Seems that Uber will NOT have it's London Licence Renewed by TFL - declaring that they are not "fit & proper"

Mod & Ed 81
Found 22nd Sep 2017
Breaking news - thought this worth sharing as so many people rely on Uber for cheap commutes

TFL were due to make a decision on Uber's new London licence by the end of the month, but have bought it forward & have now announced that they WILL NOT be renewing the licence declaring that they are not "fit & proper"

Uber has around 40,000 drivers in London & over 3.5 million people use the service

How will this affect you?

Link to story HERE

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Good. Their illegal refusal of numerous Guidedog owners for a start warrants this. Let alone their sex pest drivers.
In London, as the regulator, TfL is responsible for reviewing and setting Licensed black cab taxi fares and tariffs which are fixed via the meter and shown on the inside doors of all black cabs. Uber meanwhile sets its own prices and uses surge pricing whenever they want as evidenced in the London Bridge atrocity.
it's really about safety, uber cars are often shared 24/7with only the lead driver on Uber's books, the other drivers are not CRB checked, might not hold licences or insurance.
CRB checks are only on criminal records within the U.K., so if you have a driver that has recently come into the UK nobody knows if they're a murderer, rapist, violent, drink driver etc...
splender4 m ago

My only grade E in RE at school education suggests 40k of a tinny tad …My only grade E in RE at school education suggests 40k of a tinny tad better terms drivers may replace 40k current terms drivers ? !


Just out of interest - what was your grade in English Language?
In all seriousness however, this is a classic case of rent seekers (Black cabs and their crony capitalist allies) using the law selectively to stifle competition. The real solution lies in regulating Uber, not banning it.

As previously mentioned, what is going to happen with the 30,000+ Uber drivers and their families? The authorities in London clearly don't care. Why should we pay rip off fares to black cabs? I personally find Black cab drivers to be rude, aggressive on the road, don't take credit cards even though they are required to and unwilling to make certain journeys away from their home area. Uber, even though its corporate governance must be improved, is a much better experience and cheaper.
Edited by: "m5rcc" 23rd Sep 2017
81 Comments
About time.
Good. Their illegal refusal of numerous Guidedog owners for a start warrants this. Let alone their sex pest drivers.
Long live the black cab!
NIgelK3 m ago

Good. Their illegal refusal of numerous Guidedog owners for a start …Good. Their illegal refusal of numerous Guidedog owners for a start warrants this. Let alone their sex pest drivers.


Tbf I've read more false rape claims on their drivers.
An unusual act of protectionism in this day and age. Good news if the scale and number of issues truly warrant it - Bad news for consumer choice otherwise. Clear failure by both parties to find compromise with suitable adherence to sensible regulations.
The people who run Uber are the worst but the idea around Uber and Lyft is great. Taxi's need competition as the prices are just stupid. maybe Im speaking of my local area and Cardiff but those prices are just all over the place. No consistency, the service sucks and its pure hit and miss if they actually want to go down the street you live in to drop off.

Maybe taxi firms should have a rating system just like Uber so maybe the drivers will sort them selves out.

Fingers crossed it doesnt affect here but with London doing it, I expect it will
NIgelK17 m ago

Good. Their illegal refusal of numerous Guidedog owners for a start …Good. Their illegal refusal of numerous Guidedog owners for a start warrants this. Let alone their sex pest drivers.




