Should the OAP winter fuel allowance be means tested?

176
Found 31st Dec 2011
was reading DLA thread and thought of another money saving cut

Single £200 - £300

Some OAP's defo need this, but many do not

Neighbour 1
Man £32k pension woman £16k pension, every year let us all know they use the money for Champaign over the festive period - no they do not share they would not give a door a kick.

Neighbour 2
Man pension £30k still working part time Salary £24k, wife pension £12k, these 2 are kind folks, this year they are giving half their allowance to charity.

both have healthy savings and no mortgage.

Yes they have worked, no I do not need or want the allowance, both admit they do not need it, yes the figures are correct I know them well,

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176 Comments

my mum lives in sheltered housing and doesnt pay her fuel bills and gets it..the benefits system is a joke!

yes it should be along with the bus pass etc

Banned

No, it should be scrapped.

Survival of the fittest baby.

Banned

Every OAP should get it. If they choose to give it to charity then that's their decision. Don't penalise people for being astute.

Original Poster

SOSAGES

yes it should be along with the bus pass etc


excelent point, both couples get the bus pass because once a year they go on holl,one to Cornwall and use the local busses!!! the other to Oxford and may use local busses. both couples have cars 1 per person, one also inaddition to 2 card has a 18mth old £55k mobile home, the other couple a £42 caravan with 12 moth old landrover 4x4 to pull it but they always get the bus pass

Original Poster

JonnyTwoToes

Every OAP should get it. If they choose to give it to charity then … Every OAP should get it. If they choose to give it to charity then that's their decision. Don't penalise people for being astute.



being astute entitles you to free money?

benafits should be for those in DESPERATE need only

Original Poster

realblender

The people who save hard throughout their lives and have money in old age … The people who save hard throughout their lives and have money in old age are the same people who are more likely not to put their heating on to save money. So a handout for heating is a good excuse to stay warm.



you are half right having the extra money does not make them put the heating on as I look out of my window I see them say in body warmers!! when the dog gets out he comes st8t over to my house am sure its for a warm

so what about child benefit & nursery care?
should they be means tested?

Sloth/Mod

miles136

being astute entitles you to free money?benafits should be for those in … being astute entitles you to free money?benafits should be for those in DESPERATE need only



That''s a serperate debate entirely. If they applied that we could save Billions

Original Poster

The Fox

so what about child benefit & nursery care?should they be means tested?



O I forgot about child benafit my brother is on £90k wife £40k they have always joked about this, they spend theirs on drink and eating out - the big joke is its compo from the govenment for the stress of bring up 3 kids

Banned

JonnyTwoToes

Every OAP should get it. If they choose to give it to charity then … Every OAP should get it. If they choose to give it to charity then that's their decision. Don't penalise people for being astute.



I disagree - no-one should get it. The government shouldn't be in the business of wasting taxpayers' money.

We have an ageing population that is increasingly unsustainable. Keeping people alive who can't support themselves is a financial black hole.

Original Poster

FilthAndFurry

No, it should be scrapped.Survival of the fittest baby.



I could not support this for 2 reasons

1 it is crewel and in humane

2 you would prob survive

also stop PMing me for pics of my over sized private parts, and following me around in threads ur obsession with me is unhealthy

Banned

miles136

I could not support this for 2 reasons1 it is crewel and in humane2 you … I could not support this for 2 reasons1 it is crewel and in humane2 you would prob survivealso stop PMing me for pics of my over sized private parts, and following me around in threads ur obsession with me is unhealthy



I have never PM'd you. Please don't lie you illiterate man.

People should take responsibility for themselves and not be supported by the government. By reducing welfare spending people would have more money in their own pockets to do with as they wish.

Things like fuel payments simply reward stupidity and recklessness.

What annoys me is people that go abroad for winter and still receive the allowance

We can afford to pay for involvement in wars, yet we cannot afford to pay a measly heating allowance, seems out of balance to me.

Banned

Inactive

We can afford to pay for involvement in wars, yet we cannot afford to pay … We can afford to pay for involvement in wars, yet we cannot afford to pay a measly heating allowance, seems out of balance to me.



Why does it? People in this country have every opportunity to make a good life for themselves where something as simple as 'the cold' shouldn't be potentially fatal. If you can't afford to heat yourself to a level that sustains life in the winter, then that is life confirming you have failed at the game of life.

People in many of the countries we help such as Libya don't have such opportunities. It's people like you who flippantly ignore the luxuries you have in this country that have really ruined this once great nation. You want everything handed to you on a plate.

JonnyTwoToes

Every OAP should get it. If they choose to give it to charity then … Every OAP should get it. If they choose to give it to charity then that's their decision. Don't penalise people for being astute.



exactly agree with this...when we get old our assets will be used to pay for our care..yet if we didnt have them we would still be in the same care home/sheltered housing as people who have spent every penny and been wasters..no fairness in the system.

Banned

plumberman01

exactly agree with this...when we get old our assets will be used to pay … exactly agree with this...when we get old our assets will be used to pay for our care..yet if we didnt have them we would still be in the same care home/sheltered housing as people who have spent every penny and been wasters..no fairness in the system.



