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    need some advice!

    sorry for another mj thread but i just need some info.

    So my friend bought tickets to michael jackson off ebay for £800 for 4 tickets, Now the gigs been cancelled where does he stand?

    obviously it is now past the 45 and 90 days points of opening a despute with paypal and ebay.

    will he be able to get the full amount back or likely the face value of the tickets?

    any help would be great because hes freaking out!

    40 Comments

    Promoters will probably offer a face value refund, might need original proof of purchase.
    Doubt seller will refund voluntarily, might be worth looking into small claims for £800.

    Original Poster

    will it make a difference that the seller stated this on the ebay page?

    Your payment instructions: In the event the gig is councild ONLY the face value of the ticket will be refunded.

    "councild" really?

    lastlaststar;5593202

    will it make a difference that the seller stated this on the ebay … will it make a difference that the seller stated this on the ebay page?Your payment instructions: In the event the gig is councild ONLY the face value of the ticket will be refunded.



    I think that does make a difference don't you?

    At best they are only going to get the face vale back.

    Another example of inexperienced eBayers not reading / taking note of the details and jumping straight in.

    They may have trouble getting anything back at all.

    That sort of limitation would be subject to being reasonable under UCTA s6 - for the money I'd suggest seeking legal advice, TS, CAB, CLAC etc may help.

    Original Poster

    chester123;5593215

    "councild" really?



    yup,

    does this make a difference regarding getting the money back that they stated that on the listing?

    Banned

    Brilliant!

    Been waiting for this all morning!

    These gigs were always going to be cancelled one way or another

    Of course you may have more luck reversing the payment with your credit card co if paid that way - s75 chargeback.

    dimebars;5593236

    Brilliant!Been waiting for this all morning!These gigs were always going … Brilliant!Been waiting for this all morning!These gigs were always going to be cancelled one way or another



    Been waiting for this all morning? What a sad life you must lead.

    tinkerbell28;5593230

    Yeah if it goes to small claims as that was the terms of purchase, you … Yeah if it goes to small claims as that was the terms of purchase, you are not covered by ebay out of the 45 day window.Never, ever buy concert tickets off ebay for this reason, you only have 45 days to claim and mostly won't get the tickets by then, there will be A LOT of people who will loose a lot of money over this.You have no protection out of 45 days that is guaranteed........That is purely from a "experience point of view" so would like to just pop in RIP x



    I was recently given a full refund from ebay wayyyyy outwith thier 45 day guarentee. The seller had been suspended and they were looking into all his transactions. I was given the ebay helpline number and was issued a full refund.

    No sure about these circumstances though, there will be a lot of people in the same position.

    I have learnt my lesson and would never buy tickets from ebay again

    Original Poster

    dimebars;5593236

    Brilliant!Been waiting for this all morning!These gigs were always going … Brilliant!Been waiting for this all morning!These gigs were always going to be cancelled one way or another



    yes i must admit i have been waiting for it as well, luckily i didn't buy them from ebay,

    looks like my friend will be loosing out on a lot of money, as like yo have said no protection and the seller stated only face value will be refunded.

    i guess its kinda like a binding contract as they are the term of buying the product? am i right?

    also small claims? he would have to pay to take the seller to a small claims court? possibly more that its worth?

    and would small claims be able to do anything even though the seller staited about only face value being refunded?

    Banned

    sellers only have to refund the face value if auction is within ebay / paypal time limts. After that, you're on your own with a claim from the promotor which is gonna be difficult as they'll probably refund to the original card purchase.

    I reckon a lot of people will get done up like the proverbial kipper.

    I think because this was stated in your friends ebay listing he will only get back his face value if that is even given.

    If I was your friend I would argue that the deal is only complete once the tickets are in his possession.

    He has purchased 4 tickets, surely the contract is only complete once the goods change hands?

    tinkerbell28;5593275

    Yeah that was a big issue though and involved major fraud, it's not the … Yeah that was a big issue though and involved major fraud, it's not the norm.



