H & S. = Hysterical and Stupid ?

26
Found 19th Jan 2008
Pantomime gun must be registered


A Cornish village drama group has had to register a toy gun with the police to comply with health and safety rules.

Carnon Downs drama group in Cornwall have also had to keep their plastic cutlasses and wooden swords locked up for the pantomime, Robinson Crusoe.

Producers of the show called the Health and Safety Executive (HSE) rules "farcical".

A spokesman for the HSE said the rules were designed to make risks "sensibly managed".

he climax of the show is a fight in which actors use replica 4ft-foot long plastic cutlasses.

There is also a toy gun which produces a flag saying "Bang".

The directors contacted police after receiving advice from the HSE and the National Operatic and Dramatic Association.

The HSE have a page on their website called Entertainment Information Sheet 20 which lays down strict rules for the handling of guns, swords and other weapons on set.

Drama group co-director Linda Barker said: "The cutlasses count as weapons even though they are replicas and made of plastic and apparently they could be mistaken for real ones.

"Our only gun was a panto pistol which produces a flag with the word bang on it.

"Our local police at Truro were fantastic and they have registered the gun, the two plastic cutlasses and our six wooden swords."

She added: "It gets a bit farcical when you are dealing with plastic swords. It is not as if anyone is likely to be scared by them."

Neighbourhood beat officer Pc Nigel Hyde said: "We have been informed and made a note.

"It seems a bit unusual but other forms of replica weapons have been used to carry out crimes and the consequences have been serious."

A spokesman for the HSE said: "We do not want to stop people putting on pantos or having fun as long as the risks are sensible managed."

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26 Comments

Original Poster

There is also a toy gun which produces a flag saying "Bang"

http://www.lynchs.com/images/46.jpg

What a waste of time and paperwork,thats typical of police though.

Mum2Connor&Cerys;1474511

What a waste of time and paperwork,thats typical of police though.



Ummm..it wasn't the police. :thinking:

I read about this yesterday, its ridiculous.

The way in which they have to safely store it is totally OTT

Not only that, but because of health and safety regulations they have had … Not only that, but because of health and safety regulations they have had to promise to keep the pretend cutlasses under lock and key when they are not being used.Carnon Downs Drama Group has also had to promise that it has made adequate safety arrangements for the toy swords and that the person named to the police as being responsible for the 'weapons' accompanies them whenever they are moved.The swords must be kept in a secure case and stored in a locked room with restricted access.

Is it quite as ridiculous as it seems at first glance? Well maybe so and maybe not.
If the gun and other stuff look real and I suppose they do otherwise the climax of the show would be a bit useless (fighting with obviously toy weapons!!) then there is a H&S side to it. In the wrong hands, replica weapons could be used for criminal purposes. It seems very sensible for the police to know where replica weapons are - might reduce the chance of someone with a replica, being shot by them for one thing. Sounds far-fetched but what about the day after the show finishes, a model citizen spots someone taking a sword/gun out of the car - would look sus?? Also plenty of robberies take place where there's a replica gun involved. You might say - but that's not going to happen in this case; this is taking things too far - but why should the drama group have the law disapplied for them?

Why would fighting with obvious toy guns and weapons be useless this is PANTO the whole point of which is farce!

To me it seems the HSE are handling this farce about face.

chesso;1475215

Is it quite as ridiculous as it seems at first glance? Well maybe so and … Is it quite as ridiculous as it seems at first glance? Well maybe so and maybe not. If the gun and other stuff look real and I suppose they do otherwise the climax of the show would be a bit useless (fighting with obviously toy weapons!!) then there is a H&S side to it. In the wrong hands, replica weapons could be used for criminal purposes. It seems very sensible for the police to know where replica weapons are - might reduce the chance of someone with a replica, being shot by them for one thing. Sounds far-fetched but what about the day after the show finishes, a model citizen spots someone taking a sword/gun out of the car - would look sus?? Also plenty of robberies take place where there's a replica gun involved. You might say - but that's not going to happen in this case; this is taking things too far - but why should the drama group have the law disapplied for them?



Surely there has to be room for common sense? Otherwise, if you take the attitude "why should the drama group have the law disapplied to them", surely you then have to argue that all replica/toy guns and swords have to fall under the same law and that their owners should have the same legal obligations to lock them up, register them, etc. regardless of who they are.

hse.gov.uk/pub…pdf
This is the advice - what's the problem?
telegraph.co.uk/new…xml
This is where you can see the press treatment, including the National Operatic and Drama Association said it supported the new policy because "it enables weapons to be used safely and legally in theatrical performances".

This is from
blue-room.org.uk/ind…690

In short, treat a replica\deac as if it were live. One person with responsibility for access control, checking the weapon is clear, secure storage. Block the scenes sensibly. Inform the local police (non-emergency number available on your local forces website) of your intention to display a replica in public (times\ locations\storage arrangements) and get a CAD number for your notification.

This is how the am-dram theatre people interpret the advice - it seems to have enough common sense to me.

