Garage rip off

37
Found 31st Mar
Brakes failed on my wife's car, brake fluid pouring from the front offside wheel.

Pumping the brakes worked them enough to get it to the nearest garage - small backstreet garage.

They said they would take a look to diagnosis but it might not be that day, probably the next.

We said not a problem as we were in no rush.

They phoned that evening for the first time since we dropped it off and said it was sorted, and over £600

They had replaced all the brakes (pads and discs) on the entire car and a caliper.

No work was approved for the car, they are charging 100% markup on parts and 3 hours labour at 60ph+VAT

The back brakes were only 7k miles since last replacement and 2k miles since last MOT at Kwikfit where brakes front and back were recorded as good.

I have contacted Citizens Advice who have asked me to make a reasonable offer to the garage, or do a full charge back on my debit card.

Do you think a reasonable offer would be to charge me for all parts at cost plus 1.5hours labour at his rates?

This would be the equivalent of full refund of labour that wasn't approved, and he gets to keep the 100% markup on all parts (even the bits not needed)?

Or do you think that is too reasonable?

Although the parts didn't need to be replaced, I do recognise that there is a small amount of 'betterment' to the car for having new brakes all round.
Community Updates
  1. Ask
Groups
  1. Ask
37 Comments
The labour at 3 hours is relatively reasonable. Also a markup on parts is to be expected.

Though as none of it was authorised then I understand your dilemma. The mark up on the parts needs to be certainly cut out.
You also need to decide what the actual fault was. Looks like a calliper.

In that case the pads on that axle should have been changed at the same time, potentially discs depending on wear and fluid contamination. Was the calliper on the front or rear? If rear, did the previous garage damage it?

My offer would be parts at cost for the fixed axle brake by system plus proper labour. Then parts at cost and no labour for non-authorised axle.
if they did the work without your consent or any form of agreement, and thus wouldn't have to pay for it, if you feel morally obligated to pay something for it, find the exact parts they used and their costs plus the 90 minutes labor you suggested.
Original Poster
Oneday775 m ago

The labour at 3 hours is relatively reasonable. Also a markup on parts is …The labour at 3 hours is relatively reasonable. Also a markup on parts is to be expected. Though as none of it was authorised then I understand your dilemma. The mark up on the parts needs to be certainly cut out. You also need to decide what the actual fault was. Looks like a calliper. In that case the pads on that axle should have been changed at the same time, potentially discs depending on wear and fluid contamination. Was the calliper on the front or rear? If rear, did the previous garage damage it? My offer would be parts at cost for the fixed axle brake by system plus proper labour. Then parts at cost and no labour for non-authorised axle.


The caliper was on the front.

Are you suggesting they charge for all front parts without mark up and 1.5 hours labour?

This would mean an increase refund for me.

Would you put a 'betterment' value towards the rear brakes or not, they were not worn at all.
I think your offer is more than reasonable.

I am currently in a dispute as well. Bought a 2nd hand car from a trader/small dealer, with no recorded issues or mentioning of any issues. 2 days later engine light came on. I took it back it was with him for a week and he supposedly repaired it. Within 1 day the engine light had come back on. I asked for a refund and he said go to the small claims court. I stated my consumer rights, he didn't listen. I also called citizens advice. I got the car repaired by a mini garage at the cost of £1700 sent him all the evidence and the bill. I asked for 75% of the costs and now waiting to hear back before going to the small claims court. Unfortunately there are a lot of people looking to screw people over and make a quick buck.
I’d put the front down as 2h labour and parts at cost.
No labour on rear and parts at cost.

The front was the true problem. That with fitting a new calliper involved additional work bleeding the system etc. 30m a side on the rear is a fair estimate of time.

Basically you are looking to cover the parts where no one loses money and you keep them. And the garage takes blame on labour cutting out the work that was never required.
Original Poster
Oneday7724 m ago

I’d put the front down as 2h labour and parts at cost. No labour on rear a …I’d put the front down as 2h labour and parts at cost. No labour on rear and parts at cost. The front was the true problem. That with fitting a new calliper involved additional work bleeding the system etc. 30m a side on the rear is a fair estimate of time. Basically you are looking to cover the parts where no one loses money and you keep them. And the garage takes blame on labour cutting out the work that was never required.


In that scenario, I would still be losing out on the cost of parts on the rear. The garage would be making profit on the labour. Doesn't discourage dishonesty in the future does it?

Not saying you are wrong, thank you for your take on things, and you are only £36 different than my original suggestion.
Robj137 m ago

In that scenario, I would still be losing out on the cost of parts on the …In that scenario, I would still be losing out on the cost of parts on the rear. The garage would be making profit on the labour. Doesn't discourage dishonesty in the future does it?Not saying you are wrong, thank you for your take on things, and you are only £36 different than my original suggestion.