    Probably right, he was a very trusted seller and thousands of positive feedback, seems he got bored posting out tickets and just wanted the pennies :w00t:

    lastlaststar;5593266

    yes i must admit i have been waiting for it as well, luckily i didn't buy … yes i must admit i have been waiting for it as well, luckily i didn't buy them from ebay, looks like my friend will be loosing out on a lot of money, as like yo have said no protection and the seller stated only face value will be refunded.i guess its kinda like a binding contract as they are the term of buying the product? am i right?also small claims? he would have to pay to take the seller to a small claims court? possibly more that its worth?and would small claims be able to do anything even though the seller staited about only face value being refunded?



    As I said they bought tickets that are no longer fit for purpose, and the seller clearly admits some form of refund would be due in the event of a cancellation - however they think it is subject to a limitation to face value.
    This limitation has to be reasonable under the unfair contract terms act - if in this case it is would be a matter for a court to decide; It does cost money to take someone to the small claims court, and if contested legal fees could well outweight the possible return - this is something your friend will have to weigh up for themselves.
    I personally would try reversing the charge with my credit card co first, and if that fails try the alternatives. I think if this is heading to court you need legal advice, and you aren't going to get that on here.

    is it just me or did anyone else think the concerts were never going to happen anyway.....

    seancampbell;5593288

    As I said they bought tickets that are no longer fit for purpose, and the … As I said they bought tickets that are no longer fit for purpose, and the seller clearly admits some form of refund would be due in the event of a cancellation - however they think it is subject to a limitation to face value.This limitation has to be reasonable under the unfair contract terms act - if in this case it is would be a matter for a court to decide; It does cost money to take someone to the small claims court, and if contested legal fees could well outweight the possible return - this is something your friend will have to weigh up for themselves.I personally would try reversing the charge with my credit card co first, and if that fails try the alternatives. I think if this is heading to court you need legal advice, and you aren't going to get that on here.



    It is small claims, you have the initial fee and that is it, represent yourself it is very easy.

    If the tickets are returned to the promoter wouldn't the refund go the the original buyer?
    Also i fail to see how you can go down the small claims route, your friend paid for the tickets and reciieved them the transactions been completed.

    I wonder if there's any legal obligation for the tout to refund at all. The auction, and the contract, was for tickets, right? Tout supplied tickets. When Ticketmaster sell tickets, they don't so much sell tickets as a physical entity, they sell access rights to an event, and the tickets are just a way to prove that you've paid. So with Ticketmaster, when the event doesn't happen, they have failed to supply their side of the contract, and are due you a refund for that reason. Since the tout just sells the tickets, and advertises it just as being tickets for X event, I'm not sure why they would be legally or contractually bound to refund if the event doesn't happen. Plus, laws applicable to trading with companies usually aren't applicable to trading with individuals, where there is no warranty, and products are sold as seen.

    Anyone got any thoughts on this theorising?

    Original Poster

    Goonieman;5593331

    If the tickets are returned to the promoter wouldn't the refund go the … If the tickets are returned to the promoter wouldn't the refund go the the original buyer?Also i fail to see how you can go down the small claims route, your friend paid for the tickets and reciieved them the transactions been completed.




    He hasn't received them yet, gig was for September some time, I also said this about the original refund from the promoter that it would go back to the seller.

    I can see the seller refunding the face value and nothing more. if he's lucky

    Goonieman;5593331

    If the tickets are returned to the promoter wouldn't the refund go the … If the tickets are returned to the promoter wouldn't the refund go the the original buyer?Also i fail to see how you can go down the small claims route, your friend paid for the tickets and reciieved them the transactions been completed.



    That is the crux of the argument, he has received nothing. Surely the contract is only completed once the goods are in hand.

    In this case they are not and thus the seller has not fulfilled their end of the transaction.

    lastlaststar;5593353

    He hasn't received them yet,



    Ah right ,missed that bit.

    tinkerbell28;5593368

    Exactly they don't have nor will now get said tickets.



    Which must mean that the seller has not completed their end of the transaction ??

    If the seller says no, I would definitely do small claims, I think the op would win hands down.

    tinkerbell28;5593386

    Yes, you are right.



