how much does it cost the government to start and implement a database?

Its for the nhs so come on have a guess

1 million
10 million
100 million
1 billion
12.7 billion pounds !!!!!!

21 Comments

wat!!

Banned

latest is 12.7 billion pounds but expect it to be nearer £20,000,000,000

only 5% currently using the system as it has thousands of bugs in it. I believe it is already years late too. I;m glad I opted out of having my medical records held on the Database.

I expect it to go the way of most government IT projects. In the bin as not fit for purpose (CSA Database anyone!).

Banned

I know someone who could have given them a few tips! And they could have saved on income support payments. :whistling:

Should have given it to my degree class, we could of done it probably better and a lot less in terms of cost

Banned

Just imagine how much the Olympics is going to cost then by 2012! If the next 4 years are as bad as the cost management in the previous 4 years then we could be looking at a bill of £40Billion lol

[SIZE=2] HOW 2012 ESTIMATES HAVE CHANGED
2003: Consultants Arup put total cost of building and staging the Games at £1.796bn
2003: Tessa Jowell launches bid in May telling MPs it will cost £2.375bn - including a 50% contingency
2005: Bid succeeds in July with "prudent" estimate of preparing for games of £2.4bn
2006: Tessa Jowell says Olympic Park costs up to £3.3bn
2007: Olympic Park budget now at £5.3bn - including regeneration and infrastructure
2007: Total budget, including contingency, security and tax, reaches £9.35bn



[/SIZE]

Lets not forget the money wasted on regional fire controls too...

Banned

Serious ? Just for a database. I know a hundred people that could have built that for a couple of grand. Who's building this thing ? Seems like they're purposely putting bugs to get more money

The biggest problem with building these "databases" as people put it (and its not a database, its a complete system), is that the requirements are continually changed while development is in place, often to the point where things that have already been designed are no longer fit for purpose.

The other problem is that when bidding for a contract, the supplier will often bid less than it will cost to get the contract awarded to them and then add costs on afterwards. This is because the government doesn't know how to outsource these projects properly and thinks that the lowest price is always the best and it will cost that much and nothing more.

Banned

LOL, not suprised, when you see how much "outsourcing" IT costs and then I also have a relative in recruitment, who recruits for govt contracts.

Outsourcing is a joke, always has been, it costs a bomb, and what's worse the govt NEVER read the contracts properly that I am convinced of as it always ends up costing more for stuff they left off.

Banned

suchafunkymonkey;8046144

The biggest problem with building these "databases" as people put it (and … The biggest problem with building these "databases" as people put it (and its not a database, its a complete system), is that the requirements are continually changed while development is in place, often to the point where things that have already been designed are no longer fit for purpose.The other problem is that when bidding for a contract, the supplier will often bid less than it will cost to get the contract awarded to them and then add costs on afterwards. This is because the government doesn't know how to outsource these projects properly and thinks that the lowest price is always the best and it will cost that much and nothing more.


This is the key point. What proper business would ever tender out work for contract quotes which allow movement on the price?

Its like a plumber saying they'll fit a boiler for you for £1000 and then send you a bill for £5000 once fitted even though it doesnt work!

If I was cynical, I would say most government IT projects are effective ways of siphoning taxpayers money into party donors companies ;-)

It peeves me off no end to see the same non-UK companies being awarded contracts despite previous major disasters (e.g. EDS, Fujitsu, IBM)

csiman;8046267

This is the key point. What proper business would ever tender out work … This is the key point. What proper business would ever tender out work for contract quotes which allow movement on the price?Its like a plumber saying they'll fit a boiler for you for £1000 and then send you a bill for £5000 once fitted even though it doesnt work!If I was cynical, I would say most government IT projects are effective ways of siphoning taxpayers money into party donors companies ;-)It peeves me off no end to see the same non-UK companies being awarded contracts despite previous major disasters (e.g. EDS, Fujitsu, IBM)



To be fair to the out sourcers, the change in price comes down to the change in requirements by the government. Every change costs more money and takes longer to impact/design/develop/test. If the government thought about what they wanted before hand and stuck to it, these projects wouldn't overrun.

A lot of the time, the outsourcing company is a conveinient scapegoat for government bureaucracy and mis-management. Civil servants are terrified of making decisions that could point back to them.

