some will question the source, some will … It's hardly going to surprise. Some will question the source, some will provide anecdotal evidence to the contrary but most will probably see that it makes sense.The conclusions will be interesting. For me it suggests that Brexit is 52% of the country voting for something that the other 48% will have to make work, but also that not much will change. People who voted to leave voted for change yet change will only come through their own endeavour. If education is linked to attainment then those who were thriving pre-Brexit will continue to after Brexit.



    ​once again you are suggesting everyone can strive to and attain your claimed level of success.
    where you fail in all your observations, either intentionally or by a complete and total lack of understanding, is to realise not everyone is a clone of you in your utopian world.

    HotEnglishAndWelshDeals

    You say it's bias (sic) but then point out that the article acknowledges … You say it's bias (sic) but then point out that the article acknowledges anomalies in it's own findings. It states that education wasn't the only factor, but had the strongest correlation. As I've said, many will want to dispute this as it links education to voting patterns and people might not like that.But if you accept that immigration driving down wages for low-skilled work was one of the larger factors (if not the largest) then it makes sense. Of course that isn't palatable to a lot of people because it suggests that they might be responsible in some way for their lot in life.



    That's what I mean about it being cherry picked and mutually exclusive though. There are areas with high concentrations of ethnic minorities that voted for Brexit that were glossed over in the article (areas around Southall and Ealing), and also areas considered to have 'high education standards'.

    Drawing dodgy analysis from cherry picked samplings of voting constituencies out of 650 is as accurate as the Brexit poll was!

    Original Poster

    shadey12

    ​once again you are suggesting everyone can strive to and attain your c … ​once again you are suggesting everyone can strive to and attain your claimed level of success.where you fail in all your observations, either intentionally or by a complete and total lack of understanding, is to realise not everyone is a clone of you in your utopian world.



    I'm not suggesting that. I actually think hard work is the greatest factor in success, both in work but also in education. So level of educational attainment isn't simply a factor of being born smarter than others, it's about putting in the hard work in the library and revising.

    36% of the highly educated 18-24 year olds couldn't be bothered to get out of bed . So you could argue brexit won because the young and intelligent were too lazy to vote .

    Original Poster

    plodging

    36% of the highly educated 18-24 year olds couldn't be bothered to get … 36% of the highly educated 18-24 year olds couldn't be bothered to get out of bed . So you could argue brexit won because the young and intelligent were too lazy to vote .



    Absolutely you could.

    HotEnglishAndWelshDeals

    You say it's bias (sic) but then point out that the article acknowledges … You say it's bias (sic) but then point out that the article acknowledges anomalies in it's own findings. It states that education wasn't the only factor, but had the strongest correlation. As I've said, many will want to dispute this as it links education to voting patterns and people might not like that.But if you accept that immigration driving down wages for low-skilled work was one of the larger factors (if not the largest) then it makes sense. Of course that isn't palatable to a lot of people because it suggests that they might be responsible in some way for their lot in life.



    ​I don't know anyone who this poll asked, I do know I have met people from quite a few religions, races and social classes who voted both ways, as been said to you many, many times before, a lot of people voted remain because they were called racist (amongst other things) because they were scared of what the remainers were telling them, because financially they would lose out.
    yet 52% still voted leave, something the op can't seem to get his head round, maybe a course in sociology would help understand other people do not think like he does.
    maybe the op just wants to stir up problems by having very divisive views, then insulting and generally denigrating other members.

    Original Poster

    shadey12

    ​I don't know anyone who this poll asked



    That's not a massive surprise. X)


    shadey12

    yet 52% still voted leave, something the op can't seem to get his head … yet 52% still voted leave, something the op can't seem to get his head round, maybe a course in sociology would help understand other people do not think like he does.



    I understand people don't always agree with me. As I've said before, Brexit was a surprise because I thought this country embodied different values.

    Ultimately it was a vote for change and I didn't realise so many people in this country felt their lives needed that. You and I disagree and we both know why that is.

