MOT fraud. Car not registered when faults were rectified( so I thought.help)

84
Posted 29th Dec 2019
Need advice on behalf of someone else. Who do I complain to other than the garage.

Months ago I took my car in to have mot done.

Mot fails via phone call.

Guy on phone tells me it will cost X amount to fix the problems.

I pay to fix the problems and he calls me saying its all done come here.

I come and take car.

I get pulled over by police months later and I'm told theres no mot AND IM HIT WITH A FINE)

All the issues the car had I paid for (RECEIPTS AS PROOF)

Police then inspect my car and tell me the thing I failed on (the light) were STILL NOT FIXED.

makes me wonder what else they didnt fix.

PLEASE BESIDES THE GARAGE WHO ELSE CAN I COMPLAIN TO, to get reimbursed this fine which clearly wasn't my fault as I thought not was done.

Speaking on behalf of someone else. I know the hotukdeal community never let me down, please help.
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I'm not being funny but end of the day you been driving around with no MOT for months. You are either a first time car owner or very young and naive.

If you go for a MOT you get a MOT certificate. Pretty simply stuff. You will pay for the MOT and also get a receipt clearly listing MOT.

You simply do not leave the garage without this MOT certificate. So anyway cut a long story short you got caught my police for having no MOT. Rightly so. You got fine, good. Pretty sure if you have no MOT your insurance isn't valid.

Either way all these things are your responsibility.

Also if it was simply a light bulb that and stopped working, after you left the garage you should have noticed and had it fixed.

Pay the fine go to a proper garage and get your MOT done and sorted.

Oh sorry I mean tell your friend.
Edited by: "bally12345" 29th Dec 2019
Ultimately, you’re driving a vehicle with no MOT, so the police have a case against you. There is no getting out of this as any driver of any vehicle is liable for ensuring that the vehicle is safe, roadworthy and legal.
The garage may be at fault for not putting the pass on the system or not fixing the issues, but these are two separate issues.
You can submit mitigating circumstances why you were driving a vehicle on the road which was not road worthy, has no MOT and as such, you have no insurance. But, in all honesty, it won’t wash. As I’ve already said, legally, the driver is responsible for insuring the vehicle is legal. In this case, they didn’t.
84 Comments
Vosa
edit. It’s now called dvsa
gov.uk/gov…ncy

Edited by: "migavupe" 29th Dec 2019
Did you get an MOT certificate? You can check online if your vehicle has a current MOT or tax so I would check this first. Then get in touch with garage for the test certificate as you should have some form of paperwork.
These days I believe mot stations have to have cctv for all vehicles they test. If the mot was done within the last month you could ask to see the footage of your cars test to confirm they fixed the issue. The garage are more than likely going to say they fixed the issue and it was fine when it left their centre.
All sounds a bit weird... gov.uk/che…ory
The mot is only a certificate of passing the test at the time at the garage, allowing you 12 months to before it needs to be checked again. Once out of the centre it is not a accurate representation of cars condition as tested.

For example your lights are good at the time of test, (defective and had a bulb replaced) drive out the centre and a bulb fails. Your mot is still valid but your car is no longer road worthy.

You may have another fault causing the bulb to fail at the time changing the bulb solved the problem.
Edited by: "grommachine" 29th Dec 2019
It is also possible the garage just bodged the job and/or didn't repair. But without further information on fault
But you were given fake mot certificate, vosa would take it up but you would still need to mot your car.
Did they not give you an M.O.T certificate?
Otherwise they might have fixed all issues. You're lights might have gone again, due to an underlying issue potentially. But if the garage wasn't part of the M.O.T centre then they may have presumed you were to take it back there???? Unlikely and usually retests are free within like 48 hours if the car doesn't leave the premises
digweed29/12/2019 08:09

Did you get an MOT certificate? You can check online if your vehicle has a …Did you get an MOT certificate? You can check online if your vehicle has a current MOT or tax so I would check this first. Then get in touch with garage for the test certificate as you should have some form of paperwork.


