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    NHS demonstration - noon, Saturday 4th March 2017 from Tavistock Square to Parliament

    Healthy walk, exercise and do yourself a favour after all the finger tips fingering on your keyboard on MISC to vent your spleen.
    .
    Assemble 12pm Tavistock Square, London WC1 (nearest tube: Russell Sq.; Euston) It's Our NHS National Demonstration - Saturday 4 March 2017, March through London to Parliament
    .
    http://www.unitetheunion.org/uploaded/event-detail/image00111-29614.jpg
    .
    unitetheunion.org/cam…on/
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    The NHS is one of our greatest achievements. We cannot allow it to be undermined and ultimately destroyed.

    Our NHS, fight for it

    Our NHS needs you to fight for it. We must march together, sending a clear message to the government - “the NHS will last as long as there are folk with the faith to fight for it.”
    .
    19 hospital closure thread hotukdeals.com/mis…138
    .
    petition.parliament.uk/pet…491
    From 1 August 2017, new nursing, midwifery and allied health students will access student loans providing more money to them while studying. Universities will also provide more training places.
    .
    petition.parliament.uk/pet…152
    339,925 signatures
    The Petitions Committee decided not to debate this petition

    68 Comments

    splender, please could you copy and paste the information from the linked website which you provided because until I opened it I had no idea what you was talking about.

    Original Poster

    Fuller details : ournhs.info/
    pasted as :-
    http://i.imgur.com/rO9CPfh.jpg

    Will try and go to this, laziness and hangover permitting

    Another pointless propaganda post on a website that has nothing to do with the above.....

    wixxx

    Another pointless propaganda post on a website that has nothing to do … Another pointless propaganda post on a website that has nothing to do with the above.....


    Educate yourself with this site

    At the bottom of the page is a link called Help

    I suggest you read it especially the section titled Miscellaneous
    Edited by: "philphil61" 15th Feb

    wixxx

    Another pointless propaganda post on a website that has nothing to do … Another pointless propaganda post on a website that has nothing to do with the above.....



    This is MISC. Anything goes. If you want just deals, don't read MISC. Perhaps you should inform yourself before mouthing off. Toodle pip.

    Just read it,my apologies..Still seems pointless though.Bet some comments will soon get out of hand anyway..Might start up a post about my cat dying 20 years ago..as anything goes on this site by the sound of it.

    wixxx

    Just read it,my apologies..Still seems pointless though.Bet some comments … Just read it,my apologies..Still seems pointless though.Bet some comments will soon get out of hand anyway..Might start up a post about my cat dying 20 years ago..as anything goes on this site by the sound of it.



    You are welcome to do that in misc. Just don't be disheartened if some moron who hasn't got the faintest clue about the different sections of the site comes along and complains.

    I'm busy on that day with a meet up for the left behind ex's of fruitloops but I've shared it on my Facebook hopefully they get a massive turnout.

    RossD89

    You are welcome to do that in misc. Just don't be disheartened if some … You are welcome to do that in misc. Just don't be disheartened if some moron who hasn't got the faintest clue about the different sections of the site comes along and complains.


    I wouldn't concern yourself

    With all the input they've given since joining in 2014 I doubt it will be noticed

    ps For all others not understanding the basics of the site and it's tools

    When replying you could use the beneficial REPLY button - then the individual you are responding to will know you've made a valid attempt at a response

    The NHS is a victim of its own success I'm afraid, and is virtually a literal bottomless pit for cash, funding goes up every year but it will never be enough and unless you believe that the funding should be limitless to the detriment of all other public services then lines have to be drawn and services have to be limited, its harsh but its the truth imho.

    zworld

    Gte rid of the East Europeans and our NHS will survive.We didn't have NHS … Gte rid of the East Europeans and our NHS will survive.We didn't have NHS or housing crisis until these freeloading leeches started arriving by the millions


    Horrible, racist and untrue comment. Educate yourself on British values.

    coys67

    The NHS is a victim of its own success I'm afraid, and is virtually a … The NHS is a victim of its own success I'm afraid, and is virtually a literal bottomless pit for cash, funding goes up every year but it will never be enough and unless you believe that the funding should be limitless to the detriment of all other public services then lines have to be drawn and services have to be limited, its harsh but its the truth imho.



    No, not 'IMHO', this is fact, since inception of the NHS. The model does not work. Privatisation is inevitable.

    they're a bit late protesting for "no privatisation" (_;)
    makes me wonder if they even have a clue how this sector actually functions

    coys67

    The NHS is a victim of its own success I'm afraid, and is virtually a … The NHS is a victim of its own success I'm afraid, and is virtually a literal bottomless pit for cash, funding goes up every year but it will never be enough and unless you believe that the funding should be limitless to the detriment of all other public services then lines have to be drawn and services have to be limited, its harsh but its the truth imho.