    Why have you bolded the text in the OP? Are you trying to emphasise something?

    shadey12

    ​I don't know anyone who this poll asked, I do know I have met people f … ​I don't know anyone who this poll asked, I do know I have met people from quite a few religions, races and social classes who voted both ways, as been said to you many, many times before, a lot of people voted remain because they were called racist (amongst other things) because they were scared of what the remainers were telling them, because financially they would lose out.yet 52% still voted leave, something the op can't seem to get his head round, maybe a course in sociology would help understand other people do not think like he does.maybe the op just wants to stir up problems by having very divisive views, then insulting and generally denigrating other members.


    I know quite a few people who voted both Leave and Remain. Of the Remain voters, not a single one has ever made any mention of voting Remain because they were afraid of being called a racist. Most of them voted Remain because they felt that they and their children would be better off if the UK remained in the EU.

    Whereas, most of the Leave voters that I know tend to be older and, in most cases, did not go into further education after leaving school. Several of them definitely have borderline racist views and nearly all of them cited their main reason for voting Leave was something along the lines of 'foreigners have come here and taken our jobs and homes'.

    Perhaps we just move in different circles.

    shadey12

    ​I don't know anyone who this poll asked

    shadey12

    yet 52% still voted leave, something the op can't seem to get his head … yet 52% still voted leave, something the op can't seem to get his head round, maybe a course in sociology would help understand other people do not think like he does.



    ​straight in with the derogatory remarks clearly proving my post correct, well done, get yourself a gold star for effort, (even if you seem to be a one trick pony)

    RonChew

    I know quite a few people who voted both Leave and Remain. Of the Remain … I know quite a few people who voted both Leave and Remain. Of the Remain voters, not a single one has ever made any mention of voting Remain because they were afraid of being called a racist. Most of them voted Remain because they felt that they and their children would be better off if the UK remained in the EU.Whereas, most of the Leave voters that I know tend to be older and, in most cases, did not go into further education after leaving school. Several of them definitely have borderline racist views and nearly all of them cited their main reason for voting Leave was something along the lines of 'foreigners have come here and taken our jobs and homes'.Perhaps we just move in different circles.



    ​I'm surprised you mix with anyone with borderline racist views Ron. however you learn something new everyday.

    shadey12

    ​straight in with the derogatory remarks clearly proving my post correct, … ​straight in with the derogatory remarks clearly proving my post correct, well done, get yourself a gold star for effort, (even if you seem to be a one trick pony)



    I could be wrong but i don't think he was being derogatory when he said he wasn't surprised you didn't know anyone who this poll asked. Possibly more a comment on the fact it wasnt a poll?

    CoeK

    I could be wrong but i don't think he was being derogatory when he said … I could be wrong but i don't think he was being derogatory when he said he wasn't surprised you didn't know anyone who this poll asked. Possibly more a comment on the fact it wasnt a poll?



    ​trust me you haven't had any dealings with him.

    I agree that Brexit was divisive across the country, but the correlation in this article is a joke. I too was surprised by some of the results more local to where I live. I am in north London, in an area that has 60%+ ethnic minories, yet the vote was almost evenly split. The biggest anomalies for the area were actually mentioned in the article, but not the surrounding wards, which would skew the analysis.

    Original Poster

    shadey12

    ​I don't know anyone who this poll asked

    shadey12

    yet 52% still voted leave, something the op can't seem to get his head … yet 52% still voted leave, something the op can't seem to get his head round, maybe a course in sociology would help understand other people do not think like he does.

    jpxdude

    I agree that Brexit was divisive across the country, but the correlation … I agree that Brexit was divisive across the country, but the correlation in this article is a joke. I too was surprised by some of the results more local to where I live. I am in north London, in an area that has 60%+ ethnic minories, yet the vote was almost evenly split. The biggest anomalies for the area were actually mentioned in the article, but not the surrounding wards, which would skew the analysis.



    Which remark are you choosing to view as derogatory?




    London is always going to be somewhat anomalous but people were pointing out the correlation between education and vote months ago. You could also cite the town/city divide or look at established university cities to see a pattern.

    I also think one could understand why seeing a correlation between education and vote would be unappealing.

