Why are those who engage in fox hunting so reluctant to give it up?

161
Found 27th Dec 2017
Given all the trouble surrounding it, you'd think they'd just let it go, but they clutch onto it for deer life. Just why? In this time period, you'd think there were far better past times to enjoy. It doesn't even seem that fun. I get that it's a tradition, but many traditions have been ditched in the past few decades. Why is this one so special?
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I don’t give a flying **** about traditions, I don’t care that they enjoy it, I couldn’t care less about the fact they’re deemed “vermin” or what “havoc” they wreak.

If any of that is true, then there are humane ways to kill.

To put those beautiful creatures through so much fear and to die, being torn apart? It makes me so angry that we as a race, capable of compassion, can be so cruel and enjoy something so barbaric.

It’s disgusting and those who partake in it are sub-human.
Edited by moderator: "removed swear word" 27th Dec 2017
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deleted265520
Also Splender has killed yet another thread talking in pointless riddles.
splender3 m ago

What more is there for me to say, we have a record here of our exchanges. …What more is there for me to say, we have a record here of our exchanges. I gave you a lot of time and chance to make amends and you didn't. You said previously, "Anyone caught in the middle of a hunt should be shot on sight." You didn't make amends and then you went on to revise your statement of the above to, "Anyone caught in the act of using an animal to viciously destroy another animal should be shot on sight."


You're like Chinese water torture splender. Honestly, just drop it now.
splender42 m ago

It is cruelty indeed. Is it a selection criterion to remove all cruelty …It is cruelty indeed. Is it a selection criterion to remove all cruelty then or just one selected at random?


Well if you think being chased across fields hedges woods for mile upon mile
by a pack of dogs then being torn apart isn't cruel ?

Try it.
Edited by: "Wongy110" 27th Dec 2017
161 Comments
It is special because it is controversial, all the pros and cons are on the internet. Same pros and cons as they had been since 1950.
@bjrosl What's your personal interest in this post, I believe your point is to be rid of it, but why?

If you point is , it ain't no fun as you said: "It doesn't even seem that fun. I get that it's a tradition." Then we have a race to the bottom and remove anything that fit your two criteria, there ain't going to be much living lifestyle left in this country.
splender12 m ago

It is special because it is controversial, all the pros and cons are on …It is special because it is controversial, all the pros and cons are on the internet. Same pros and cons as they had been since 1950.


What pros ffs ?
It is just cruelty for 'traditions '

the fact that 'our' current PM ran an election campaign giving a 'free vote' this year
to her mythical 'massive majority' speaks volumes
Edited by: "Wongy110" 27th Dec 2017
The elite are freaks
Wongy1104 m ago

What pros ffs ?It is just cruelty for 'traditions 'the fact that 'our' …What pros ffs ?It is just cruelty for 'traditions 'the fact that 'our' current PM ran an election campaign giving a 'free vote' this yearto her mythical 'massive majority' speaks volumes



It is cruelty indeed. Is it a selection criterion to remove all cruelty then or just one selected at random?
splender42 m ago

It is cruelty indeed. Is it a selection criterion to remove all cruelty …It is cruelty indeed. Is it a selection criterion to remove all cruelty then or just one selected at random?


Well if you think being chased across fields hedges woods for mile upon mile
by a pack of dogs then being torn apart isn't cruel ?

Try it.
Edited by: "Wongy110" 27th Dec 2017
splender14 m ago

@bjrosl What's your personal interest in this post, I believe your point …@bjrosl What's your personal interest in this post, I believe your point is to be rid of it, but why? If you point is , it ain't no fun as you said: "It doesn't even seem that fun. I get that it's a tradition." Then we have a race to the bottom and remove anything that fit your two criteria, there ain't going to be much living lifestyle left in this country.



Why wouldn't it be of interest? Should nothing interest anyone unless if directly impacts them? Are we not even allowed to discuss something, to be curious about something like this? Is it really such an off limits taboo topic? Why is that?

You are evoking a slippery slope logical fallacy.

You are taking my quote out of context. I am attempting to understand the point of view of those who insist on such a deeply hated and pointless activity.
I don’t give a flying **** about traditions, I don’t care that they enjoy it, I couldn’t care less about the fact they’re deemed “vermin” or what “havoc” they wreak.