The way I see it the front work was required and probably would have taken 2 hours.
Yes the rear will cost you money but at the same time the only winner is the parts supplier. Though you gain betterment.
By all means push for more but this could be a good fall back Devil’s Advocate position

I am of course assume by the work charged was all done. Is there obvious new parts all round? If not then screw them to the wall
They should of quoted you a figure before they started the work.
Original Poster
Oneday7725 m ago

The way I see it the front work was required and probably would have taken …The way I see it the front work was required and probably would have taken 2 hours. Yes the rear will cost you money but at the same time the only winner is the parts supplier. Though you gain betterment. By all means push for more but this could be a good fall back Devil’s Advocate position I am of course assume by the work charged was all done. Is there obvious new parts all round? If not then screw them to the wall


Yes, clear to see all the parts quoted for have been fitted.

Original Poster
AW00797 m ago

They should of quoted you a figure before they started the work.


Absolutely, but what would your next step be when just presented with a bill without discussing doing any work on the car?
when changing pads all should be changed at the same time, and if you get fluid on a pad then it's junk - so that part is somewhat justified (though they should have asked)

don't know why they would change the discs though
They should have told you upfront what the problem was and asked if you wanted them to proceed. I can understand the need to change both pads on one axle as they really should be replaced in pairs but don't see the need to replace the discs or touch the rear axle without your go ahead. I think 3 hours labour is reasonable for replacing the caliper and front pads and discs but I wouldn't pay for any of the work done on the rear axle as you didn't request it. Offer them £300 tops.
Edited by: "jaketheplumber" 31st Mar
jaketheplumber13 m ago

They should have told you upfront what the problem was and asked if you …They should have told you upfront what the problem was and asked if you wanted them to proceed. I can understand the need to change both pads on one axle as they really should be replaced in pairs but don't see the need to replace the discs or touch the rear axle without your go ahead. I think 3 hours labour is reasonable for replacing the caliper and front pads and discs but I wouldn't pay for any of the work done on the rear axle as you didn't request it. Offer them £300 tops.


Also ask to see the pads they took off your car
First I would make sure they have done everything they claim to have done. Your probably in your rights not to pay them anything other than a diagnostic fee as you didn’t agree for any work to be carried out.
lisa4rob097 m ago

First I would make sure they have done everything they claim to have done. …First I would make sure they have done everything they claim to have done. Your probably in your rights not to pay them anything other than a diagnostic fee as you didn’t agree for any work to be carried out.



Agreed, you can often check the thickness of a brake pad without even removing the wheel, if they've been replaced they should be about 12mm thick.
summerof7614 m ago

Also ask to see the pads they took off your car



Good thinking, if the old ones were more than 3mm thick they could have been left alone.
Original Poster
jaketheplumber11 m ago

Good thinking, if the old ones were more than 3mm thick they could have …Good thinking, if the old ones were more than 3mm thick they could have been left alone.


The pads were easily 10mm+
Have you asked to see the old parts , especially the rears
Original Poster
Bradleigh3 m ago

Have you asked to see the old parts , especially the rears


Yes, discs not worn, pads on 10mm or more. They said they still needed changing due to some rust on the hub where the shoes touched. This was light surface rust.

Even if they were totally worn out, no permission was given to work on any part of the car, and the fault it was took in with was nothing to do with the rear of the vehicle.
How on earth does it go from we will have a look and let you know to here it is £600 please? And on top of that they have done work that didn’t even need doing.
As I see it they can take whatever you offer, which your being very reasonable with. If they don’t accept then just tell them to stick it.
Original Poster
lisa4rob095 m ago

How on earth does it go from we will have a look and let you know to here …How on earth does it go from we will have a look and let you know to here it is £600 please? And on top of that they have done work that didn’t even need doing.


Exactly, I am grateful they took it in - but I didn't expect it looked at that day, and didn't authorise any work, I certainly didn't expect the rear of the car messed with at all.
murtgurge3 h, 8 m ago

when changing pads all should be changed at the same time, and if you get …when changing pads all should be changed at the same time, and if you get fluid on a pad then it's junk - so that part is somewhat justified (though they should have asked)don't know why they would change the discs though


On the same axle yes, No need for the rears in the ops case.
Robj11 h, 47 m ago

Yes, discs not worn, pads on 10mm or more. They said they still needed …Yes, discs not worn, pads on 10mm or more. They said they still needed changing due to some rust on the hub where the shoes touched. This was light surface rust.Even if they were totally worn out, no permission was given to work on any part of the car, and the fault it was took in with was nothing to do with the rear of the vehicle.


This is complete nonsense, any car that's parked in wet weather will get rust on the hubs/discs. The more I hear about this, the more I'm convinced he's ripping you off.
Original Poster
So from what everyone is saying, asking for full return of labour costs and they keep the rest included markup on parts is more that reasonable.

