Hot Splash Pool Heater

35
Posted 5th Aug 2020
Does anybody have any experience of these?

It was recommended to me by a member on here but can't remember who. Took quite a while to track one down but finally did.

So had it a couple of weeks now and have tried it on a few occasions. The first time a couple of weeks ago it made absolutely no difference to the pool temp. It actually dropped 2 degrees over night.

So I determined it must be losing heat quicker than it could build up. However, there is no heat in the output water side. Which makes no sense, as its a heater.

I have bought some 75mm sheets of polystyrene to cover the top of the pool in attempt to insulate it.

So I have had it running on the pool for the last 4 days and the temp is exactly the same as it was 4 days ago.

What am I doing wrong with this. Feel like I have just wasted £400, not too mention the £3 per day it takes to run it.

Any suggestions gratefully received.
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At say 15p / kWh, £3 per day seems very low for a pool heater and suggests the heater is providing less than 1kW of heating per hour.
Compare to a domestic 3.3kWh kettle that would consume, er, 3.3kW per hour.
AndyRoyd05/08/2020 19:40

At say 15p / kWh, £3 per day seems very low for a pool heater and suggests …At say 15p / kWh, £3 per day seems very low for a pool heater and suggests the heater is providing less than 1kW of heating per hour.Compare to a domestic 3.3kWh kettle that would consume, er, 3.3kW per hour.


It's a heat exchanger and the manufacturer suggests that it outputs 3.35kw. The official name of it is the Hot Splash 3.35kw

Here is a link to the item

heatpumps4pools.com/pro…ug/
Edited by: "Deedie" 5th Aug
Deedie05/08/2020 19:43

It's a heat exchanger and the manufacturer suggests that it outputs …It's a heat exchanger and the manufacturer suggests that it outputs 3.35kw. The official name of it is the Hot Splash 3.35kwHere is a link to the itemhttps://www.heatpumps4pools.com/product/hot-splash-3-35kw-plug-and-play-pool-heat-pump-for-above-ground-pools-up-to-8m3-eu-plug/


OK, CoP of 3+ is the basis of many air-con and green energy systems that use same HP principle, although the efficiency gains typically reduce at lower capacities (and obvsly lower ambient).


Deedie05/08/2020 19:43

...However, there is no heat in the output water side. Which makes no …...However, there is no heat in the output water side. Which makes no sense, as its a heater...


which kinda suggests it is not providing the expected functionality. Maybe start diagnosis with a power consumption meter on the supply.
AndyRoyd05/08/2020 20:42

OK, CoP of 3+ is the basis of many air-con and green energy systems that …OK, CoP of 3+ is the basis of many air-con and green energy systems that use same HP principle, although the efficiency gains typically reduce at lower capacities (and obvsly lower ambient).which kinda suggests it is not providing the expected functionality. Maybe start diagnosis with a power consumption meter on the supply.


I have had a power consumption meter on the supply since day one. Currently sitting at 355w between pump and heater
Edited by: "Deedie" 5th Aug
Deedie05/08/2020 21:46

I have had a power consumption meter on the supply since day one. …I have had a power consumption meter on the supply since day one. Currently sitting at 355w between pump and heater


That's 37p / kWh which seems grossly high. To obtain your £3 daily spend would typically require residual 850W draw.
AndyRoyd05/08/2020 22:06

That's 37p / kWh which seems grossly high. To obtain your £3 daily spend …That's 37p / kWh which seems grossly high. To obtain your £3 daily spend would typically require residual 850W draw.


Not sure what that means. I assumed if it's higher number like 850w would cost more than 355w! I assume I am wrong though.

More concerned with the fact that it's not heating the water. Is it related?
Edited by: "Deedie" 5th Aug
Deedie05/08/2020 22:15

Not sure what that means.More concerned with the fact that it's not …Not sure what that means.More concerned with the fact that it's not heating the water. Is it related?


It suggests you are paying a ridiculously high unit rate from your electricity supplier, and / or
the unit is not drawing enough power (issue with compressor side or equivalent).
AndyRoyd05/08/2020 22:54

It suggests you are paying a ridiculously high unit rate from your …It suggests you are paying a ridiculously high unit rate from your electricity supplier, and / orthe unit is not drawing enough power (issue with compressor side or equivalent).