If any of that is true, then there are humane ways to kill.

To put those beautiful creatures through so much fear and to die, being torn apart? It makes me so angry that we as a race, capable of compassion, can be so cruel and enjoy something so barbaric.

It’s disgusting and those who partake in it are sub-human.
Edited by moderator: "removed swear word" 27th Dec 2017
bjrosl6 m ago

Why wouldn't it be of interest? Should nothing interest anyone unless if …Why wouldn't it be of interest? Should nothing interest anyone unless if directly impacts them? Are we not even allowed to discuss something, to be curious about something like this? Is it really such an off limits taboo topic? Why is that?You are evoking a slippery slope logical fallacy. You are taking my quote out of context. I am attempting to understand the point of view of those who insist on such a deeply hated and pointless activity.


You said just two criteria, "It doesn't even seem that fun. I get that it's a tradition." which as a start is extremely narrow focus.

All the points on fox hunting are pretty much debated for decades and there is such an abundane of opinions, science, farming, rural life. There is a student study subject weighing up the pros and cons.
Edited by: "splender" 27th Dec 2017
bjrosl10 m ago

..... but they clutch onto it for deer life


I think you may be getting your blood sports mixed up.

Wongy11016 m ago

Well if you don't think being chased across fields hedges woods for mile …Well if you don't think being chased across fields hedges woods for mile upon mileby a pack of dogs then being torn apart isn't cruel ?Try it.


Sounds like an average day on Misc, for some.
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deleted1416210
People in general are stuck in an evolutionary rut that has them thinking we still need to hunt and kill animals....
Its a base instinct, even when you take the kill away they will echo out the routine, because they are to unable to move on from the drive and feelings hunting and killing gives them.
bjrosl15 m ago

In this time period, you'd think there were far better past times to enjoy.


Unfortunately they went bust in February 2012.

32923948-Nsubj.jpg
Wongy11022 m ago

Well if you don't think being chased across fields hedges woods for mile …Well if you don't think being chased across fields hedges woods for mile upon mileby a pack of dogs then being torn apart isn't cruel ?Try it.



It is bad indeed to be chased, you don't want it, I don't want it. But it does not mean necessarily anything should be stopped because you and I didn't like it.

The case needs consultation with all the relevant parties, rural communities, jobs, farming communities, national opinion, animall welfare etc.; and there had been many consultations, parliamentary inquries, rural community inquiries, law makers had a look of this many times I seemed to recall over the decades. It ain't going to be an easy consultation here in MISC but I am opened-minded to a new significant new point of justification (pro or against) fox hunting or a ground swell. At the moment we have four points so far:-

1. It is not fun,(from OP)
2. It is a tradition (from OP)
3. It is elitism (from cowsindahouse)
4. It is cruelty (from you)
Maybe OK to debate this again over a few beers, or not:-
32924013-Y4mFG.jpg
Rubisco7 m ago

Unfortunately they went bust in February 2012.[Image]



Quite cruel, I did like this chain. I believe the landlords hounded them to death!
Wongy11032 m ago

Well if you don't think being chased across fields hedges woods for mile …Well if you don't think being chased across fields hedges woods for mile upon mileby a pack of dogs then being torn apart isn't cruel ?Try it.


I think the point the poster was trying to make was that, yes, it is cruel, yet there are countless other cruelties on grander scales that are committed without consideration by the general public, and should we look at those, as well?

For example, the poultry industry; the scale, the methods used (decided on by profit), the inhumane approach to living things, all so that you can eat KFC.

[I don’t say that judgementally - though I have never eaten KFC (wrong sort, you know?) I do occasionally eat meat/fish.]

I think hunting is a tradition of Old England which, like the rest of Old England, has sadly had its day and will never be again. I’m not really pro-/anti- hunting, but we have lost so many traditions, one wonders where it will stop.
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deleted265520
Anyone caught in the act of using an animal to viciously destroy another animal should be shot on sight.
Edited by: "deleted265520" 28th Dec 2017
DT8927th Dec 2017

Anyone caught in the middle of a hunt should be shot on sight.


Ah, the progressive, enlightened, humane attitude of an ‘anti-’.