Because the system is broken. It's geared towards rewarding laziness and fecklessness rather than encouraging responsible behaviour.

FilthAndFurry

Because the system is broken. It's geared towards rewarding laziness and … Because the system is broken. It's geared towards rewarding laziness and fecklessness rather than encouraging responsible behaviour.



im just trying to figure out how we are going to get around it cos no way is it happeneing to me..we have worked damn hard to get what we have and gone without often so we can be comfortable and give our kids a start in life..my money/property will go to my kids or i will have fun spending!

FilthAndFurry

People in many of the countries we help such as Libya don't have such … People in many of the countries we help such as Libya don't have such opportunities. It's people like you who flippantly ignore the luxuries you have in this country that have really ruined this once great nation. You want everything handed to you on a plate.




Not at all, but I do believe in looking after our own people first, we simply cannot afford to sort out the problems in places like Libya if we cannot first ensure that our own citizens are cared for.


Perhaps your attitude may change when you mature.

Banned

FilthAndFurry

I disagree - no-one should get it. The government shouldn't be in the … I disagree - no-one should get it. The government shouldn't be in the business of wasting taxpayers' money.We have an ageing population that is increasingly unsustainable. Keeping people alive who can't support themselves is a financial black hole.



I'm happy to pay all my tax directly to the elderly. It's the able bodied scummers that I have a problem with.

Banned

Inactive

Not at all, but I do believe in looking after our own people first, we … Not at all, but I do believe in looking after our own people first, we simply cannot afford to sort out the problems in places like Libya if we cannot first ensure that our own citizens are cared for.Perhaps your attitude may change when you mature.



Look after our own people first? They get free education and healthcare and the chance to make whatever they want of themselves. What more do you want? Everything handed to you on a plate apparently.

Banned

JonnyTwoToes

I'm happy to pay all my tax directly to the elderly. It's the able … I'm happy to pay all my tax directly to the elderly. It's the able bodied scummers that I have a problem with.



What about 'able bodied scummers' who are older than 65? Simply being old isn't a mark of decency.

Banned

miles136

being astute entitles you to free money?benafits should be for those in … being astute entitles you to free money?benafits should be for those in DESPERATE need only


so, conversely being feckless all your life entitles people to free money?

pensioners in desperate need also get pension credits. Personally, I think its pointless these days saving into a pension as you get penalised and end up no better off than those who haven't bothered to put money aside. My Dad is actually worse off now he is retired with a small pension than his mates who didnt save a penny (they get pension credit so have no council tax to pay). He gets zero pension credit and has to pay full council tax.

and now you are telling me that he should forfeit his heating allowance for having the stupidity to save into a pension all his life!

Discuss it all you like, nothing will change because the " grey " vote is so powerful, no government is going to dare to remove the heating allowance, a step too far.

csiman

so, conversely being feckless all your life entitles people to free … so, conversely being feckless all your life entitles people to free money?pensioners in desperate need also get pension credits. Personally, I think its pointless these days saving into a pension as you get penalised and end up no better off than those who haven't bothered to put money aside. My Dad is actually worse off now he is retired with a small pension than his mates who didnt save a penny (they get pension credit so have no council tax to pay). He gets zero pension credit and has to pay full council tax.and now you are telling me that he should forfeit his heating allowance for having the stupidity to save into a pension all his life!




yep we have savings so wont get housing benefits or tax credits...bring on the cruise lol

Yes it should be means tested, Im currently working with offenders on license which include pensioners and they get the Winter Fuel Allowance FFS...they dont even have to pay for their heating as they are living in Approved Premises!! Grrrrrrrrr it gets me so angry!!!!!!!!!!

treble99

Yes it should be means tested, Im currently working with offenders on … Yes it should be means tested, Im currently working with offenders on license which include pensioners and they get the Winter Fuel Allowance FFS...they dont even have to pay for their heating as they are living in Approved Premises!! Grrrrrrrrr it gets me so angry!!!!!!!!!!



If you get " angry " over something like this, you are probably not the best person to be dealing with offenders.

Inactive

If you get " angry " over something like this, you are probably not the … If you get " angry " over something like this, you are probably not the best person to be dealing with offenders.



Haha thanks Of course I get more angry when knowing what they have offended for and that they are free to roam in the community between 7-7 unware to the general public that they are seriously sick offenders, they should just be killed and save the taxpayer the expense of paying for them

Agree with above comments the system seems to be geared to rewarding the lazy while those careful with their money and save get penalised for doing so. Also giving a 5% increase to those on benefits while most others are on a pay freeze is wrong. As Cameron said we are all in this together and those on benefits should feel the hardship as well as the workers.
Edited by: "donaldduck2" 31st Dec 2011

i grew up in a family on benefits as my parents suffered from ill health and so could not work. there are other personal issues that prevented them from working, which i do not want to disclose.

the amount of benefits allowance in this country is awful and we did not have enough to live on so i had a very harsh childhood. you all can argue all you like, but that is a fact.

so as a child my main aim in life was to grow up out of the benefits system and i have done just that. From someone who has been there and done that, I can categorically state that

All benefits should be means tested so that it reduces the burden on the tax payer or it should be directed to those on benefits as the current allowance is a joke.