I should clarify. The running cost I mention is an estimate based on the advice I got regarding running costs from the member on here who recommended it. If its running at slightly more than half its maximum power, I assume I'm only paying around £1.50 (estimated) per day.


Again. The lack of hot water is my only concern, regardless of running costs.

Could the issue with not drawing enough power, be due to the energy monitoring plug limiting it?
Edited by: "Deedie" 5th Aug
Deedie05/08/2020 23:41

I should clarify. The running cost I mention is an estimate based on the …I should clarify. The running cost I mention is an estimate based on the advice I got regarding running costs from the member on here who recommended it. If its running at slightly more than half its maximum power, I assume I'm only paying around £1.50 (estimated) per day.Again. The lack of hot water is my only concern, regardless of running costs.Could the issue with not drawing enough power, be due to the energy monitoring plug limiting it?


Lol, that explains the discrepancy and negates one line of thought.

Your device is not drawing its rated power, as you have noted. Some causes may include a safety circuit being triggered by, say, low flow rate (unlikely as pre-safety effect would be to raise the temperature of output processed water); or there is restricted external or internal air flow; or the unit has some other internal fault (obvsly!). It is unlikely an external power meter would limit power throughput, but you could remove it and test it with a domestic kettle or similar high power device.
AndyRoyd06/08/2020 08:50

Lol, that explains the discrepancy and negates one line of thought.Your …Lol, that explains the discrepancy and negates one line of thought.Your device is not drawing its rated power, as you have noted. Some causes may include a safety circuit being triggered by, say, low flow rate (unlikely as pre-safety effect would be to raise the temperature of output processed water); or there is restricted external or internal air flow; or the unit has some other internal fault (obvsly!). It is unlikely an external power meter would limit power throughput, but you could remove it and test it with a domestic kettle or similar high power device.


okay thanks

this gives me some things to investigate.
AndyRoyd06/08/2020 08:50

Lol, that explains the discrepancy and negates one line of thought.Your …Lol, that explains the discrepancy and negates one line of thought.Your device is not drawing its rated power, as you have noted. Some causes may include a safety circuit being triggered by, say, low flow rate (unlikely as pre-safety effect would be to raise the temperature of output processed water); or there is restricted external or internal air flow; or the unit has some other internal fault (obvsly!). It is unlikely an external power meter would limit power throughput, but you could remove it and test it with a domestic kettle or similar high power device.


how accurate are these energy monitoring plugs?
its the kasa hs110 i have
Deedie06/08/2020 09:26

how accurate are these energy monitoring plugs?its the kasa hs110 i have


Unless faulty: reasonable accurate. Rough'n'ready check: just have a look at the model / base of your kettle for its power consumption spec and use the meter to see if similar to spec.
AndyRoyd06/08/2020 09:32

Unless faulty: reasonable accurate. Rough'n'ready check: just have a look …Unless faulty: reasonable accurate. Rough'n'ready check: just have a look at the model / base of your kettle for its power consumption spec and use the meter to see if similar to spec.


So I done a crude flow rate test and my calculations are that the pump is outputting at 0.7m3 per hour. The nominal rate of the heater is 2m3 per hour. Is this likely the culprit?
Deedie06/08/2020 11:02

So I done a crude flow rate test and my calculations are that the pump is …So I done a crude flow rate test and my calculations are that the pump is outputting at 0.7m3 per hour. The nominal rate of the heater is 2m3 per hour. Is this likely the culprit?


Certainly plausible. Page7 of OpMan states:
"Low water flow or air entering into the pipes should be avoided, as this will diminish the heat pump performance and reliability."
although there is no defined statement of what "low water flow" may be.
AndyRoyd06/08/2020 11:09

Certainly plausible. Page7 of OpMan states:"Low water flow or air entering …Certainly plausible. Page7 of OpMan states:"Low water flow or air entering into the pipes should be avoided, as this will diminish the heat pump performance and reliability."although there is no defined statement of what "low water flow" may be.