No certificate, just a sheet with things that were fixed and how much it cost
OPs buddy is stated to have receipts to bring vehicle up to MOT standard but does OPs buddy have a receipt for the actual MOT test?
Did OPs buddy ask for an MOT test to be performed, or just ask for the vehicle to be brought up to MOT standard?
Maybe @Shemale_obsession_XY_XX could respond to these two questions.
grommachine29/12/2019 09:07

It is also possible the garage just bodged the job and/or didn't repair. …It is also possible the garage just bodged the job and/or didn't repair. But without further information on fault


Yep the guy specified on the phone in order to pass the not I need to change the tire and bulb.

Receipt is there with the info.

Why they didnt retest is beyond me and clearly didnt change the bulb.

May I also add they are with a Pegeout service plan that has free mot and servicing.
AndyRoyd29/12/2019 10:24

OPs buddy is stated to have receipts to bring vehicle up to MOT standard …OPs buddy is stated to have receipts to bring vehicle up to MOT standard but does OPs buddy have a receipt for the actual MOT test? Did OPs buddy ask for an MOT test to be performed, or just ask for the vehicle to be brought up to MOT standard?Maybe @Shemale_obsession_XY_XX could respond to these two questions.


Yes they asked for the mot to be performed thars why it failed.

They guy on the phone said what was wrong, I agree to get it sorted and retested for mot.

He phones me up saying it you can collect.

I collect.

My issue is things that were claimed to have been fixed were not. I'll have a hard time proving they light bulb(the thing that failed) wasnt changed
ItsFrazer29/12/2019 09:35

Otherwise they might have fixed all issues. You're lights might have gone …Otherwise they might have fixed all issues. You're lights might have gone again, due to an underlying issue potentially. But if the garage wasn't part of the M.O.T centre then they may have presumed you were to take it back there???? Unlikely and usually retests are free within like 48 hours if the car doesn't leave the premises


I know. But the question is why didnt they retest the mot. They didnt give me a sheet for the failure . They told me online
39528379-xdBnj.jpg
Shemale_obsession_XY_XX29/12/2019 10:29

...Why they didnt retest is beyond me...


Does the Gov MoT site show the MoT fail, or is there no record of any MoT around that time?
AndyRoyd29/12/2019 10:44

Does the Gov MoT site show the MoT fail, or is there no record of any MoT …Does the Gov MoT site show the MoT fail, or is there no record of any MoT around that time?


Shows the fail
conundrum.

I feel for your "friend" however as a competent license holding driver they should be capable f carrying out periodic safety checks once in a while (weekly) as is the norm with works vehicles for instance.
y'know the basics of operation, kicking tyres, checking lights, brakes etc.

check with the police & trading standards against this company, & with peugot themselves, see if it highlights anything.
Shemale_obsession_XY_XX29/12/2019 10:45

Shows the fail


Shemale_obsession_XY_XX29/12/2019 10:29

...May I also add they are with a Pegeout service plan that has free mot …...May I also add they are with a Pegeout service plan that has free mot and servicing.


Does your buddy's "free MoT" arrangement also specifically include free MoT re-tests ?
The plot thickens.........!
Ultimately, you’re driving a vehicle with no MOT, so the police have a case against you. There is no getting out of this as any driver of any vehicle is liable for ensuring that the vehicle is safe, roadworthy and legal.
The garage may be at fault for not putting the pass on the system or not fixing the issues, but these are two separate issues.
You can submit mitigating circumstances why you were driving a vehicle on the road which was not road worthy, has no MOT and as such, you have no insurance. But, in all honesty, it won’t wash. As I’ve already said, legally, the driver is responsible for insuring the vehicle is legal. In this case, they didn’t.
I'm guessing there's been some dialogue, what have the garage said? If they've invoiced for the remedial work on the day and are prepared to issue a statement highlighting they've simply forgotten* to issue a 'pass' it might work as an appeal to VOSA.

*admittedly I find this hard to believe, but, if one person is testing and another is doing front of house, I guess it's possible!
I'm not being funny but end of the day you been driving around with no MOT for months. You are either a first time car owner or very young and naive.

If you go for a MOT you get a MOT certificate. Pretty simply stuff. You will pay for the MOT and also get a receipt clearly listing MOT.

You simply do not leave the garage without this MOT certificate. So anyway cut a long story short you got caught my police for having no MOT. Rightly so. You got fine, good. Pretty sure if you have no MOT your insurance isn't valid.