    Funding goes up every year? What rock have you been under for the past 8 years?

    (as much as i detest the BBC for being biased, ill use their stories for simplicity):

    NHS cuts 'planned across England'

    NHS bosses 'trying to keep cuts secret'

    Etc Etc... lots more around as well (Mostly from Cameron's Era - although May seems to be continuing his 'cripple the country' legacy). The govt gives with one hand but takes with the other.
    About time protests were made against the continuous onslaught of cuts. The govt must be sitting on so much cash now, hidden away with the Treasury - because the maths just dont add up that they are telling us.

    Original Poster

    wixxx

    Just read it,my apologies..Still seems pointless though.Bet some comments … Just read it,my apologies..Still seems pointless though.Bet some comments will soon get out of hand anyway..Might start up a post about my cat dying 20 years ago..as anything goes on this site by the sound of it.


    Here is me thinking everyone wants to do a little bit for all us users of the NHS, and may feel compassionate... sic. Silence is golden, let others rejoice our efforts even if you think it is pointless as you don't have to lift a finger.

    wixxx

    Just read it,my apologies..Still seems pointless though.Bet some comments … Just read it,my apologies..Still seems pointless though.Bet some comments will soon get out of hand anyway..Might start up a post about my cat dying 20 years ago..as anything goes on this site by the sound of it.


    Tell me . . . about . . . your cat.



    It's okay.




    It wasn't your fault.





    . . . or was it?

    Original Poster

    coys67

    The NHS is a victim of its own success I'm afraid, and is virtually a … The NHS is a victim of its own success I'm afraid, and is virtually a literal bottomless pit for cash, funding goes up every year but it will never be enough and unless you believe that the funding should be limitless to the detriment of all other public services then lines have to be drawn and services have to be limited, its harsh but its the truth imho.


    The expression of "victim of its own success " is an Orwellian doublespeak and doublethink, reminder....war is peace, love is hate, freedom is slavery. Success is victim is a negative construct to twist an illogical ideology. Success is always measured with success criteria, success is never measured by victimised success. Success breeds success, not to breed victims and never to victimise itself.
    Always hold any one who use this doublespeak to account of exactly what he/she thinks.
    .
    NHS is never a bottomless pit for costs, never will be, it was and is tightly financially managed. Moreover, its costs may be ranked with EU countries cost metrics as for how they deliver health services.

    Edited by: "splender" 15th Feb

    118luke

    Funding goes up every year? What rock have you been under for the past 8 … Funding goes up every year? What rock have you been under for the past 8 years?(as much as i detest the BBC for being biased, ill use their stories for simplicity):NHS cuts 'planned across England'NHS bosses 'trying to keep cuts secret'Etc Etc... lots more around as well (Mostly from Cameron's Era - although May seems to be continuing his 'cripple the country' legacy). The govt gives with one hand but takes with the other. About time protests were made against the continuous onslaught of cuts. The govt must be sitting on so much cash now, hidden away with the Treasury - because the maths just dont add up that they are telling us.



    Without agreeing or disagreeing with you, neither of the articles you've linked to shows us a year on year spend by the NHS. It's hardly conclusive.

    Original Poster

    nbgrobbo

    No, not 'IMHO', this is fact, since inception of the NHS. The model does … No, not 'IMHO', this is fact, since inception of the NHS. The model does not work. Privatisation is inevitable.


    IMHO?! Irony, every EU citizen that I have ever spoken to said how good value for money our NHS was and is. Read here for The King's Fund chief economist for a professional view,
    kingsfund.org.uk/blo…lly
    cut and pasted as:-
    The growing gap between us and our European neighbours should give pause for thought. Tony Blair’s commitment was partly an appeal to ‘keeping up with the Schmidts and Lefebvres’. But it also emphasised that spending more on health care was affordable: if the Danes, Swedes, French and Germans can spend more on health care without apparently bankrupting the rest of their economy, why can’t we?
    https://www.kingsfund.org.uk/sites/files/kf/NHS-spending-international-comparison-fig-2.png


    Edited by: "splender" 15th Feb

    RuudBullit

    Without agreeing or disagreeing with you, neither of the articles you've … Without agreeing or disagreeing with you, neither of the articles you've linked to shows us a year on year spend by the NHS. It's hardly conclusive.