Banned

I agree:-D

Me thinks someone round here works for the HSE! mmm

Common sense obviously has no place in our molly coddled society, maybe the reason more and more accidents are happening is because our ability and oppurtunity to use common sense is being taken away from us by the powers that be, therefore when faced with an incident we lose all sense of how to react to any given situation as we are so used to being told DO IT THIS WAY OR ELSE so our own abilitys to make decisions are no longer in tune.

On the same basis does this mean the water pistols my kids will inevitably end up playing with this summer will have to be registered first and when not in use be locked in the gun cabinet??

Can anyone give me advice too on how the hell I go about registering my sawn off shotgun?? I just cant seem to find the relevant forms on-line for some reason!

harlzter;1475319

Why would fighting with obvious toy guns and weapons be useless this is … Why would fighting with obvious toy guns and weapons be useless this is PANTO the whole point of which is farce!To me it seems the HSE are handling this farce about face.


OK you win the argument about the relative artistic merits of toy/replica weapons in the climactic Robinson Crusoe fight scene.
Oh, nooo you don't.
Oh, yeess .......

harlzter;1475499

Me thinks someone round here works for the HSE! mmm Common sense … Me thinks someone round here works for the HSE! mmm Common sense obviously has no place in our molly coddled society, maybe the reason more and more accidents are happening is because our ability and oppurtunity to use common sense is being taken away from us by the powers that be, therefore when faced with an incident we lose all sense of how to react to any given situation as we are so used to being told DO IT THIS WAY OR ELSE so our own abilitys to make decisions are no longer in tune.On the same basis does this mean the water pistols my kids will inevitably end up playing with this summer will have to be registered first and when not in use be locked in the gun cabinet??Can anyone give me advice too on how the hell I go about registering my sawn off shotgun?? I just cant seem to find the relevant forms on-line for some reason!



Dramatic license would that be?
I would think that there isn't a form because you're just not allowed to have a sawn-off shot gun. Do you know why. Are you the panto villain??

No. These stories get blow up out of all proportion. Following H&S guidelines is a bit of a doddle - and I don't work for them - and is genuinely for the health and safety of everyone. Some people sound off because they haven't thought beyond the direct effects on themselves.


Common sense - 'OK kid off you go - you'll figure out the dangers of crossing the road fast enough.' says the wicked step-mother

sassie;1475497

I agree:-D


Thanks (and hope things in general are a bit brighter for you now).

OH, OH you were agreeing with me weren't you?

stora;1474472

There is also a toy gun which produces a flag saying "Bang"


I wish that I could put pictures into replies like you. I just can't figure it out. This is a great thread for panto pictures to appear in. Get it ---appearing!!:)

chesso;1475524

Common sense - 'OK kid off you go - you'll figure out the dangers of … Common sense - 'OK kid off you go - you'll figure out the dangers of crossing the road fast enough.' says the wicked step-mother



Ummm...That wouldn't be what most people would call common sense. Are you sure you don't work for H&S?

chesso;1475544

I wish that I could put pictures into replies like you. I just can't … I wish that I could put pictures into replies like you. I just can't figure it out. This is a great thread for panto pictures to appear in. Get it ---appearing!!:)



When you reply, you'll see a tiny icon above the text box that looks like a photo of a mountain.

i.e. This one: http://www.hotukdeals.com/forums/images/editor/insertimage.gif

Click on that icon and enter the URL of the picture you want to post.

What's common sense to one is a pantomime plot to another.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/arts/4267975.stm

Oh, dear, I've just got a little box with a cross in it, This IS a bit of a pantomime.
How do I know what the correct url is?

Banned

chesso;1475620

How do I know what the correct url is?



the one that shows a picture and not a little red cross:p

chesso;1475620

Oh, dear, I've just got a little box with a cross in it, This IS a bit of … Oh, dear, I've just got a little box with a cross in it, This IS a bit of a pantomime.How do I know what the correct url is?



If you use internet explorer, you right click on the picture you want to use and select 'Properties'. Then copy and paste the URL from the dialog box that pops up.

(Other browsers tend to have an option called something like "Copy Image Address", when you right click on the image.)

http://www.wayfarers-pantomime.co.uk/images/Robinson_Crusoe.jpg
I am so pleased . Thanks nightswimmer.

Well done chesso. :friends:

http://www.simnia.com/film/potc2/sword_pick.jpg

mmm very scary looking, but not as scary as:
http://www.startrip.tv/images/scary.jpg

nightswimmer;1474521

Ummm..it wasn't the police. :thinking:



register a toy gun with the police

yeh but they have to do the paper work which is a waste of time,its them who have it to deal with it,waste of police time

Mum2Connor&Cerys;1476275

yeh but they have to do the paper work which is a waste of time,its them … yeh but they have to do the paper work which is a waste of time,its them who have it to deal with it,waste of police time



Ah, I see what you are saying. Sorry, I thought you were meaning it was the Police who were forcing this to happen.

harlzter;1476147

mmm very scary looking, but not as scary as:


What have those little plastic things that you put silverskin onions on got to do with it.:p
Binderella - no ball for you my girl.Off to rehab with you.
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