    Did we just agree on something?

    dimebars;5593236

    Brilliant!Been waiting for this all morning!These gigs were always going … Brilliant!Been waiting for this all morning!These gigs were always going to be cancelled one way or another



    You got nothing better to do with your time???

    dimebars;5593236

    Brilliant!Been waiting for this all morning!These gigs were always going … Brilliant!Been waiting for this all morning!These gigs were always going to be cancelled one way or another



    :w00t:

    civms47;5593451

    You got nothing better to do with your time???



    He couldn't contain his glee on the Littlewoods vouchers threads too.Relishes in peoples anguish.
    So no...nothing better to do.. :roll:

    Original Poster

    well thanks very much everyone for you valuable advice, i will get him to contact the citizen advice bureau and see where he stands,

    i can't see him getting more than the face value, if that.

    will keep you posted!

    :-D ha ha what a clown!! buying tickets off flea-bay for silly silly prices...just asking to be skint for the nxt month or so...no refunds on ..fleabay now:-D

    dimebars;5593236

    Brilliant!Been waiting for this all morning!These gigs were always going … Brilliant!Been waiting for this all morning!These gigs were always going to be cancelled one way or another



    how sad to be happy about someones misfortune

    gary glitter is doing a gig you might be able to use the tickets for that

    Original Poster

    So just to keep you update, my friend has contacted the local citizen advice bureau regarding the tickets.

    They have told him that as the seller stated only the face value would be refunded in the event of a cancellation that is all he should expect as this was made clear in the listing even if he has not received the tickets.

    They also told him that if he takes legal action he most likely will not get anywhere as he has willingly paid over the odds for a product when it stated only face value will be refunded.

    hmmmm

    beware if anyone else is having problems

    Original Poster

    tinkerbell28;5593860

    You mean for the excess right? He would at least get face value if he … You mean for the excess right? He would at least get face value if he claimed, as that was stated on the listing.



    sorry yes, for the excess rights, this is confusing. he is trying to contact the seller now. lets see what happens

    on another note, does anyone know what ticket master are doing regarding tickets? as i have my two which i would like to get my money back on

    Banned

    forestfan123;5593311

    is it just me or did anyone else think the concerts were never going to … is it just me or did anyone else think the concerts were never going to happen anyway.....



    +1

    no way on earth he was ever going to do 50 gigs

    in fact this could all be an elaborate hoax...........................

    Banned

    jeany123;5593704

    how sad to be happy about someones misfortune



    again - its not misfortune

    its blind stupidity - £800 for tickets that would no doubt be rendered useless anyway?

    some people have too much money and in this case they got what was deserved for paying ridculously over the odds

    Touts have no place in business and would have no place if folk like this didnt exist

    Banned

    lastlaststar;5593903

    sorry yes, for the excess rights, this is confusing. he is trying to … sorry yes, for the excess rights, this is confusing. he is trying to contact the seller now. lets see what happenson another note, does anyone know what ticket master are doing regarding tickets? as i have my two which i would like to get my money back on


    ticketmaster.co.uk/pac…_f7

    dimebars;5594118

    again - its not misfortuneits blind stupidity - £800 for tickets that … again - its not misfortuneits blind stupidity - £800 for tickets that would no doubt be rendered useless anyway?some people have too much money and in this case they got what was deserved for paying ridculously over the oddsTouts have no place in business and would have no place if folk like this didnt exist



    Fair enough but he realises that now, doesn't really need gloating over

    Original Poster

    dimebars;5594118

    again - its not misfortuneits blind stupidity - £800 for tickets that … again - its not misfortuneits blind stupidity - £800 for tickets that would no doubt be rendered useless anyway?some people have too much money and in this case they got what was deserved for paying ridculously over the oddsTouts have no place in business and would have no place if folk like this didnt exist



    That's fair enough, but comments like that really are not going to help the situation.

    I am sure if there was something or someone that you really really wanted to see you would also pay over the odds if you could not get a ticket!

    it may not be canceld if they get some fishing wire and some old cd's we gota show! LOL what do the tickets look like? can i see them?
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