    Thats why i don't like BBC articles - They only ever show one side. Sadly its a common theme with nearly all media though

    One thing i can directly relate to though, is our Hospital A&E is earmarked for closure, despite it serving a population of 220,000 to transfer it to a neighboring town (smaller population that has a newer, PFI funded hospital).
    So when i hear about NHS cuts, i don't exactly welcome the news. Yes, the NHS is expensive, and the current "open door" policy to overseas visitors will certainly make it even more expensive. It has been abused for many years, by overseas visitors, Health boss mismanagement and by the government underfunding it.

    118luke

    Funding goes up every year? What rock have you been under for the past 8 … Funding goes up every year? What rock have you been under for the past 8 years?(as much as i detest the BBC for being biased, ill use their stories for simplicity):NHS cuts 'planned across England'NHS bosses 'trying to keep cuts secret'Etc Etc... lots more around as well (Mostly from Cameron's Era - although May seems to be continuing his 'cripple the country' legacy). The govt gives with one hand but takes with the other. About time protests were made against the continuous onslaught of cuts. The govt must be sitting on so much cash now, hidden away with the Treasury - because the maths just dont add up that they are telling us.



    NHS funding has increased, but it is relative.

    Original Poster

    Here is an introduction to some useful information just from one source, The King's Fund: The King's Fund is an independent charity working to improve health and care in England.
    kingsfund.org.uk/abo…-us
    People are not demonstrating just one or two things, they demostrate the whole shooting match, look on this web site's menu tab "Health Topics" and make your own placards, write letters to your MP....and so on.

    Original Poster

    RossD89

    NHS funding has increased, but it is relative.


    Moreover, critically, add the extra income and needs from the population growth from 60m to 65m. It is not just the absolute growth of NHS spending , you also need to look at the unit metric, spend per head/person. If your absolute money grows but spend per head/person drops is indicative of a growth in taxpayers and non-taxpayers increases faster than the extra income to the NHS.

    Original Poster

    118luke

    Thats why i don't like BBC articles - They only ever show one side. Sadly … Thats why i don't like BBC articles - They only ever show one side. Sadly its a common theme with nearly all media thoughOne thing i can directly relate to though, is our Hospital A&E is earmarked for closure, despite it serving a population of 220,000 to transfer it to a neighboring town (smaller population that has a newer, PFI funded hospital).So when i hear about NHS cuts, i don't exactly welcome the news. Yes, the NHS is expensive, and the current "open door" policy to overseas visitors will certainly make it even more expensive. It has been abused for many years, by overseas visitors, Health boss mismanagement and by the government underfunding it.


    For 2015/16, the overall NHS budget was around £116,400 million. The health tourism is in the order of £200m , so another words, health tourist is about 0.17% of total NHS costs.

    splender

    For 2015/16, the overall NHS budget was around £116,400 million. The … For 2015/16, the overall NHS budget was around £116,400 million. The health tourism is in the order of £200m , so another words, health tourist is about 0.17% of total NHS costs.


    Call me skeptical, but the phrase "number shuffling" is prominent in my mind when i read that article.
    There again, i rarely believe figures that are presented by the media - or the government. Figures are usually fudged to make them look far better or worse especially when it comes to finances, in order to soften/justify the shock value of cuts/tax increases.
    The government (especially Cameron) is, by far, the biggest liar when it comes to Financial figures.
    I'd love to get my hands on the actual finance details of the Government & Treasury, not the "filtered" ones presented by the media and Phillip Hammond. I bet theres some shocking truths about money coming in and where it goes (or any obvious black holes).

    tryn2help

    Tell me . . . about . . . your cat. It's okay.It wasn't your … Tell me . . . about . . . your cat. It's okay.It wasn't your fault.. . . or was it?



    ​maybe didn't read instructions for said cat....

    Rom

    Horrible, racist and untrue comment. Educate yourself on British values.


    Zworld, I'm east European and my contributions are about £10,000 every year. I'm wondering if you contribute as much as I do. All the best!

    Rom

    Horrible, racist and untrue comment. Educate yourself on British values.



    Yeah, when people tell the truth, they are classed as racist. Educate YOURSELF on British values! Right back at ya.

    timbotadumitruion

    Zworld, I'm east European and my contributions are about £10,000 every … Zworld, I'm east European and my contributions are about £10,000 every year. I'm wondering if you contribute as much as I do. All the best!



    Look at you, gloating on your 10k salary. I used to earn that when I worked in retail as a teenager.
    I am currently earning 8 times more than you. And, I don't claim benefits like you for my entire dynasty. Nor am I an illegal immigrant without a British visa.

    Edited by: "zworld" 16th Feb

    zworld

    About 8 times more than you. And, I don't claim benefits like you for my … About 8 times more than you. And, I don't claim benefits like you for my entire dynasty. Nor am I an illegal immigrant without a British visa.