I assume below nominal flow rate of 2m3 p/h. Bloody pump that meets those requirements are another £200

Is it likely that the unit does not heat water if below the flow rate? Or would it just not work as well.
Edited by: "Deedie" 6th Aug
Deedie06/08/2020 12:53

I assume below nominal flow rate of 2m3 p/h. Bloody pump that meets those …I assume below nominal flow rate of 2m3 p/h. Bloody pump that meets those requirements are another £200Is it likely that the unit does not heat water if below the flow rate? Or would it just not work as well.


That's the kicker. If the flow is lower than normal the theoretical temperature of the water that passes through the HP would be warmer (I'll avoid the word hotter) than the water that passed through at a higher rate - assuming same rated heat transfer power in both scenarios.
If the low flow rate is genuinely the issue, the HP appears to be limiting itself to a lower power consumption - presumably so that the exit water at lower flow rate is of a similar temperature to that of the water had the flow rate been to spec.
I'm not familiar with small HPs but you imply the exit water is of no discernable difference in temperature to the input water, and certainly not hot enough for the HP to be shutting itself down as some sort of self-protect mechanism. However, if the flow is silly low a flow sensor may be inaccurate and / or the unit puts itself into self-protect limp mode, or is simply not making any positive contribution.

Before throwing £200 at a pump can you clarify one point you mentioned earlier:
"...Currently sitting at 355w between pump and heater..."
Is that 355W the combined power consumption of pump + HP? Or more to the point:
leaving the HP connected in circuit, is it possible to put the power meter exclusively in the pump power feed to obtain the real power consumption of just the pump (rather than read it from the spec label / sheet)?
AndyRoyd06/08/2020 13:29

That's the kicker. If the flow is lower than normal the theoretical …That's the kicker. If the flow is lower than normal the theoretical temperature of the water that passes through the HP would be warmer (I'll avoid the word hotter) than the water that passed through at a higher rate - assuming same rated heat transfer power in both scenarios.If the low flow rate is genuinely the issue, the HP appears to be limiting itself to a lower power consumption - presumably so that the exit water at lower flow rate is of a similar temperature to that of the water had the flow rate been to spec. I'm not familiar with small HPs but you imply the exit water is of no discernable difference in temperature to the input water, and certainly not hot enough for the HP to be shutting itself down as some sort of self-protect mechanism. However, if the flow is silly low a flow sensor may be inaccurate and / or the unit puts itself into self-protect limp mode, or is simply not making any positive contribution.Before throwing £200 at a pump can you clarify one point you mentioned earlier:"...Currently sitting at 355w between pump and heater..."Is that 355W the combined power consumption of pump + HP? Or more to the point:leaving the HP connected in circuit, is it possible to put the power meter exclusively in the pump power feed to obtain the real power consumption of just the pump (rather than read it from the spec label / sheet)?


the power consumption of the pump/filter is around 19w on its own
I don't have one of these, i have an intex one, you can barely feel the warmth coming out of the outlet port, mine tends to be in all day, and off at night, and overnight it will lose anything from 2 - 6 degrees during warm weather, much more now its cooler, pool heaters are a long game, you need to plan a few days ahead, otherwise make sure it's on all day everyday.

I have a pool cover for nighttime which seems to help, and it's on foam pads and sand on the grass.

During a warm spell is 29 - 30 degrees, and will drop to about 24 - 26 overnight, turn it on in the morning around 8 and by 1 its back up to 29 - 30, if i don't turn it on for one day it takes 2 to get back up to 29 - 30.

Is your filter over spec for your pool, i wonder if the water is going through the heater to quickly?
Deedie06/08/2020 13:41

the power consumption of the pump/filter is around 19w on its own


Probably gone as far as you can with diagnosis.
The HP is clearly not drawing the expected power.
HP merchant / manufacturer will cite the installation is not within the HPs design / application spec due to excessively low flow rate.
Likely stalemate until the installation has a pump that meet the HPs application spec, or some other method is implemented to raise flow rate in a test environment.
AndyRoyd06/08/2020 20:29

Probably gone as far as you can with diagnosis. The HP is clearly not …Probably gone as far as you can with diagnosis. The HP is clearly not drawing the expected power. HP merchant / manufacturer will cite the installation is not within the HPs design / application spec due to excessively low flow rate. Likely stalemate until the installation has a pump that meet the HPs application spec, or some other method is implemented to raise flow rate in a test environment.