In all fairness it is not Uber who refuse to take customers and their assistance dogs, it is some of their drivers.
Edited by: "RossD89" 22nd Sep 2017
darthvader666uk6 m ago

The people who run Uber are the worst but the idea around Uber and Lyft is …The people who run Uber are the worst but the idea around Uber and Lyft is great. Taxi's need competition as the prices are just stupid. maybe Im speaking of my local area and Cardiff but those prices are just all over the place. No consistency, the service sucks and its pure hit and miss if they actually want to go down the street you live in to drop off.Maybe taxi firms should have a rating system just like Uber so maybe the drivers will sort them selves out.Fingers crossed it doesnt affect here but with London doing it, I expect it will



In many towns and cities taxi fares are regulated by the local authority. Uber's prices aren't - as far as I'm aware.
Uber is bigger than TFL their lawers will win an appeal
In London, as the regulator, TfL is responsible for reviewing and setting Licensed black cab taxi fares and tariffs which are fixed via the meter and shown on the inside doors of all black cabs. Uber meanwhile sets its own prices and uses surge pricing whenever they want as evidenced in the London Bridge atrocity.
it's really about safety, uber cars are often shared 24/7with only the lead driver on Uber's books, the other drivers are not CRB checked, might not hold licences or insurance.
CRB checks are only on criminal records within the U.K., so if you have a driver that has recently come into the UK nobody knows if they're a murderer, rapist, violent, drink driver etc...
Yes but they just said they can still operate until all appeals are used up which can take at least a few years so situation is the same.
nougat11 m ago

Uber is bigger than TFL their lawers will win an appeal


They will definitely appeal, just a small win today for the Licensed London Black cabbies in a big battle
Edited by: "Toptrumpet" 22nd Sep 2017
Toptrumpet40 m ago

They will definitely appeal, just a small win today for the Licensed …They will definitely appeal, just a small win today for the Licensed London Black cabbies in a big battle


It's not just black cab drivers who have an issue with Uber. Addison Lee and others are also against Uber. I'm against Uber. Do you think they give two hoots about this
RossD891 h, 11 m ago

In all fairness it is not Uber who refuse to take customers and their …In all fairness it is not Uber who refuse to take customers and their assistance dogs, it is some of their drivers.

As if there is any separation in practice.
bring in Uber India, 100,000 immigrants with no wage, on working tax credits,blah blah, customers want even more zero-cost drivers in London, my qualitative analysis means £1.50 per journey is possible, uber infinite customer choices compared to buses.
Edited by: "splender" 22nd Sep 2017
Well done to Sadiq Khan for taking a stand for principles. I think Uber won't want to lose a lucrative city like London so will sort their act out to retain their presence.
splender53 s ago

bring in Uber India, 100,000 immigrants, customers want even more chicken …bring in Uber India, 100,000 immigrants, customers want even more chicken feed curry drivers in London.

How why what?
darthvader666uk2 h, 6 m ago

The people who run Uber are the worst but the idea around Uber and Lyft is …The people who run Uber are the worst but the idea around Uber and Lyft is great. Taxi's need competition as the prices are just stupid. maybe Im speaking of my local area and Cardiff but those prices are just all over the place. No consistency, the service sucks and its pure hit and miss if they actually want to go down the street you live in to drop off.Maybe taxi firms should have a rating system just like Uber so maybe the drivers will sort them selves out.Fingers crossed it doesnt affect here but with London doing it, I expect it will


Uber prices are unsustainable in the long term anyway, every fare is subsidises by 60% by their investors to drive out the competition.
@wishihadadonkey

"...How will this affect you?"

Not at all, thanks for asking.
coys6712 m ago

Uber prices are unsustainable in the long term anyway, every fare is …Uber prices are unsustainable in the long term anyway, every fare is subsidises by 60% by their investors to drive out the competition.


Oh Yeah I would have though they were doing something to get the business, but competition is needed for Taxis and vice versa otherwise they can start chargining whatever and just offer a poor service because there is nothing else
fanpages7 m ago

@wishihadadonkey "...How will this affect you?"Not at all, thanks for …@wishihadadonkey "...How will this affect you?"Not at all, thanks for asking.



There will no doubt be a number of London commuters thinking "wishihadadonkey" also if this decision is ultimately upheld.
davewave18 m ago

How why what?


