Parental Alienation - PA

33
Posted 9th Apr
Any HotUKDealers suffering from Parental Alienation ?
Do you think that both parents should have equal rights to see their children ?
Do you think Children should have the right to see both Parents?

There is a demonstration in London on the 25th April 2019 to create awareness

This could happen to anyone with kids.

Please support and spread the word.
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33 Comments
I think it’s difficult in this situation and two parents fighting over rights without thinking about the child does more harm than good. Having been through this as a child I experienced this and it’s made my view this, if parents can’t agree then the non resident should just give up. Pursuing their rights will only harm the child and is selfish.
cmdr_elito09/04/2019 15:04

I think it’s difficult in this situation and two parents fighting over r …I think it’s difficult in this situation and two parents fighting over rights without thinking about the child does more harm than good. Having been through this as a child I experienced this and it’s made my view this, if parents can’t agree then the non resident should just give up. Pursuing their rights will only harm the child and is selfish.


Do you think it is better for a child to only see one parent ? My own view is that it is selfish of the resident parent to keep the child away from a loving parent.
mrtootough09/04/2019 15:07

Do you think it is better for a child to only see one parent ? My own view …Do you think it is better for a child to only see one parent ? My own view is that it is selfish of the resident parent to keep the child away from a loving parent.


It’s better for child to see both parents but when one doesn’t see it that way it’s just as selfish to put a child through court cases to get access.....someone has to be an adult.
Edited by: "cmdr_elito" 9th Apr
cmdr_elito11 m ago

It’s better for child to see both parents but when one doesn’t see it that …It’s better for child to see both parents but when one doesn’t see it that way it’s just as selfish to put a child through court cases to get access.....someone has to be an adult.


I don't see how a parent who is alienating would be the best parent to the child/children. This is child abuse. All children should have a right to see both parents.
Didn’t have parental alienation, but did have other things that weren’t great to be dealing with. My parents never spoke to each other and always got us to pass on messages to the other, and when one was angry at the other they would complain to us. It got really old and tiring to deal with.
mrtootough09/04/2019 15:07

Do you think it is better for a child to only see one parent ? My own view …Do you think it is better for a child to only see one parent ? My own view is that it is selfish of the resident parent to keep the child away from a loving parent.


what if the other (non-resident) parent is abusive/damaging but the child wants to see them nevertheless?
Mechtup09/04/2019 16:26

Didn’t have parental alienation, but did have other things "and when one w …Didn’t have parental alienation, but did have other things "and when one was angry at the other they would complain to us. It got really old and tiring to deal with."



That is classic Parental Alienation but in your case it was committed by both parents.
It comes in many forms.from total alienation, to lying to, to psychologically manipulating children to lose respect or interest in the other parent. .
It is a globally recognised form of child abuse but not a specific offence in the England. A little like "upskirting that is covered by gross indecency laws but now is a stand alone offence, parental alienation is not a specific offence but should be as it is rife.
davewave09/04/2019 16:38

what if the other (non-resident) parent is abusive/damaging but the child …what if the other (non-resident) parent is abusive/damaging but the child wants to see them nevertheless?


Supervised access is the only option in this case.
mrtootough4 m ago

Supervised access is the only option in this case.


makes sense
cmdr_elito09/04/2019 16:06

It’s better for child to see both parents but when one doesn’t see it that …It’s better for child to see both parents but when one doesn’t see it that way it’s just as selfish to put a child through court cases to get access.....someone has to be an adult.


In general children don't go through court cases. Cafcass will be involved. they will speak to the child or children involved, and will represent what they feel is in the best interests for the children in court. Cafcass can see through any parent manipulation, and they have the child's interest at heart, not either of the parents. My experience with Cafcass was like a breathe of fresh air after having to deal with my son's mother for years. She treated cafcass, and the courts in the same manner she treated me. The result was the court awarded a Residence Order in my favour.
Edited by: "OllieSt" 9th Apr
Both parents should be equal, Sadly that's not always the case and the real victims are always the kids. If most parents loved their kids then they shouldn't use them as pawns etc..
OllieSt1 h, 41 m ago

In general children don't go through court cases. Cafcass will be …In general children don't go through court cases. Cafcass will be involved. they will speak to the child or children involved, and will represent what they feel is in the best interests for the children in court. Cafcass can see through any parent manipulation, and they have the child's interest at heart, not either of the parents. My experience with Cafcass was like a breathe of fresh air after having to deal with my son's mother for years. She treated cafcass, and the courts in the same manner she treated me. The result was the court awarded a Residence Order in my favour.