I defo think its a flow issue. I installed a more powerful pump, bur still just below the expected flow rate. When I first turned the heater on with this pump, I could hear the compressor kicking in (at least I think that's what it was). Was definitely a different sound and it was drawing around 550w for a short period of time. The power consumption then dropped too and sustained at just under 400w. So I'm going to get a more powerful sump pump from my dad tomorrow and see if it makes any difference. Also waiting on the manufacturer getting back to me to confirm whether it does not operate at lower flow rates.
Deedie06/08/2020 20:38

I defo think its a flow issue. I installed a more powerful pump, bur still …I defo think its a flow issue. I installed a more powerful pump, bur still just below the expected flow rate. When I first turned the heater on with this pump, I could hear the compressor kicking in (at least I think that's what it was). Was definitely a different sound and it was drawing around 550w for a short period of time. The power consumption then dropped too and sustained at just under 400w. So I'm going to get a more powerful sump pump from my dad tomorrow and see if it makes any difference. Also waiting on the manufacturer getting back to me to confirm whether it does not operate at lower flow rates.


OK, sensible steps. Good luck.
Hi Deedie,

How did you get on with that more powerful pump you mention and/or hearing back from the manufacturer - I'm not sure if I may be in a similar position....
Billy132125/08/2020 13:39

Hi Deedie,How did you get on with that more powerful pump you mention …Hi Deedie,How did you get on with that more powerful pump you mention and/or hearing back from the manufacturer - I'm not sure if I may be in a similar position....


I used a sump pump type thing. Type of pump that you would use emptying s hole. Problem being that it wasn't designed to run continously so after bit it would stop for a few minutes. So not ideal. I have decided to bite the bullet and buy a sand filter pump. Unfortunately they are sold out everywhere also.

Do you have a hot splash? What pump are you using?
Yes, I went for a hot splash - have it paired with a intex 604 - which should be pumping out the required 2000 l/hr. And from a crude test of filling up a bucket and timing that and some maths - appears to align with that.

But like you, not convinced I'm seeing any benefit - I also understand from heatpumps4pools.com/myf…pdf - that temp from the fan should be about 8C colder than air temp. Not on mine...
Billy132125/08/2020 15:34

Yes, I went for a hot splash - have it paired with a intex 604 - which …Yes, I went for a hot splash - have it paired with a intex 604 - which should be pumping out the required 2000 l/hr. And from a crude test of filling up a bucket and timing that and some maths - appears to align with that.But like you, not convinced I'm seeing any benefit - I also understand from https://www.heatpumps4pools.com/myfiles/file/Hot-Splash-Update-Bulletin-May-2020.pdf - that temp from the fan should be about 8C colder than air temp. Not on mine...


how long have been running it on the pool?
I had issues with it icing up prior to the temperature problem. Such that I've an RMA request in progress, new unit due to be sent out.

Any luck getting your new pump, or that enquiry you mentioned you'd raised with the manufacturer on lower flow rates and the impact.
Billy132128/08/2020 14:38

I had issues with it icing up prior to the temperature problem. Such that …I had issues with it icing up prior to the temperature problem. Such that I've an RMA request in progress, new unit due to be sent out. Any luck getting your new pump, or that enquiry you mentioned you'd raised with the manufacturer on lower flow rates and the impact.


Are you returning it too the shop you got it from or directly to the manufacturer. I have had no reply from them regarding my enquiring. I also asked the company I bought it from but they told me to raise an issue the heat pumps for pools website, which I did. But never replied. I was hoping the person who recommended it on here would have replied to my messages. So I could get an idea of how their ones behaves, to try and figure out if this is just broken or it is a flow issue.
Billy132128/08/2020 14:38

I had issues with it icing up prior to the temperature problem. Such that …I had issues with it icing up prior to the temperature problem. Such that I've an RMA request in progress, new unit due to be sent out. Any luck getting your new pump, or that enquiry you mentioned you'd raised with the manufacturer on lower flow rates and the impact.


managed to get myself an1200gph intex sand filter from amazon, being delivered on Saturday. difficult things to track down just now.
hopefully this will make a difference. will let you know
Billy132128/08/2020 14:38

I had issues with it icing up prior to the temperature problem. Such that …I had issues with it icing up prior to the temperature problem. Such that I've an RMA request in progress, new unit due to be sent out. Any luck getting your new pump, or that enquiry you mentioned you'd raised with the manufacturer on lower flow rates and the impact.