I will go with that for my initial out of court settlement request.

If I have to take it to court, push for everything I am entitled to.
I think you're being far too generous, even if you get the labour charge back it's still costing you £400 or so.
bigtam19 h, 15 m ago

I think your offer is more than reasonable. I am currently in a dispute as …I think your offer is more than reasonable. I am currently in a dispute as well. Bought a 2nd hand car from a trader/small dealer, with no recorded issues or mentioning of any issues. 2 days later engine light came on. I took it back it was with him for a week and he supposedly repaired it. Within 1 day the engine light had come back on. I asked for a refund and he said go to the small claims court. I stated my consumer rights, he didn't listen. I also called citizens advice. I got the car repaired by a mini garage at the cost of £1700 sent him all the evidence and the bill. I asked for 75% of the costs and now waiting to hear back before going to the small claims court. Unfortunately there are a lot of people looking to screw people over and make a quick buck.


Should have bought the car on a credit card
This reminds me why I purchase a brand new £5995 dacia every 3 years, and then sell it for £3500 and replace with another brand new dacia, genuine manufacturers warranty, no mots, 3 years break down cover. Apart from one set of front tyres at 25 thousand miles and 2 services no other bills. Just over £900 a year depreciation but I know where I am and have peace of mind, plus avoid garages that would sell there own gran for a quick buck.

My neighbor purchased a Peugeot at 5k and 6 months later the cambelt snapped, bill was £2200 for recon engine, then a few months later clutch at £400. I think 2nd hand cars are a gamble as most warranties are not worth the paper there written on.
Edited by: "SOUTHWALES" 31st Mar
cliosport653 h, 0 m ago

Should have bought the car on a credit card


I don’t have a credit card but spoken to bank and should be able to do a charge back if not I’m likely to win in small claims court given how early on the issues occurred within 30days
SOUTHWALES5 h, 18 m ago

This reminds me why I purchase a brand new £5995 dacia every 3 years, and …This reminds me why I purchase a brand new £5995 dacia every 3 years, and then sell it for £3500 and replace with another brand new dacia, genuine manufacturers warranty, no mots, 3 years break down cover. Apart from one set of front tyres at 25 thousand miles and 2 services no other bills. Just over £900 a year depreciation but I know where I am and have peace of mind, plus avoid garages that would sell there own gran for a quick buck.My neighbor purchased a Peugeot at 5k and 6 months later the cambelt snapped, bill was £2200 for recon engine, then a few months later clutch at £400. I think 2nd hand cars are a gamble as most warranties are not worth the paper there written on.


You and your Dacias lol, Are you on commission?.
They shouldnt really have touched it at all imo dependant on how the initial conversation went with yourself and the garage

However if the caliper on the front was leaking correct way is change discs and pads also due to contamination. It would also be acceptable to clean them but this isnt the best way.

I would probably pay for fronts but as a garage owner i suggest you argue about the rear. I wouldnt have done any of the work without asking you first (dependant on the initial conversation with the customer) i put advisories on the invoice if anything else is noticed during repair
Original Poster
I will let you know how I get on over the next week or so!
SOUTHWALES21 h, 15 m ago

This reminds me why I purchase a brand new £5995 dacia every 3 years, and …This reminds me why I purchase a brand new £5995 dacia every 3 years, and then sell it for £3500 and replace with another brand new dacia, genuine manufacturers warranty, no mots, 3 years break down cover. Apart from one set of front tyres at 25 thousand miles and 2 services no other bills. Just over £900 a year depreciation but I know where I am and have peace of mind, plus avoid garages that would sell there own gran for a quick buck.My neighbor purchased a Peugeot at 5k and 6 months later the cambelt snapped, bill was £2200 for recon engine, then a few months later clutch at £400. I think 2nd hand cars are a gamble as most warranties are not worth the paper there written on.


Not this again you must have shares in dacia lol
The latest Dacia Duster is a very reasonably priced SUV and looks as good as most of its competitors that are twice the price or more.

dacia.co.uk/veh…tml
Original Poster
So... Tomorrow is the last day the garage have to accept my initial offer.

If they still refuse to accept the offer, I am changing the offer to paying for just the faulty caliper and fitting and that's it.

I will then take to small claims. I intend to follow this through fully.

The garage did contact me today asking if I could prove the price that I could have got the parts from Eurocarparts for - which I could, and it showed that he is charging me double the price for them.

I asked if he could provide a copy of the invoice for the price he is paid for the parts - he refused.
Best of luck to you.
Original Poster
jaketheplumber3 m ago

Best of luck to you.


Thanks, I need luck at the moment, the Climate Control has failed on the car now, won't cool at all.
Post a comment
Avatar
@
    Text

    Top Discussions

    Top Merchants