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    please help with online fraud

    Hi
    I'm really hoping someone can help me with this please;
    So my cousin was due a tax refund, he received an email that looked genuine with all his details and info about the refund. Anyway he entered his bank account details in order to get the refund. However afterwards he realised it was fraudulent as they took over £700 out of his account. He explained the situation to his bank, Lloyd's who have basically told him that it's his own fault and there's nothing they can do. Is this right? They are apparently still investigating but I know this is stressing him a lot as it's a lot of money just before Christmas and at the worse possible.

    I would really like some insight on this
    Many thanks

    30 Comments

    HM Revenues and Customs website states they will never contact you by email.

    If the bank made a mistake they would refund the costs. But if he entered the details I doubt they would refund then. They will see this as human error and beyond their control. May be worth asking the bank again or see if they can meet him half way. He could always threaten to leave the bank if they don't do anything. There are plenty of incentives with other banks to open up a new account that may offset some of his losses. Halifax currently offer £100 to new customers.

    I know he probably knows this by now but NEVER give personal details to someone that contacts you. Expensive mistake to make. Hope he gets it all sorted.

    need to contact action fraud. its up to the bank if they will refund anything.

    Original Poster

    mag6869

    HM Revenues and Customs website states they will never contact you by … HM Revenues and Customs website states they will never contact you by email.



    Yes he didn't know this at the time and it was just unfortunate that he was actually waiting for a tax efficient

    Original Poster

    dudwood_fudwood

    If the bank made a mistake they would refund the costs. But if he entered … If the bank made a mistake they would refund the costs. But if he entered the details I doubt they would refund then. They will see this as human error and beyond their control. May be worth asking the bank again or see if they can meet him half way. He could always threaten to leave the bank if they don't do anything. There are plenty of incentives with other banks to open up a new account that may offset some of his losses. Halifax currently offer £100 to new customers. I know he probably knows this by now but NEVER give personal details to someone that contacts you. Expensive mistake to make. Hope he gets it all sorted.



    Thanks a lot, I feel really bad for him. He's such a good person but at the moment it's one thing after another

    Original Poster

    discozohan

    need to contact action fraud. its up to the bank if they will refund … need to contact action fraud. its up to the bank if they will refund anything.


    Thanks a lot, I'll double check if he has contacted them, I know he had to go to the police to report it and get a fraud reference number or something

    Nothing he can do as its his mistake for handing out his details.

    pookey1

    Thanks a lot, I feel really bad for him. He's such a good person but at … Thanks a lot, I feel really bad for him. He's such a good person but at the moment it's one thing after another



    It's often the case. The good people get screwed and scum bags get away with it. At least he has someone like you looking out for him. Money can't buy that. Good luck.

    Banks will help recover money in circumstances where account details have been stolen, however if the account information was given freely then its an act of "gross negligence" (taken from Lloyds website) on the part if the customer and they rightfully will not compensate the customer. Whilst I feel sorry for your friend, there us good reason not to compensate them....by doing so it would open the door for anyone to give out account details without caution and expect the bank to compensate them for any loss encountered as a result.

    However that said, a crime has taken place and your friend is the victim (importantly not the bank) and they should report it to actionfraud for investigation.

    Whilst £700 is a lot of money, I would seek a little comfort in the fact that it was *only* £700 and the crime was identified before any further money was taken. That's not to belittle the situation but some people have lost £10,000s.

    The best way to deal with any email requesting personal information is to:
    - close the email
    - contact the company/person by phone, callling on a number you are satisfied is genuine
    - verify if the email is genuine with them

    Tiresome and long winded...but safe.


    Good luck to your friend, sorry for their loss this time of year.

    I get emails and texts frequently claiming to be from the tax office, Halifax, Tesco, and various other banks and building societies claiming there is fraudulent activity on my account or I'm due a tax refund. I know these are fake because I don't bank with any of them and I know I'm not due a refund, but they send them to hundreds of people in the hope maybe just one person does and they reply with their details. Most companies have a department to deal with these emails so I forward them to them in the hope they will look into it and prevent someone from being duped. If I get any request for my info, and I think it might be genuine (if I am expecting it etc) I always call the company first to check it is from them (99.% of the time it isn't) it's a bit of a pain I know, but easier than what you're going through right now, but I guess you both know that now. Maybe Citizen's Advice could help to see if there is anything you can do. Hope it's sorted.

    As I was writing my "essay" the poster above me posted what I was writing (great minds think alike)

    Chalk it up to a life lesson, it is not the banks fault obviously. He chose to enter the his details into the website.

    While there are people still falling for scams like this they will continue to be sent.

    Sucks for your cousin, but hopefully he will never do this kind of thing again

    He must have done more then enter his bank account details. I can get all that every time someone writes me a check.
    Guessing he gave them card numbers from some type of card or gave them his online banking passwords. The reason its important as in some circumstances he would have protection.

    My Daughter received the same email a couple of weeks ago. She was so excited that she would be able to pay off her overdraft. Luckily she was at home at the time and I was able to tell her it was a scam.