    Your contributions are 8 times that?

    zworld, in my time here you more than anyone else have been wrong on almost every topic you decide to post on. You don't back up with facts and you're mostly ignored because the more 'entertaining' posters tend to mask your presence.

    What you lack in knowledge you more than make up for in resentment and bile though.

    The NHS crisis has little to do with immigration, in fact it couldn't function without it. It's been repeated time and time again but an ageing population is a huge burden on public services. Pensioners cost the health service about seven times as much as a 30 year old and the numbers of them are increasing year on year. That is not sustainable because the tax contribution of an older person actually falls too and there's not guarantee that they've 'paid into the system all their life' at a level that offsets this later cost.

    Saying it's eastern European freeloaders and making up guff about what you contribute (which no-one would believe and you would never back-up) is pretty much everything that decent British citizens despise about what this country is becoming.

    zworld

    About 8 times more than you. And, I don't claim benefits like you for my … About 8 times more than you. And, I don't claim benefits like you for my entire dynasty. Nor am I an illegal immigrant without a British visa.



    Ignorant pillock.

    HotEnglishAndWelshDeals

    zworld, in my time here you more than anyone else have been wrong on … zworld, in my time here you more than anyone else have been wrong on almost every topic you decide to post on. You don't back up with facts and you're mostly ignored because the more 'entertaining' posters tend to mask your presence.



    It's ok fella. I ignore your nonsensical posts as well.

    coys67

    The NHS is a victim of its own success I'm afraid, and is virtually a … The NHS is a victim of its own success I'm afraid, and is virtually a literal bottomless pit for cash, funding goes up every year but it will never be enough and unless you believe that the funding should be limitless to the detriment of all other public services then lines have to be drawn and services have to be limited, its harsh but its the truth imho.



    Not really its size is advantageous, they just need management with the balls to put their foot down to drive down prices with suppliers and a end to the culture of greedy people awarding each other with more undeserved wealth.

    zworld

    About 8 times more than you. And, I don't claim benefits like you for my … About 8 times more than you. And, I don't claim benefits like you for my entire dynasty. Nor am I an illegal immigrant without a British visa.


    Tax and NIC contributions of £80,000 a year would mean that you are earning in excess of £250,000 pa. So, how come you're driving around in an old banger and only go out once a week to shop at Asda?

    LOL

    zworld

    It's ok fella. I ignore your nonsensical posts as well.



    I don't ignore all your stuff and it helps build a picture of you.

    Like when you need advice on a 'noisy neighbour'. You get a picture of a man unable to assert himself, needing to ask others to help him because he's unable to help himself.

    Then you think how that must hold one back in their life, how frustrating that must be. So what do you do? You put that frustration on others....Eastern Europeans for example.

    It's very common nowadays where people don't take responsibility for themselves, they don't take responsibility for their own inadequacies so they blame others.

    But the frustration doesn't go away does it? X)

    zworld

    Look at you, gloating on your 10k salary. I used to earn that when I … Look at you, gloating on your 10k salary. I used to earn that when I worked in retail as a teenager.I am currently earning 8 times more than you. And, I don't claim benefits like you for my entire dynasty. Nor am I an illegal immigrant without a British visa.



    You earn 8 times 10k but can't figure out he said contribute 10k not earn 10k, hope your not in charge of anything financial.

    RonChew

    Tax and NIC contributions of £80,000 a year would mean that you are … Tax and NIC contributions of £80,000 a year would mean that you are earning in excess of £250,000 pa. So, how come you're driving around in an old banger and only go out once a week to shop at Asda?LOL



    Someone's going to say something about you looking through old posts, not realising that you can find info like that in about 5 seconds. X)

    To be fair if zworld is paying £80,000 a year in tax then he's got to economise somewhere.

    Plus he can use the money he's saved for assertiveness classes. X)

    zworld

    Look at you, gloating on your 10k salary. I used to earn that when I … Look at you, gloating on your 10k salary. I used to earn that when I worked in retail as a teenager.I am currently earning 8 times more than you. And, I don't claim benefits like you for my entire dynasty. Nor am I an illegal immigrant without a British visa.


    You've misread my post, the contributions only are £10,000 and apart from Child benefit I do not claim anything. There are plenty immigrants who, like me and my family, contribute towards British economy. Also there are loads of people taking advantage on the system and guess what, not all of them are foreigners.

    HotEnglishAndWelshDeals

    Someone's going to say something about you looking through old posts, not … Someone's going to say something about you looking through old posts, not realising that you can find info like that in about 5 seconds. X)To be fair if zworld is paying £80,000 a year in tax then he's got to economise somewhere.Plus he can use the money he's saved for assertiveness classes. X)


    Probably right. You can look at my profile and deduce that I am a sex-crazed drunk with an elderly cheap printer.
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