Banned

i was shocked to hear that a friend (who doesn't work, single parent and still loves with her parents) wanted it to snow as then she would get extra money for the weather falling below a certain level. i actually laughed, thinking this was a joke until i looked it up! shocking. the lazy cow should get off her bum and get a job!

i do think all benefits should all be means tested, based on the indivduals circumstances. especially with child benefit, tax credits, even the dole and people in council houses. especially when its a "couple" and neither work- benefits should be stopped, or limited. i understand also lots of people cant find jobs etc but then to earn the money they recieve from the government, how about being made to make our streets cleaner, or safer. helping out in nursing homes, hospitals etc.

gemwood

i was shocked to hear that a friend (who doesn't work, single parent and … i was shocked to hear that a friend (who doesn't work, single parent and still loves with her parents) wanted it to snow as then she would get extra money for the weather falling below a certain level. i actually laughed, thinking this was a joke until i looked it up! shocking. the lazy cow should get off her bum and get a job! i do think all benefits should all be means tested, based on the indivduals circumstances. especially with child benefit, tax credits, even the dole and people in council houses. especially when its a "couple" and neither work- benefits should be stopped, or limited. i understand also lots of people cant find jobs etc but then to earn the money they recieve from the government, how about being made to make our streets cleaner, or safer. helping out in nursing homes, hospitals etc.



erm.........

Because they will be working for far less than minimum wage so will be in essence forced cheap labour and will be taking jobs from others? Supermarkets have already signed up for this as they can fire staff and fill positions at pennies an hour.

miles136

being astute entitles you to free money?benafits should be for those in … being astute entitles you to free money?benafits should be for those in DESPERATE need only



'A' saves up one hundred pounds.
'B' saves nothing.
'A' is disqualified from getting his £100 because he has £100 savings.
'B' Gets the £100 given to him.
So both have just £100.

Why did 'A' bother saving at all if he is no better off?

(I know the point I'm trying to make anyway :D)

Surely if benefits were means tested then it encourages people not to save and be astute.

gemwood

i was shocked to hear that a friend (who doesn't work, single parent and … i was shocked to hear that a friend (who doesn't work, single parent and still loves with her parents) wanted it to snow as then she would get extra money for the weather falling below a certain level. i actually laughed, thinking this was a joke until i looked it up! shocking. the lazy cow should get off her bum and get a job! i do think all benefits should all be means tested, based on the indivduals circumstances. especially with child benefit, tax credits, even the dole and people in council houses. especially when its a "couple" and neither work- benefits should be stopped, or limited. i understand also lots of people cant find jobs etc but then to earn the money they recieve from the government, how about being made to make our streets cleaner, or safer. helping out in nursing homes, hospitals etc.



i am a capitalist but having survived on benefits as a child, i can see why a benefit system is needed for those that are vulnerable.

those claiming benefits should face tough tests to ensure that they are entitled to benefits. the benefits system is too easily abused by those that do not need to claim benefits.

Germany has the right idea where you get a very high level of benefits to enable you to have a decent standard of living but in return they find you a job to do which you must do else you lose your benefits.

donaldduck2

Surely if benefits were means tested then it encourages people not to … Surely if benefits were means tested then it encourages people not to save and be astute.



it's not about being astute and working hard. benefits should be given to those who can not earn money because of circumstance. so anyone who has enough money to live on should not be given benefits. it should only be given to the desperate, like charity in a way.

Banned

i can understand that, but a lot of people who can work, don't. and get the benefits. so why not make them work or do something for the community to recieve the money they get ( i am taking about the small minority who have never worked a day in their live and don't intend too). why sit on their **** and get paid o do nothing. the system is very wrong!

Ungreat

erm.........Because they will be working for far less than minimum wage … erm.........Because they will be working for far less than minimum wage so will be in essence forced cheap labour and will be taking jobs from others? Supermarkets have already signed up for this as they can fire staff and fill positions at pennies an hour.


deb8z

In your case Mutley the benefits system is very different these days,most … In your case Mutley the benefits system is very different these days,most people with children receive benefits ie tax credits,when i was young,all i remember my parents receiving was child benefit as my parents both worked,there was no free money for having children like there is today.On the DLA side of it,my cousin has some Arthritic problems,which she's had since being a child granted,but she has five children now,i'm not quite sure why she can't work but can bring up five children X)



dads used to get a tax allowance if they had wives and kids back then...im sure it wasnt as much as tax credits tho relatively..

takes the **** to have five kids and not be able to work and on DLA...i knew someone had 3 kids and on DLA (her hubby worked) she used to take kids to school and back by bus cos around 3 miles with a baby/buggy etc and he had the mot car parked at work all day cos he was a lorry driver. She clearly didnt need a mot car or DLA but obv met criteria on the day.

oooh just read that back and hope i didnt offend cos i know Deb is too young for her dad to have claimed tax allowance for her lol
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