We didn’t go to the court case but we were interviewed multiple times by the court welfare staff and had to be taken out of school for that missing days as the court was miles away. We then had to go through supervised visits etc which was traumatic for us and again missed time off school for that too. We were made to write letters etc against our will. Anyone that says it doesn’t have any impact on the child is wrong it impacted both myself and my brother badly.

If I were in the situation and it got to the point of court cases etc I’d walk away let the child know I love them and where they can find me if they ever need me. A child is not an object to be fought over.

In my case my mum won and my dad was denied access in the end, I didn’t see him for 26 years and now have a good relationship with both him and my mum despite this. Sometimes walking away does the least damage to children but appreciate every circumstance is different.
Yeah every case is different. As a parent, to wilfully walk away must be an incredibly difficult thing to do. I actually had my son dumped on my doorstep with all his clothes and toys aged 9. 5 days later his mum wanted him back. I said no, she took me to court, and the rest is history.

What you talk about is what I noted in the OP. All too often people want to talk about parent's rights, when the reality is parent's responsibility. To walk away from your children for the sake of your children is responsibility at the highest level in some cases, but not all. But boy, I don't think I could do that.
davewave09/04/2019 16:38

what if the other (non-resident) parent is abusive/damaging but the child …what if the other (non-resident) parent is abusive/damaging but the child wants to see them nevertheless?


Parental rights! As long as the child’s welfare isn’t in jeopardy!
Point of reference, Parental Alienation - One parent manipulating the child into a false feeling/knowledge base resulting in the child not wanting contact with the non-resident parent. Non-acrimonious divorces/child arrangement orders does not constitute parental alienation
Bullet198009/04/2019 19:02

Parental rights! As long as the child’s welfare isn’t in jeopardy!


Parental RESPONSIBILITIES, not rights.

Bullet198009/04/2019 19:06

Point of reference, Parental Alienation - One parent manipulating the …Point of reference, Parental Alienation - One parent manipulating the child into a false feeling/knowledge base resulting in the child not wanting contact with the non-resident parent. Non-acrimonious divorces/child arrangement orders does not constitute parental alienation



And that is iresponsible parenting.
Edited by: "OllieSt" 9th Apr
Bullet198009/04/2019 19:00

Comment deleted


Alienation would be the product of one parent alienating the other....the outcome of the case and intention of the case was to prevent my father from seeing us therefore alienating him..........what’s there to learn.....some of the claims made by my mum were exaggerated.

Suggest you educate yourself in reality....it’s not all black and white. It’s often wrapped up in emotions and circumstances.
Edited by: "cmdr_elito" 9th Apr
OllieSt09/04/2019 19:09

Parental RESPONSIBILITIES, not rights.And that is iresponsible parenting.


cmdr_elito09/04/2019 19:13

Alienation would be the product of one parent alienating the other....the …Alienation would be the product of one parent alienating the other....the outcome of the case and intention of the case was to prevent my father from seeing us therefore alienating him..........what’s there to learn.....some of the claims made by my mum were exaggerated.Suggest you educate yourself in reality....it’s not all black and white. It’s often wrapped up in emotions and circumstances.


Child welfare comes first in all cases. Simple!
Courts adopt a contact approach when it comes access to children (as long as the child’s welfare isn’t at risk) then the non-res parent has access! (as it should be)
Alienation is when due to the res-parent personally hating the other parent they convince the child to not want to see that parent.... THAT IS DISGUSTING. AND NOT FIGHTING A RES-PARENT AND JUST GIVING UP IS IRRESPONSIBLE PARENTING!
Willy_Wonka09/04/2019 16:39

That is classic Parental Alienation but in your case it was committed by …That is classic Parental Alienation but in your case it was committed by both parents. It comes in many forms.from total alienation, to lying to, to psychologically manipulating children to lose respect or interest in the other parent. . It is a globally recognised form of child abuse but not a specific offence in the England. A little like "upskirting that is covered by gross indecency laws but now is a stand alone offence, parental alienation is not a specific offence but should be as it is rife.