Did you get a new unit yet? I have my new pump setup on it and it's made no difference. Measured the air temp coming off the fan and its half a degree warmer than the ambient temperature, when it should be 8ish degrees lower. So I think I have a faulty unit also. Just waiting on the manufacturer getting back to me.
I did get it, and measuring that temp did give a difference of between 6-8C from the surrounding temp. It took forever to heat up the pool, about 1 - 2 C per day. But it got there, I suspect the colder days and especially nights play a part of that.
The noise of running it 24/7 has been biggest issue - our neighbours started to complain that it sounded like a generator and was actually stopping them from using the garden. To be be fair, I'm sympathetic and they were genuinely looking stressed and upset over it.
Would welcome hearing how you got on with the noise, albeit a faulty unit.
Billy132109/09/2020 07:33

I did get it, and measuring that temp did give a difference of between …I did get it, and measuring that temp did give a difference of between 6-8C from the surrounding temp. It took forever to heat up the pool, about 1 - 2 C per day. But it got there, I suspect the colder days and especially nights play a part of that.The noise of running it 24/7 has been biggest issue - our neighbours started to complain that it sounded like a generator and was actually stopping them from using the garden. To be be fair, I'm sympathetic and they were genuinely looking stressed and upset over it.Would welcome hearing how you got on with the noise, albeit a faulty unit.


thanks for the update. it sounds like mine is broken then. As for noise, i initially put mine in the shed, which made it virtually silent, but they dont work well in enclosed spaces so i removed it. i have bought an extra 30ft of 32mm hose so i can move it as far away from my seating area as possible and pointing the fan away from where i sit.

Glad you got yours sorted. Who replaced your heater? What temperature where you able to raise the pool too?

you wouldn't happen to have yours attached to an energy monitoring plug would you?

mine only draws about less than half the power it is supposed too. i wonder if that is the issue.
Edited by: "Deedie" 9th Sep
I took the temperature up to 30C, and it was heatpumps4pools.com that replaced it - all fairly quick and easy in the end for the replacement process.

I didn't have a monitoring plug on it, but sounds like whatever the fault with the unit is, is likely related to what you see as a lower power draw. I would focus on the fact it's not heating and you don't have that temperature change at the fan. I illustrated it myself by sending them a video of me recording the temp. They had a support section on the site that allows for tickets to be raised and files attached.
Billy132109/09/2020 10:04

I took the temperature up to 30C, and it was heatpumps4pools.com that …I took the temperature up to 30C, and it was heatpumps4pools.com that replaced it - all fairly quick and easy in the end for the replacement process.I didn't have a monitoring plug on it, but sounds like whatever the fault with the unit is, is likely related to what you see as a lower power draw. I would focus on the fact it's not heating and you don't have that temperature change at the fan. I illustrated it myself by sending them a video of me recording the temp. They had a support section on the site that allows for tickets to be raised and files attached.


Yes. I have had an open ticket with them for a couple of weeks. I was waiting to track down the sand filter so I could rule out the flow issue. I have a new thermometer coming today to rule out that issue, so will take some pictures or video of it in action. But I'm going to push them for a replacement. I think I have ruled everything else out.
Billy132109/09/2020 10:04

I took the temperature up to 30C, and it was heatpumps4pools.com that …I took the temperature up to 30C, and it was heatpumps4pools.com that replaced it - all fairly quick and easy in the end for the replacement process.I didn't have a monitoring plug on it, but sounds like whatever the fault with the unit is, is likely related to what you see as a lower power draw. I would focus on the fact it's not heating and you don't have that temperature change at the fan. I illustrated it myself by sending them a video of me recording the temp. They had a support section on the site that allows for tickets to be raised and files attached.


They requested a video and have decided its faulty. They are replacing it on Monday. Just in time for packing it away for the winter lol
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