I added why in editing my comment
So 40k job loses? not sure its good news
Deaa5 m ago

So 40k job loses? not sure its good news



Why would there be 40,000 job losses. People still need taxis. So the majority will just join other firms.
Deaa6 m ago

So 40k job loses? not sure its good news


Sensational headline nonsense from Uber. Nearly all of the drivers will not find it too difficult in applying to their local cab office if this goes through.
Deaa13 m ago

So 40k job loses? not sure its good news


My only grade E in RE at school level education suggests 40k of a tinny tad better terms drivers may replace 40k current terms drivers ? ! Lettuce pray dat I am wright.
Edited by: "splender" 22nd Sep 2017
splender4 m ago

My only grade E in RE at school education suggests 40k of a tinny tad …My only grade E in RE at school education suggests 40k of a tinny tad better terms drivers may replace 40k current terms drivers ? !


Just out of interest - what was your grade in English Language?
Saturn44 m ago

Just out of interest - what was your grade in English Language?


Not worth to disgrace everyone here.
Oops, edit, a few only, not everyone.
I chose to leave school and my headmaster was so upset, he called me into his office to urge me to stay on.
Edited by: "splender" 22nd Sep 2017
mudddy1 h, 10 m ago

Well done to Sadiq Khan for taking a stand for principles. I think Uber …Well done to Sadiq Khan for taking a stand for principles. I think Uber won't want to lose a lucrative city like London so will sort their act out to retain their presence.



I didn 't notice that he stood for principles, if so, what are they? As to do so would be illegal. Licensing is a legal mechanism, inter alia, to regulate rules and behavour of the licensee.
samtman1 h, 23 m ago

Why would there be 40,000 job losses. People still need taxis. So the …Why would there be 40,000 job losses. People still need taxis. So the majority will just join other firms.



Would it work like that? My understanding is that a lot of black cab drivers have complained about a decline in fares due to Uber - so there's capacity for them to pick up customers without taking on new drivers. Likewise, there are probably a fair few customers who only take Uber taxis because they are competitively priced. Will those people just switch to black cabs? It's a bit like saying that if we nail piracy, everyone will go out and buy the top ten CD's after a trip to the cinema.
Edited by: "fivegoldstars" 22nd Sep 2017
How can they enforce this?
Ridiculous decision, try finding a black cab in the early hours during the week, or get one to go south of river from London after a night out, most of them don't want to know, uber is way cheaper and flexible and I've never had any problems with them personally.
Edited by: "ukwomble" 22nd Sep 2017
archer12043 h, 46 m ago

Yes but they just said they can still operate until all appeals are used …Yes but they just said they can still operate until all appeals are used up which can take at least a few years so situation is the same.



Uber can "continue to operate until any appeal processes have been exhausted" but as it stands now, it is not clear whether that applied only to the company or to its licence to operate as well.


I suspect someone has to re-read the licensing terms that was signed many years' ago. If they had signed a term which says words to the effect that its service operation shall cease at the expiry date of the licence and is legally binding regardless of any appeal process then they'll finished on the said date.
No need for Uber, Addison Lee and local can firms already existed.
splender1 h, 13 m ago

I didn 't notice that he stood for principles, if so, what are they? As to …I didn 't notice that he stood for principles, if so, what are they? As to do so would be illegal. Licensing is a legal mechanism, inter alia, to regulate rules and behavour of the licensee.

Are you a qualified solicitor? You seem to be very knowledgeable about the law.
What FP said
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ukwomble37 m ago

Ridiculous decision, try finding a black cab in the early hours during the …Ridiculous decision, try finding a black cab in the early hours during the week, or get one to go south of river from London after a night out, most of them don't want to know, uber is way cheaper and flexible and I've never had any problems with them personally.



As ridculous as Greyball, as an example.
splender7 m ago

As ridculous as Greyball, as an example.


Greyball?
davewave13 m ago

Are you a qualified solicitor? You seem to be very knowledgeable about the …Are you a qualified solicitor? You seem to be very knowledgeable about the law.



Nah, I wish.
The irony is that both Uber and Black cabs will be obsolete when automated cars come into play...
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