Ah didn’t even realise that. I did know it wasn’t fair, but at the same time I was still having to deal with it. My father did it the most, and for some strange reason nowadays I don’t see him that often
Bullet198009/04/2019 19:18

Child welfare comes first in all cases. Simple!Courts adopt a contact …Child welfare comes first in all cases. Simple!Courts adopt a contact approach when it comes access to children (as long as the child’s welfare isn’t at risk) then the non-res parent has access! (as it should be)Alienation is when due to the res-parent personally hating the other parent they convince the child to not want to see that parent.... THAT IS DISGUSTING. AND NOT FIGHTING A RES-PARENT AND JUST GIVING UP IS IRRESPONSIBLE PARENTING!


No it’s not. Often it’s difficult to prove and if the child’s truely brainwashed then they will side with that parent (the one doing the alienation) and fighting the child’s wishes will further alienate the child from the parent resulting in further degradation of the relationship. Walking away although very hard is often the best solution.
Bullet198016 m ago

Child welfare comes first in all cases. Simple!Courts adopt a contact …Child welfare comes first in all cases. Simple!Courts adopt a contact approach when it comes access to children (as long as the child’s welfare isn’t at risk) then the non-res parent has access! (as it should be)Alienation is when due to the res-parent personally hating the other parent they convince the child to not want to see that parent.... THAT IS DISGUSTING. AND NOT FIGHTING A RES-PARENT AND JUST GIVING UP IS IRRESPONSIBLE PARENTING!


Everyone has an opinion.
Bullet198009/04/2019 19:18

Child welfare comes first in all cases. Simple!Courts adopt a contact …Child welfare comes first in all cases. Simple!Courts adopt a contact approach when it comes access to children (as long as the child’s welfare isn’t at risk) then the non-res parent has access! (as it should be)Alienation is when due to the res-parent personally hating the other parent they convince the child to not want to see that parent.... THAT IS DISGUSTING. AND NOT FIGHTING A RES-PARENT AND JUST GIVING UP IS IRRESPONSIBLE PARENTING!


I suppose if one parent is denying access to a child for no good reason, and the other parent just gives up, then perhaps the best place for the child is in care. After all, they are both behaving in an irresponsible manner.

Would you agree?
OllieSt09/04/2019 19:38

I suppose if one parent is denying access to a child for no good reason, …I suppose if one parent is denying access to a child for no good reason, and the other parent just gives up, then perhaps the best place for the child is in care. After all, they are both behaving in an irresponsible manner. Would you agree?


Yes if a parent gives up to an wrong situation (someone brainwashing of a child) then care might just be best
cmdr_elito29 m ago

No it’s not. Often it’s difficult to prove and if the child’s truely brain …No it’s not. Often it’s difficult to prove and if the child’s truely brainwashed then they will side with that parent (the one doing the alienation) and fighting the child’s wishes will further alienate the child from the parent resulting in further degradation of the relationship. Walking away although very hard is often the best solution.


Most courts support the view children’s interests are best met with shared contact with both parents providing there are no welfare or child protection issues. Unfortunately on occasion parents use the child as a tool to alienate each other resulting in court action which is very costly and emotionally draining if your working and can’t get legal aid. But to walk away leaves the child possibility believing the absent parent does not want them.
Bullet198009/04/2019 19:51

Yes if a parent gives up to an wrong situation (someone brainwashing of a …Yes if a parent gives up to an wrong situation (someone brainwashing of a child) then care might just be best


Why only might?

Is the parent that gave up any more irresponsible than the parent this is doing the brainwashing?