Or, judging by your profile picture, a 12 year old. I should stop procrastinating on the internet and get some work done.
Edited by: "lockwoodisbored" 27th Dec 2017
And inb4 do they really do this now

theguardian.com/uk-…nts


and what is more have seen the Aholes !
lockwoodisbored14 m ago

I think the point the poster was trying to make was that, yes, it is …I think the point the poster was trying to make was that, yes, it is cruel, yet there are countless other cruelties on grander scales that are committed without consideration by the general public, and should we look at those, as well?For example, the poultry industry; the scale, the methods used (decided on by profit), the inhumane approach to living things, all so that you can eat KFC.[I don’t say that judgementally - though I have never eaten KFC (wrong sort, you know?) I do occasionally eat meat/fish.]I think hunting is a tradition of Old England which, like the rest of Old England, has sadly had its day and will never be again. I’m not really pro-/anti- hunting, but we have lost so many traditions, one wonders where it will stop.



Here's a film that I watched in this festive season, satire on public relations and cruelty in an industrial scale (RottenTomatoes score 86%).
32924222-IMxNJ.jpg
Edited by: "splender" 27th Dec 2017
splender35 m ago

You said just two criteria, "It doesn't even seem that fun. I get that …You said just two criteria, "It doesn't even seem that fun. I get that it's a tradition." which as a start is extremely narrow focus. All the points on fox hunting are pretty much debated for decades and there is such an abundane of opinions, science, farming, rural life. There is a student study subject weighing up the pros and cons.



Why is it wrong to be specific? That says nothing of it's veracity, or lack thereof. It's a worthless comment to make.

I asked a very specific question. Derailing this into some old tangentially related debates from yesteryear won't help answer it. You keep dodging my question, despite all your responses. Why do they still cling so hard to it in 2017?
splender6 m ago

Here's a film that I watched in this festive season, satire on public …Here's a film that I watched in this festive season, satire on public relations and cruelty in an industrial scale (RottenTomatoes score 86%).[Image]


So what how can you defend THIS
paulwmather47 m ago

I don’t give a flying **** about traditions, I don’t care that they enjoy i …I don’t give a flying **** about traditions, I don’t care that they enjoy it, I couldn’t care less about the fact they’re deemed “vermin” or what “havoc” they wreak. If any of that is true, then there are humane ways to kill. To put those beautiful creatures through so much fear and to die, being torn apart? It makes me so angry that we as a race, capable of compassion, can be so cruel and enjoy something so barbaric. It’s disgusting and those who partake in it are sub-human.



I am just a messenger for an innocent fox , who cannot speak out, so don't shoot me, whether humanely or not.

You said, "there are humane ways to kill" , Your remark is disgusting and despicable. I am a fox. I don't want to die. Watch my foxy lips, " I don't want to die, period." What right have you got to propose that I am killed humanely? You are disgusting to my fellow foxes and all other animals.
Edited by: "splender" 27th Dec 2017
bjrosl11 m ago

Why is it wrong to be specific? That says nothing of it's veracity, or …Why is it wrong to be specific? That says nothing of it's veracity, or lack thereof. It's a worthless comment to make.I asked a very specific question. Derailing this into some old tangentially related debates from yesteryear won't help answer it. You keep dodging my question, despite all your responses. Why do they still cling so hard to it in 2017?


I think the poster is making the point that unless you can bring new points forward, all the points are on the table. The study he mentioned presumably lists all the points of debate.

I know you fix on the poster as you’re getting no resistance elsewhere, but I don’t believe he’s pro-hunting, simply open-minded.
splender3 m ago

I am just a messenger for an innocent fox , who cannot speak out, so don't …I am just a messenger for an innocent fox , who cannot speak out, so don't shoot me, whether humanely or not.You said, "there are humane ways to kill" , Your remark is disgusting and despicable. I am a fox. I don't want to die. Watch my foxy lips, " I don't want to die, period." What right have you got to propose that I am killed humanely? You are disgusting to my fellow foxes and all other animals.


If you are a sodding fox please tell me the pros splender ?
Wongy1102 m ago

If you are a sodding fox please tell me the pros splender ?