Banned

csiman;8046267

This is the key point. What proper business would ever tender out work … This is the key point. What proper business would ever tender out work for contract quotes which allow movement on the price?Its like a plumber saying they'll fit a boiler for you for £1000 and then send you a bill for £5000 once fitted even though it doesnt work!If I was cynical, I would say most government IT projects are effective ways of siphoning taxpayers money into party donors companies ;-)It peeves me off no end to see the same non-UK companies being awarded contracts despite previous major disasters (e.g. EDS, Fujitsu, IBM)



Yeah it annoys me even more, IT departments are closing all thoughout the govt depts, NHS, MOD, and being civvied out and then the companies involved charge stupid amounts and balls it all up:x

All in the name of "cost cutting" it's a huge racket, they found out the builders (the hospitals) were all price fixing and conning, it's high time someone looked into these "cost cutting" contracts as the wastage is immense.

csiman;8046267

It peeves me off no end to see the same non-UK companies being awarded … It peeves me off no end to see the same non-UK companies being awarded contracts despite previous major disasters (e.g. EDS, Fujitsu, IBM)



Lol's. I have worked or have done work for all of these, and they are a shambles...

Pays my wages tho... or did.

12.7 billion pounds... wow, give me a quarter of that and i could have produced a bang tidy little excel spreadsheet and out of pure kindness and enthusiasm... i would also create a nice little logo in microsoft paint

NHS missed out there

Banned

Chiptivo;8046425

Lol's. I have worked or have done work for all of these, and they are a … Lol's. I have worked or have done work for all of these, and they are a shambles... Pays my wages tho... or did.


lol - me too. Worked for a profitable 30 year old company that got taken over by EDS. It made a loss by year two and went under last year after 4 years of being owned by EDS!

Pissups and breweries springs to mind

Banned

suchafunkymonkey;8046400

To be fair to the out sourcers, the change in price comes down to the … To be fair to the out sourcers, the change in price comes down to the change in requirements by the government. Every change costs more money and takes longer to impact/design/develop/test. If the government thought about what they wanted before hand and stuck to it, these projects wouldn't overrun.A lot of the time, the outsourcing company is a conveinient scapegoat for government bureaucracy and mis-management. Civil servants are terrified of making decisions that could point back to them.


yes, also very true. Never seem to learn by their mistakes though.

Banned

csiman;8046473

lol - me too. Worked for a profitable 30 year old company that got taken … lol - me too. Worked for a profitable 30 year old company that got taken over by EDS. It made a loss by year two and went under last year after 4 years of being owned by EDS!Pissups and breweries springs to mind



Don't even get me started on EDS and what they do to the workplace:x

tinkerbell28;8046520

Don't even get me started on EDS and what they do to the workplace:x



Why not?

DMERC;8046455

12.7 billion pounds... wow, give me a quarter of that and i could have … 12.7 billion pounds... wow, give me a quarter of that and i could have produced a bang tidy little excel spreadsheet and out of pure kindness and enthusiasm... i would also create a nice little logo in microsoft paintNHS missed out there



lmao, if only it was for a database,

The work was contracted out for the PAS systems across the various Trusts across the UK, lots of different PAS systems in place, oh dear

the BT Spine and N3 infrastructure is a huge bulk of the costs, good ol BT sucking the NHS dry - ie a N3 connection of 1mb is £42000 for 5 years minimum, then you have N3 COIN network infrastructure.

The replacement of millions of desktop PCs, a new digital X-Ray system, CRIS and PACS, then integrated into PAS, plus the Clinical equipment to go with that, MRI, X-Ray and CT Scanner machines all costing millions each.

The staff to support all the extra epuipment and reliance on computer technology.

Staff IT training

Then the joining of the Trust networks and firewall configs to go with that

Upgrade of Hospital Data Centres, and additional power consumption this means that additional back-up generator buildings need to be constructed..............................

and on and on and on

Alfonse;8046658

lmao, if only it was for a database, The work was contracted out for the … lmao, if only it was for a database, The work was contracted out for the PAS systems across the various Trusts across the UK, lots of different PAS systems in place, oh dearthe BT Spine and N3 infrastructure is a huge bulk of the costs, good ol BT sucking the NHS dry - ie a N3 connection of 1mb is £42000 for 5 years minimum, then you have N3 COIN network infrastructure.The replacement of millions of desktop PCs, a new digital X-Ray equipment, CRIS and PACS, then integrated into PAS, plus the Clinical equipment to go with that, MRI, X-Ray and CT Scanner machines all costing millions each.The staff to support all the extra epuipment and reliance on computer technology.Staff IT trainingThen the joining of the Trust networks and firewall configs to go with thatUpgrade of Hospital Data Centres, and additional power consumption this means that additional back-up generator buildings need to be constructed..............................and on and on and on



Very true. People hear the phrase IT database and think they could have done it cheaper using Access on their laptop...

suchafunkymonkey;8046674

Very true. People hear the phrase IT database and think they could have … Very true. People hear the phrase IT database and think they could have done it cheaper using Access on their laptop...



just to clarify... my excel and paint contribution wasn't serious... unless anyone would like to pay me to make a nice illustration on paint?
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