Either way all these things are your responsibility.

Also if it was simply a light bulb that and stopped working, after you left the garage you should have noticed and had it fixed.

Pay the fine go to a proper garage and get your MOT done and sorted.

Oh sorry I mean tell your friend.
Edited by: "bally12345" 29th Dec 2019
ktm66629/12/2019 11:12

...no MOT and as such, you have no insurance.


Not so, but no desire to become embroiled in irrelevant debate.
bally1234529/12/2019 11:56

I'm not being funny but end of the day you been driving around with no MOT …I'm not being funny but end of the day you been driving around with no MOT for months. You are either a first time car owner or very young and naive.If you go for a MOT you get a MOT certificate. Pretty simply stuff. You will pay for the MOT and also get a receipt clearly listing MOT.You simply do not leave the garage without this MOT certificate. So anyway cut a long story short you got caught my police for having no MOT. Rightly so. You got fine, good. Pretty sure if you have no MOT your insurance isn't valid.Either way all these things are your responsibility.Also if it was simply a light bulb that and stopped working, after you left the garage you should have noticed and had it fixed.Pay the fine go to a proper garage and get your MOT done and sorted.Oh sorry I mean tell your friend.


There haven't been mot certificates for years. I've been told that they intend to drop issuing at a4 sheet as well and that the online info is the only important info.

If OP has a dealer package covering mot etc then he should go back to the dealer asnd kick up a fuss.
If they told you it was MOT'd then they have either failed to put it onto the system or they have committed a fraud. Alarm bells should have rung when there was no paper confirmation of the pass or fail.
The fine goes to the driver, no matter what (as a commercial driver, if I drive a vehicle with no mot I get the fine - I always check).
Contact DVSA, if this garage has a history of complaints you may get somewhere with retribution, but the fine will stand.
Edited by: "Ringfinger" 29th Dec 2019
Does anyone believe this story?

"May I also add they are with a Pegeout [sic] service plan that has free mot and servicing."

Did they (you!) go to an independent garage and pay for an MOT if they (you) had a service plan and FREE MOT?
Or is the claim the garage is a Peugeot garage and they (you) did not pay for the MOT, as it was free anyway?
Retests are usually free.

What did the garage say?
Can Shemale_obsession_XY_XX answer?

You complain to trading standards and the police.
You file a claim in the small claims court against the garage, using MoneyClaimOnline
Edited by: "Common.Sense" 29th Dec 2019
ktm66629/12/2019 11:12

Ultimately, you’re driving a vehicle with no MOT, so the police have a c …Ultimately, you’re driving a vehicle with no MOT, so the police have a case against you. There is no getting out of this as any driver of any vehicle is liable for ensuring that the vehicle is safe, roadworthy and legal. The garage may be at fault for not putting the pass on the system or not fixing the issues, but these are two separate issues. You can submit mitigating circumstances why you were driving a vehicle on the road which was not road worthy, has no MOT and as such, you have no insurance. But, in all honesty, it won’t wash. As I’ve already said, legally, the driver is responsible for insuring the vehicle is legal. In this case, they didn’t.


Ok thanks. This is what I needed
AndyRoyd29/12/2019 10:52

Does your buddy's "free MoT" arrangement also specifically include free …Does your buddy's "free MoT" arrangement also specifically include free MoT re-tests ?


Yes
AndyRoyd29/12/2019 10:44

Does the Gov MoT site show the MoT fail, or is there no record of any MoT …Does the Gov MoT site show the MoT fail, or is there no record of any MoT around that time?


So it shows the fail. I a
mas9929/12/2019 12:07

There haven't been mot certificates for years. I've been told that they …There haven't been mot certificates for years. I've been told that they intend to drop issuing at a4 sheet as well and that the online info is the only important info.If OP has a dealer package covering mot etc then he should go back to the dealer asnd kick up a fuss.