I’m struggling to understand if you’re a bot or a little slow. I think you’ve missed the point on each of your comments.
Wongy11011 m ago

So what how can you defend THIS



I am not defending, I am exploring people's intentions and whether they coherentand cogent with justification. Like the person suggested "to kill humanely" above which got five "likes".
lockwoodisbored7 m ago

I think the poster is making the point that unless you can bring new …I think the poster is making the point that unless you can bring new points forward, all the points are on the table. The study he mentioned presumably lists all the points of debate.I know you fix on the poster as you’re getting no resistance elsewhere, but I don’t believe he’s pro-hunting, simply open-minded.



Again, I'm not asking for a debate. I'm asking a very specific question. If it's been answered a hundred times already, then what is the answer to my original question? That poster keeps avoiding my question and instead derails, for example when he starting probing why I even wanted to talk about this as if no one can ever just ask a question out of sheer curiosity.

Your final comment is absolutely pointless. So, I can't even address him without incurring negative accusations? Why is he open minded? He seems to be very eager to close down and dismiss all discussion on this topic, that doesn't sound like someone is simply open-minded.
splender6 m ago

I am not defending, I am exploring people's intentions and whether they …I am not defending, I am exploring people's intentions and whether they coherentand cogent with justification. Like the person suggested "to kill humanely" above which got five "likes".


You said their were 'pros' I most strongly disagree you don't seem to have recognised this

lockwoodisbored6 m ago

I’m struggling to understand if you’re a bot or a little slow. I think you …I’m struggling to understand if you’re a bot or a little slow. I think you’ve missed the point on each of your comments.


they gave me badges and all.....
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deleted1416210
splender12 m ago

I am not defending, I am exploring people's intentions and whether they …I am not defending, I am exploring people's intentions and whether they coherentand cogent with justification. Like the person suggested "to kill humanely" above which got five "likes".


Joke is... people moan about the fox being killed ... Oh the inhumanity of it all!... Point is a lot of those foxes are killed to protect livestock which will then be killed so those moaning about blood sports can eat their Sunday roasts..
People see what they want to see, few look at the bigger picture.... Your right that fox doesn't want to be killed full stop, 'humane' or not...it's still dead.....their is no humanity in killing healthy animals
Edited by: "deleted1416210" 27th Dec 2017
DT8927th Dec 2017

Anyone caught in the middle of a hunt should be shot on sight.


Do you mean the protestors or the hunters?
Baroness Ann Mallalieu, president of the Countryside Alliance, said the hunting ban "has little to do with animals or their welfare", adding the anti-hunting lobby is about a "hatred of people".

And

“Baroness Mallalieu wrote in the Telegraph: "There can be no logical justification for such a ridiculous law, so what was the real motivation for the ban?

"If that was not already obvious, the admission of one MP, as soon as the law was passed, that it was "class war", and the subsequent continuing campaigns against hunts that are no longer hunting foxes, can leave only one conclusion.”

So if we want to bring class into this, then here is my take. They (those that participate in the hunt) have too much money and because they no longer get enjoyment out of buying expensive goods, cars, holidays, etc, they’re looking for their next thrill and that’s by killing an innocent animal. They do that because it makes them feel big and they have something new to brag about. They’re utter parasites and the real vermin.

The Lynx is supposed to be getting reintroduced to our wildlife soon. They will control the fox population, as nature intended, before humans wiped them out previously. The hunt is not needed and is outdated. I mean, we were supposed to be over run by foxes now, and yet that hasn’t happened either. They’re full of crap. Always have been and always will be.

We prosecute anyone who harms animals but we are supposed to allow some toffs on horses train dogs to tear a fox apart after chasing it for miles? Kindly, sod off to anyone who supports it.
bjrosl13 m ago

Again, I'm not asking for a debate. I'm asking a very specific question. …Again, I'm not asking for a debate. I'm asking a very specific question. If it's been answered a hundred times already, then what is the answer to my original question? That poster keeps avoiding my question and instead derails, for example when he starting probing why I even wanted to talk about this as if no one can ever just ask a question out of sheer curiosity.Your final comment is absolutely pointless. So, I can't even address him without incurring negative accusations? Why is he open minded? He seems to be very eager to close down and dismiss all discussion on this topic, that doesn't sound like someone is simply open-minded.