    HotEnglishAndWelshDeals

    Which remark are you choosing to view as derogatory?London is always … Which remark are you choosing to view as derogatory?London is always going to be somewhat anomalous but people were pointing out the correlation between education and vote months ago. You could also cite the town/city divide or look at established university cities to see a pattern.I also think one could understand why seeing a correlation between education and vote would be unappealing.



    ​why not go back and look at the factors that contributed to Thatcher winning in 79.
    argue and debate it until the cows come heawd, its democracy, its happened, try to learn to make the best of it, it just seems to be so much an obsession on your part that it consumes your life.
    Edited by: "shadey12" 6th Feb

    shadey12

    ​I'm surprised you mix with anyone with borderline racist views Ron. h … ​I'm surprised you mix with anyone with borderline racist views Ron. however you learn something new everyday.


    Why should that surprise you? Do you only mix with people who share your own views? That may, though, explain why you seem to take such exception to anyone expressing a different viewpoint to yours.

    Original Poster

    shadey12

    ​why not go back and look at the factors that contributed to Thatcher w … ​why not go back and look at the factors that contributed to Thatcher winning in 79.argue and debate it until the cows come heawd, its democracy, its happened, try to learn to make the best of it, it just seems to be so much an obsession on your part that it comes your life.



    The economy of this country is absolutely something I take great interest in because I rely on it for myself, but also I'm invested in the future of this country through my children. You may well not have those concerns and that's fine but to not understand why others may be 'obsessed' is odd in my opinion.

    You didn't say what remark you chose to find derogatory either.

    HotEnglishAndWelshDeals

    Which remark are you choosing to view as derogatory?London is always … Which remark are you choosing to view as derogatory?London is always going to be somewhat anomalous but people were pointing out the correlation between education and vote months ago. You could also cite the town/city divide or look at established university cities to see a pattern.I also think one could understand why seeing a correlation between education and vote would be unappealing.



    My argument is overall less about the education aspect, but more on race and ethnic minorities. It is hardly a surprise that the majority of Leave votes out of the big cities were from the disenfranchised white working class, many of which wouldn't have a degree.

    Original Poster

    jpxdude

    My argument is overall less about the education aspect, but more on race … My argument is overall less about the education aspect, but more on race and ethnic minorities. It is hardly a surprise that the majority of Leave votes out of the big cities were from the disenfranchised white working class, many of which wouldn't have a degree.



    Isn't that what I've been saying?

    jpxdude

    My argument is overall less about the education aspect, but more on race … My argument is overall less about the education aspect, but more on race and ethnic minorities. It is hardly a surprise that the majority of Leave votes out of the big cities were from the disenfranchised white working class, many of which wouldn't have a degree.



    ​thats basically what the link says.

    CoeK

    ​thats basically what the link says.



    This is why this thread is utterly pointless, as cdm22 mentioned in post #9

    The areas taken for analysis by the BBC are particularly egregious in pointing out the obvious. (click bait).

    shadey12

    ​polls are a waste of time (like this thread) as usual baiting people.


    Why have you started banging about polls ? these figures are from the voting

    but seeing as you have the pollsters got it wrong in 2015 because they had to many better educated'politically active
    younger votes and not enough older voters (70+) in their samples and to a lesser extent the same thing happened last year

    RonChew

    Why should that surprise you? Do you only mix with people who share your … Why should that surprise you? Do you only mix with people who share your own views? That may, though, explain why you seem to take such exception to anyone expressing a different viewpoint to yours.



    ​I'll take it that was a bit of a tongue in cheek comment, considering the attitude of the company you keep on hukd Ron.

    they assessed all voters and those voters were willing to state how they voted?

    Get used to it snowflakes!

    Some people disagree with you.

    But it doesn't mean those who disagree with you are stupid or racist (the argument of a 5 year old)

    but your inability to understand a variety of reasons and motivations which exist outside of your narrow mind does show the same type of poor reasoning that you accuse others of.

    Original Poster

    davewave

    they assessed all voters and those voters were willing to state how they … they assessed all voters and those voters were willing to state how they voted?



    No. It's quite simply explained in the article I linked to.


    davewave

    But it doesn't mean those who disagree with you are stupid or racist (the … But it doesn't mean those who disagree with you are stupid or racist (the argument of a 5 year old)



    No-one has said that.
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