Tes this is the case with the mot + service package
bally1234529/12/2019 11:56

I'm not being funny but end of the day you been driving around with no MOT …I'm not being funny but end of the day you been driving around with no MOT for months. You are either a first time car owner or very young and naive.If you go for a MOT you get a MOT certificate. Pretty simply stuff. You will pay for the MOT and also get a receipt clearly listing MOT.You simply do not leave the garage without this MOT certificate. So anyway cut a long story short you got caught my police for having no MOT. Rightly so. You got fine, good. Pretty sure if you have no MOT your insurance isn't valid.Either way all these things are your responsibility.Also if it was simply a light bulb that and stopped working, after you left the garage you should have noticed and had it fixed.Pay the fine go to a proper garage and get your MOT done and sorted.Oh sorry I mean tell your friend.


Ok
Common.Sense29/12/2019 12:24

Does anyone believe this story?"May I also add they are with a Pegeout …Does anyone believe this story?"May I also add they are with a Pegeout [sic] service plan that has free mot and servicing."Did they (you!) go to an independent garage and pay for an MOT if they (you) had a service plan and FREE MOT?Or is the claim the garage is a Peugeot garage and they (you) did not pay for the MOT, as it was free anyway?What did the garage say?Can Shemale_obsession_XY_XX answer?You complain to trading standards and the police.You file a claim in the small claims court against the garage, using MoneyClaimOnline


This is what the problem is. The package includes free mot + servicing. I'm pretty sure they didnt fix the problem! I have to confirm with the other person.

Seems like I have to complain to

1 trading standards
2 Dvsa
3 Peugeot garage that carried out this .
Shemale_obsession_XY_XX29/12/2019 12:30

This is what the problem is. The package includes free mot + servicing. …This is what the problem is. The package includes free mot + servicing. I'm pretty sure they didnt fix the problem! I have to confirm with the other person.Seems like I have to complain to 1 trading standards2 Dvsa3 Peugeot garage that carried out this .



So, you complain, not your friend. Is this an admission?
This is what the problem is. The package includes free mot + servicing. I'm pretty sure they didnt fix the problem! I have to confirm with the other person.

Seems like I have to complain to

1 trading standards
2 Dvsa
3 Peugeot garage that carried out this .
Firstly, why "on behalf of someone else" ??? Is it YOUR car, or someone else's?

Secondly - is that ALL the car failed on? A tyre and a bulb? You would easily tell if the tyre had been changed as 1) They 'look' new 2) They tend to have sticker remnants on them 3) the sealant around the tyre wall is usually quite apparent.

The bulb is a moot point really. As @grommachine has perfectly pointed out already, the bulb may well have been replaced by the mechanic. However, it can (or ANY bulb can) fail in a month, six months - OR THE SAME DAY as the MOT was performed. Yes, the bulb would be covered by the garage (I would expect) but it still wouldn't hold water with PC Jobsworth as they've heard it a million times before: "I've only JUST replaced that, Constable. Really." I'd like to think some of them would just give a warning to get it replaced ASAP rather than sting you but; hey; you never know. And that is why it is most important to ALWAYS carry spare bulbs. I know for a fact that if you show due diligence and point out you have a spare that you can put in immediately - it goes a long way...

The main issue here is the non-delivery of a proper 'certificate' by the garage. I was going to say this cannot really happen but of course; in the real 'forgetful' world; it can. From a "legal issue" standpoint however - it cannot. The system now in place means an MOT mechanic has their own pass/code to access the DVSA system to enter their pass/fail judgement and findings. They cannot circumvent this system. Yes, of course they can still 'lie' to the system but that's the human side of it. What they can't do is perform an MOT without using the system in place.

The actual 'paper' side - i.e. the "certificate" is nowadays just a formality. Years ago we all got given a DVSA issued and stamped certificate (and yes, even those got 'faked' too) but now it is just a printout on a common printer. Some garages will give you one page, or both pages but it is rare you would receive NO PAGES as this is an error. Because everything is "online" now, the paper part is just a formality (albeit an important formality in some cases) but you SHOULD be given one by the MOT tester/garage. It is not a problem to obtain a copy. You can get one yourself (can cost £10) but if the garage failed to deliver one, they can print off a copy there and then.