FOR FOX SAKE (Disclaimer: I am not a Sun reader, so this is just an example link on the latest info as was November 2017.) This is about a repeal of the law. Which is fox hunting with dogs was banned in 2004.

If I and others have misunderstood your post, perhaps you could rephrase your question. I thought your post was a loaded question to ask why are they so reluctant to give it (fox hunting) up. The fact is fox hunting is still legal. I gave you an immediate relevant reply, my point was that the core point was and still is that fox hunting had been controversial for decades. They are those who hated it, there are those whose livelihood and rural communities depended on it, and then there are those who loved it. Their reasons were all to be found on the internet.
Hunting would be much better if the hunters became the hunted, Barbarism.
shadey1227th Dec 2017

Do you mean the protestors or the hunters?



I think those caught in the middle of the debate here in MISC?
DT8927th Dec 2017

Anyone caught in the middle of a hunt should be shot on sight.

.MUFC.2 m ago

Hunting would be much better if the hunters became the hunted, Barbarism.



That's how nature and evolution happen, this has been the way of life since life began on earth.
Edited by: "splender" 27th Dec 2017
bjrosl17 m ago

Again, I'm not asking for a debate. I'm asking a very specific question. …Again, I'm not asking for a debate. I'm asking a very specific question. If it's been answered a hundred times already, then what is the answer to my original question? That poster keeps avoiding my question and instead derails, for example when he starting probing why I even wanted to talk about this as if no one can ever just ask a question out of sheer curiosity.Your final comment is absolutely pointless. So, I can't even address him without incurring negative accusations? Why is he open minded? He seems to be very eager to close down and dismiss all discussion on this topic, that doesn't sound like someone is simply open-minded.


I fear your personal opinions cloud your judgement on this comment thread. The poster likely wanted to know your viewpoint so he could have an idea of your prejudices and therefore offer some alternatives to your narrative.

I think the poster was sincerely open-minded, and was offering alternate viewpoints for you to contemplate. Instead, you have a set idea about the individual and, because you have no avowed pro-hunters on here to rail at, decide to spout off. You’re not asking for debate, you just want an answer to a question: if only life were so black and white.

One question, if you’ll permit me: Are you a millennial?
because the conservatives have not yet made it legal to shoot the lower class
splender4 m ago

That's how nature and evolution happen, this has been the way of life …That's how nature and evolution happen, this has been the way of life since life began on earth.


Would like to think the people who post bs on the interweb get found out !

wished you a merry crimbo just the other day day mate can you not admit you got a tiny thing wrong ?
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deleted1416210
Biddy28 m ago

“Baroness Ann Mallalieu, president of the Countryside Alliance, said the h …“Baroness Ann Mallalieu, president of the Countryside Alliance, said the hunting ban "has little to do with animals or their welfare", adding the anti-hunting lobby is about a "hatred of people".”And“Baroness Mallalieu wrote in the Telegraph: "There can be no logical justification for such a ridiculous law, so what was the real motivation for the ban?"If that was not already obvious, the admission of one MP, as soon as the law was passed, that it was "class war", and the subsequent continuing campaigns against hunts that are no longer hunting foxes, can leave only one conclusion.”So if we want to bring class into this, then here is my take. They (those that participate in the hunt) have too much money and because they no longer get enjoyment out of buying expensive goods, cars, holidays, etc, they’re looking for their next thrill and that’s by killing an innocent animal. They do that because it makes them feel big and they have something new to brag about. They’re utter parasites and the real vermin. The Lynx is supposed to be getting reintroduced to our wildlife soon. They will control the fox population, as nature intended, before humans wiped them out previously. The hunt is not needed and is outdated. I mean, we were supposed to be over run by foxes now, and yet that hasn’t happened either. They’re full of crap. Always have been and always will be. We prosecute anyone who harms animals but we are supposed to allow some toffs on horses train dogs to tear a fox apart after chasing it for miles? Kindly, sod off to anyone who supports it.


We don't prosecute anyone who harms animals though.... We just prosecute people for hurting a few which have been deemed more special than others. Most people's homes are filled with products that have been tested on animals. Most people have fridges, freezers and cupboards full of animal derived ingredients. Habitats are destroyed and animals are harmed in their millions everyday without prosecution.
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