What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

I am surprised that your response wasn't just a resounding "yes of course the child should be placed into care"
Edited by: "OllieSt" 9th Apr
OllieSt9 m ago

Why only might? Is the parent that gave up any more irresponsible than …Why only might? Is the parent that gave up any more irresponsible than the parent this is doing the brainwashing?What's good for the goose is good for the gander.I am surprised that your response wasn't just a resounding "yes of course the child should be placed into care"


If the non-rea parent is unwell (for instance) and simply can’t fight with the tenacity required or will result in irreparable harm there is an argument.... otherwise, as the courts favour, both parents have access!!!!
A weak non-res parent doesn’t have the right to just give up and walk away (imho)
Mechtup09/04/2019 19:20

Ah didn’t even realise that. I did know it wasn’t fair, but at the same tim …Ah didn’t even realise that. I did know it wasn’t fair, but at the same time I was still having to deal with it. My father did it the most, and for some strange reason nowadays I don’t see him that often


But that is what Parental Alienation is. One or both parents trying to manipulate a child for the parents own psychological benefit.
Which is why in the 1970s it became a class of child abuse in International Law which we & hundreds of other countries signed up for.
However, in the UK the courts are reluctant to prosecute a parent for child abuse because Parental Alienation has not been listed as a specific offence.
As mentioned previously a body was recently formed called CAFCASS & as of 6 months ago they recognise it as a criminal offence of child abuse.
CAFCASS only look after the interests of the child & advise the court if they feel one parent or both are behaving like idiots. Hopefully soon the manipulation of children will be a listed criminal offence in the Law Pages.
Willy_Wonka09/04/2019 20:08

But that is what Parental Alienation is. One or both parents trying to …But that is what Parental Alienation is. One or both parents trying to manipulate a child for the parents own psychological benefit. Which is why in the 1970s it became a class of child abuse in International Law which we & hundreds of other countries signed up for. However, in the UK the courts are reluctant to prosecute a parent for child abuse because Parental Alienation has not been listed as a specific offence. As mentioned previously a body was recently formed called CAFCASS & as of 6 months ago they recognise it as a criminal offence of child abuse. CAFCASS only look after the interests of the child & advise the court if they feel one parent or both are behaving like idiots. Hopefully soon the manipulation of children will be a listed criminal offence in the Law Pages.


I think for more severe cases it should be. PA wasn’t the only reason why I rarely see my father and definitely isn’t the main one.
Mechtup23 m ago

I think for more severe cases it should be. PA wasn’t the only reason why I …I think for more severe cases it should be. PA wasn’t the only reason why I rarely see my father and definitely isn’t the main one.


Yes. But that is the point of it all. The children make their minds up on their own without vicious behaviour by the parents.
Willy_Wonka09/04/2019 20:08

But that is what Parental Alienation is. One or both parents trying to …But that is what Parental Alienation is. One or both parents trying to manipulate a child for the parents own psychological benefit. Which is why in the 1970s it became a class of child abuse in International Law which we & hundreds of other countries signed up for. However, in the UK the courts are reluctant to prosecute a parent for child abuse because Parental Alienation has not been listed as a specific offence. As mentioned previously a body was recently formed called CAFCASS & as of 6 months ago they recognise it as a criminal offence of child abuse. CAFCASS only look after the interests of the child & advise the court if they feel one parent or both are behaving like idiots. Hopefully soon the manipulation of children will be a listed criminal offence in the Law Pages.


There is a current petition to have this listed for debate in parliament. I urge you all to sign it. petition.parliament.uk/pet…833
mrtootough09/04/2019 20:53

There is a current petition to have this listed for debate in parliament. …There is a current petition to have this listed for debate in parliament. I urge you all to sign it. https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/249833


Yeah I will sign it. But let us get things straight. It is already a criminal offence but the Government choose not to enforce because it says them money.

Our country signed an International Agreement in the 70s classing this behaviour as child abuse.
Willy_Wonka09/04/2019 21:05

Yeah I will sign it. But let us get things straight. It is already a …Yeah I will sign it. But let us get things straight. It is already a criminal offence but the Government choose not to enforce because it says them money.Our country signed an International Agreement in the 70s classing this behaviour as child abuse.


Thanks for signing. I wasn’t aware it is already an offence
mrtootough1 h, 23 m ago

Thanks for signing. I wasn’t aware it is already an offence


Yes it is a criminal offence to manipulate a child. It is child abuse.

BUT our legal system cannot be arsed because they like upskirting because its trendy. A few women are happy about this upskirting action bit but obviously the matter of child abuse takes 2nd place. Even though it is ten thousand times more reported than a bloke with a camera on his toes.
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