Pepipoo down.. I need PCN advice please!

15
Found 24th Jan 2016
The council have oversubbed on parking permitts in our area and as a result there are often no parking spaces.. including single yellow parking. There is however a small area (enought for a car and a further 5m before the corner) that is just behind the marked bays but it is marked with a double yellow. We parked there overnight and got a penalty at 8pm.

The penalty notice states:
"Parked in restricted street during prescribed hours"

As we have a permit to park in the street then is the contravention code incorrect and grounds for appeal?

Thanks for any help in advance.
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15 Comments
Original Poster
Council evidence below in 3 photos.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7146292/pp6.png
Banned
the site is up & running
id think parking in the correct bays without a permit is the same as parking outside the bays with a permit. Either way its one tick and one cross. They may charge the two example offences under the same code of "Parked in restricted street during prescribed hours".

Regardless of ur permit, u parked on the double yellows which kinda makes ur permit baseless.

could argue all the spaces where taken up at the time, but ud need supporting evidence to add any weight to your argument.
Original Poster
YouDontWantToKnow

the site is up & running



It's up until you try and login.

forums.pepipoo.com/
Original Poster
Thanks for the reply dixin. I'm with you and agree we parking illegally. They dropped our last penalty as goodwill but said that they were not oversubscribed. The only reason we received the penalty is that another car parked behind us right up to the corner and blocked someones driveway so we both got ticketed late at night.

Really very hard to prove that there are no parking spaces at night and doubly hard to get them to admit they are over subbed. Residents have said it has got much worse in the past 2 years with many flats now being subletted to groups rather than families with the Council allowing 1 x permit and 3 x visitor passes per household which is insaine.
I'm not sure why the fact there's no free spaces makes you think they shouldn't ticket you for parking on double yellows?
Even if you could prove there's no parking spaces at night, how would that help you?
Park somewhere else rather than illegally?
TheGimp

Thanks for the reply dixin. I'm with you and agree we parking illegally. … Thanks for the reply dixin. I'm with you and agree we parking illegally. They dropped our last penalty as goodwill but said that they were not oversubscribed. The only reason we received the penalty is that another car parked behind us right up to the corner and blocked someones driveway so we both got ticketed late at night. Really very hard to prove that there are no parking spaces at night and doubly hard to get them to admit they are over subbed. Residents have said it has got much worse in the past 2 years with many flats now being subletted to groups rather than families with the Council allowing 1 x permit and 3 x visitor passes per household which is insaine.



its a complicated one. I dont think there is anything illegal if per say the council sold 50 permits if there is only 10 spaces, after all, ur paying for the right to park there, not for a designated personal parking spot that only you can park in. But rationally and morally they should ensure that it isnt over subscribed.

My honest opinion is to accept the fine and learn from it. Like u said its now the 2nd fine you've received. The permit doesnt guarantee a spot to park for u, it merely gives u the right to park there within the terms and conditions.
Banned
dixin123

I dont think there is anything illegal if per say the council sold 50 … I dont think there is anything illegal if per say the council sold 50 permits if there is only 10 spaces



There isnt. You are right.

BUT the council have an obligation to behave reasonably when fining people.

& as this ticket is as a result of their own over subscription the adjudicator may find the actions of the council to be unreasonable,
Original Poster
Can I request the council release the number of permits releases versus the number of parking spaces under freedom of information act?
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TheGimp

Can I request the council release the number of permits releases versus … Can I request the council release the number of permits releases versus the number of parking spaces under freedom of information act?



You can ask for whatever information you want that is relevant to your defense. I dont think in your case its freedom of information but relates to the laws under disclosure which makes them legally obliged to release information due to the fine & justice process.

I am no expert though.
Original Poster
This is where I parked (close to the car in front). The double is brokenish and really this should be a single or a new parking space IMO.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7146292/parking_penalty1.jpg
Banned
TheGimp

This is where I parked (close to the car in front). The double is … This is where I parked (close to the car in front). The double is brokenish and really this should be a single or a new parking space IMO[/img]



Looks like a once double line that one line was overpainted in black to turn it into a single line to me. & that black paint has started to wear off.

The rest you said in the post isnt really applicable.

In any case. Parking just into a no parking zone and getting a fine is harsh I think bearing in mind the over subscription of permits.

Try pepipoo again
Looking at the photo you may be able the claim the double yellow line is not clear (I think if the double yellow line marking is not clear or badly faded it could be grounds for the ticket being dropped).

thisismoney.co.uk/mon…tml

On the webpage linked to above it says (article was from 2011 so don't know whaether anything has changed since then)

All single and double yellow lines have to be continuous, unbroken and must end in a 'T-bar'. If there are breaks in the line, or the line does not end in a T-bar (except where the line is broken with other road markings), this can invalidate any ticket given anywhere on the line.



Edited by: "thomas58" 24th Jan 2016
just out of curiosity what are the prescribed hours of your zone?

also you'll not get anywhere with saying there were no parking spaces. you might be on to something with the yellow lines as it looks like a single not a double so if you've been given the wrong code on your ticket they can't enforce it. But you've not shared what code number they've put on your ticket.

For all my PCN's I use consumeractiongroup.co.uk they're extremely helpful.

got one on my own road as I live opposite a school. hubby cane home from a night shift and there was no parking at all so parked in the summer hols on the school zig zag lines which clearly stated no parking Mon - Fri. We were new to this whole zone thing and didn't realise the single yellow line running alongside it had a different enforcement. got a ticket even went to adjudicator and said other people had won on adjudication on the basis that there should have been another board stating the different restrictions. and even the traffic guidelines state there should be clear signage where 2 different restrictions apply to avoid confusion but we still lost.

good luck
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