    How could they have extracted £700 with just his bank details as that information is on every cheque you write.

    I suspect he actually gave his card details including ccv in which case it is entirely his fault. Lesson learned.

    It is now the responsibility of people to ensure they don't fall for these sorts of scams where banks are concerned, and he will not get the money refunded no matter how much fuss he makes. Also, not having the proper level of anti-virus on your computer can also go against you too.


    And I do sympathise because whilst we all know non-legit emails do come, on one of my "spam email addresses" I use for sites where I doubt that it won't get sold on/hacked etc I had this "tax refund" email come through without being picked up on by the email providers spam filters where as usually the fake bank emails all just go to junk so I can see how someone can fall for it if it gets into the regular inbox.

    basically you have to tell the bank £700 has gone out of his account and he doesn't know where it's gone or how they got it. never admit to making a mistake or you accept liability for it. even though he already contacted the bank I would contact them again and say you don't know how or where the money has gone and if they say anything about your earlier phone call with them. say he has a disability like anxiety or something and panicked.

    Original Poster

    brendanhickey

    basically you have to tell the bank £700 has gone out of his account and … basically you have to tell the bank £700 has gone out of his account and he doesn't know where it's gone or how they got it. never admit to making a mistake or you accept liability for it. even though he already contacted the bank I would contact them again and say you don't know how or where the money has gone and if they say anything about your earlier phone call with them. say he has a disability like anxiety or something and panicked.


    This would have been best in the beginning but he's already been to the police and given out all the information. It would be very obvious to chance his story now.

    Original Poster

    Thanks for all your answers and advice.
    I'm not entirely sure if he gave out the full card details so I'll have to check with him.
    I too always get these emails and also forward them on in the hopes they get investigated but I guess there's too many to keep up with.

    Most people who get these e-mails don't seem to realise that they never gave their e-mail address to HMRC (regardless of whether they say they will never e-mail people).

    They seem to think the tax man is all powerful and knows this information from some 'other' source.

    Original Poster

    Bigfootpete

    Most people who get these e-mails don't seem to realise that they never … Most people who get these e-mails don't seem to realise that they never gave their e-mail address to HMRC (regardless of whether they say they will never e-mail people).They seem to think the tax man is all powerful and knows this information from some 'other' source.


    But if you do your tax return online, don't they ask you for an email?
    I still do mine on paper so not sure about this

    pookey1

    This would have been best in the beginning but he's already been to the … This would have been best in the beginning but he's already been to the police and given out all the information. It would be very obvious to chance his story now.



    ​it wouldn't be obvious. disabled people fall victim to these all the time and one of the first thing they do is try and hide it out of fear or embarrassment. I have got my little brother back is money a few times. when you phone the bank they are never going to question a possible disability and anxiety attack is a genuine thing that your friend probably felt when he first noticed the money was gone so it's not as if you would be lying.

    pookey1

    But if you do your tax return online, don't they ask you for an email? I … But if you do your tax return online, don't they ask you for an email? I still do mine on paper so not sure about this


    No they don't ask for email address and don't communicate via email regarding tax affairs

    Can't believe people still fall for this type of scam, how many times is it on the news, or even on social media, I agree with the bank lesson learned

    brendanhickey

    basically you have to tell the bank £700 has gone out of his account and … basically you have to tell the bank £700 has gone out of his account and he doesn't know where it's gone or how they got it. never admit to making a mistake or you accept liability for it. even though he already contacted the bank I would contact them again and say you don't know how or where the money has gone and if they say anything about your earlier phone call with them. say he has a disability like anxiety or something and panicked.


    he will need a time machine to carry out your suggestion

    GNKelly07

    Just been on the news that banks are not recommended to compensate … Just been on the news that banks are not recommended to compensate customers falling foul of this kind of scam -HERE


    Good old Which? for taking this on!
    The general public and corporations, businesses, banks, IT companies, government etc are all guilty of allowing such an insecure way of transferring money electronically from one account to another. The criminally minded will always look for opportunities to steal. But there is no excuse for handing them things like this on a plate.
    I dare to suggest before the invention of internet banking that cheque fraud was not as common and much more secure. It is becoming harder and harder to insist financial transactions are done by means of the old fashioned post system

    I'm confused in how this scam has got the money.. If it was by giving card details then 100% you can get the money back. You just dispute the transaction. If it was log in details given out then clearly a scam... The only way this scam is irreversible is if the money was bank transfered... which if this was the case then I'm sorry but that is unbelievable how someone can fall for that. Why would anyone transfer money anywhere when they are being told they are receiving money?

    Not sure but the phishing email's aim is to make you enter the details. It's the nature of the fraud. Your friend needs to put his foot down with the bank and tell them he has a crime reference number.
    Edited by: "mr_geese" 16th Dec 2016

    The Inland Revenue already have your account details if you pay your tax due online.

    Is this a joke, oldest trick in the book,

    All his details oO
    When I get messages from HMRC they always call me Mr JOHN or Jennifer
    With the only thing correct being my email address
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