I think you are fighting a losing battle here OP - but good luck to you if you decide to pursue it. If you never checked your (or your, um, friend's) car when it left the MOT station to make sure the things had been done then how do you KNOW the bulb hasn't just failed since? Also, how would you PROVE not only to the Police but to the garage as well? That's a toughie...
Common.Sense29/12/2019 12:32

So, you complain, not your friend. Is this an admission?


I just want to be prepared
AndyRoyd29/12/2019 10:52

Does your buddy's "free MoT" arrangement also specifically include free …Does your buddy's "free MoT" arrangement also specifically include free MoT re-tests ?


Shemale_obsession_XY_XX29/12/2019 12:24

Yes


Your buddy's issue is with the entity that provides the inclusive MoT & retest contract, which is not necessarily the garage that failed to record a retest/pass. I doubt that would be regarded as fraud unless there was an active intention by any entity to deprive you of an inclusive benefit stated in a contract that provided inclusive MoT & retest(s). There may be some issue between the provider of the contract and the provider of the MoT unless both are the same registered business, but any such issue (example: payment) should not impact on execution of contract terms. Your buddy will have some contributory factor by not checking the vehicle had a valid MoT. It would be reasonable to expect the responsible party (presumably the business that provides the inclusive MoT package) to offer some appropriate compensation.
Your buddy may additionally have an issue with the garage that did or did not perform any specific work that your buddy directly funded, although it may be difficult to reasonably show that a garage had not performed repair work "months ago".
Phsycronix29/12/2019 12:36

Firstly, why "on behalf of someone else" ??? Is it YOUR car, or someone …Firstly, why "on behalf of someone else" ??? Is it YOUR car, or someone else's?Secondly - is that ALL the car failed on? A tyre and a bulb? You would easily tell if the tyre had been changed as 1) They 'look' new 2) They tend to have sticker remnants on them 3) the sealant around the tyre wall is usually quite apparent.The bulb is a moot point really. As @grommachine has perfectly pointed out already, the bulb may well have been replaced by the mechanic. However, it can (or ANY bulb can) fail in a month, six months - OR THE SAME DAY as the MOT was performed. Yes, the bulb would be covered by the garage (I would expect) but it still wouldn't hold water with PC Jobsworth as they've heard it a million times before: "I've only JUST replaced that, Constable. Really." I'd like to think some of them would just give a warning to get it replaced ASAP rather than sting you but; hey; you never know. And that is why it is most important to ALWAYS carry spare bulbs. I know for a fact that if you show due diligence and point out you have a spare that you can put in immediately - it goes a long way... The main issue here is the non-delivery of a proper 'certificate' by the garage. I was going to say this cannot really happen but of course; in the real 'forgetful' world; it can. From a "legal issue" standpoint however - it cannot. The system now in place means an MOT mechanic has their own pass/code to access the DVSA system to enter their pass/fail judgement and findings. They cannot circumvent this system. Yes, of course they can still 'lie' to the system but that's the human side of it. What they can't do is perform an MOT without using the system in place.The actual 'paper' side - i.e. the "certificate" is nowadays just a formality. Years ago we all got given a DVSA issued and stamped certificate (and yes, even those got 'faked' too) but now it is just a printout on a common printer. Some garages will give you one page, or both pages but it is rare you would receive NO PAGES as this is an error. Because everything is "online" now, the paper part is just a formality (albeit an important formality in some cases) but you SHOULD be given one by the MOT tester/garage. It is not a problem to obtain a copy. You can get one yourself (can cost £10) but if the garage failed to deliver one, they can print off a copy there and then.I think you are fighting a losing battle here OP - but good luck to you if you decide to pursue it. If you never checked your (or your, um, friend's) car when it left the MOT station to make sure the things had been done then how do you KNOW the bulb hasn't just failed since? Also, how would you PROVE not only to the Police but to the garage as well? That's a toughie...


Take a look at this.
Hotukdeals wont let me post the photo . Basically I have a photo claiming the mot passed with a list of things that were done on the car
Other than a broken light which could have gone again it could be a simple case of the tester not pressing save when they did the retest. Talk to the garage and explain what’s happened and then take it from there. Betting this is not the first time this had happened.
39529728-AIt9W.jpgThe messed up all the dates.

Blue arrows at top is the date I got the service done. Bottom right arrow is a date they made up
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