Will minimum pricing in Scotland benefit the wellbeing of Scots or lead to more use of legal highs / illegal home brew

94
Edited by:"davewave"Found 15th Nov 2017
The UK Supreme Court has ruled that Scotland can set a minimum price for alcohol, rejecting a challenge by the Scotch Whisky Association (SWA).

Legislation was approved by the Scottish Parliament five years ago but has been tied up in court challenges.

In a unanimous judgment, seven Supreme Court judges said the legislation did not breach European Union law.

The judges ruled the measure was a "proportionate means of achieving a legitimate aim".

Ministers said a 50p-per-unit minimum would help tackle Scotland's "unhealthy relationship with drink" by raising the price of cheap, high-strength alcohol.

  1. Misc
Groups
  1. Misc
94 Comments

Original Poster

bbc.co.uk/new…909


Whiskey Association loses their objection.

More bootleggers, more drinking hand gel etc

at least they can rake in more taxes as the retailers will be making a killing

personally i think its just punishing everyone. those who are addicted and are heavy drinkers will find other ways to get hold of it

adamspencer955 m ago

at least they can rake in more taxes as the retailers will be making a …at least they can rake in more taxes as the retailers will be making a killingpersonally i think its just punishing everyone. those who are addicted and are heavy drinkers will find other ways to get hold of it


Nothing is taxed heavily because thry think people will give up, but precisely because they know people won't, booze, fags, petrol

Segata-Sanshiro5 m ago

Nothing is taxed heavily because thry think people will give up, but …Nothing is taxed heavily because thry think people will give up, but precisely because they know people won't, booze, fags, petrol


exactly

they claim its not a tax and it goes to the retailer, but at the end of the day the retailer pays tax on profits, which have now increased ~25% on alcohol

There will always be addicts that will find a way to satisfy their cravings but i think the idea is to price out the next generation of drinkers the same way they have done with smokers, if this new program leads to a significant amount of children unable to afford to abuse alcohol then it will be a success imho.

coys672 m ago

There will always be addicts that will find a way to satisfy their …There will always be addicts that will find a way to satisfy their cravings but i think the idea is to price out the next generation of drinkers the same way they have done with smokers, if this new program leads to a significant amount of children unable to afford to abuse alcohol then it will be a success imho.


Vape seems pretty damn popular to me, evolution not priced out

Segata-Sanshiro7 m ago

Vape seems pretty damn popular to me, evolution not priced out


Perhaps i wasn't clear, when i said smoking i was referring to tobacco rather than vaping, the amount of smokers is dropping drastically with the biggest decreases in the youngest users, this i believe is due at least in part to the exorbitant pricing.

coys673 m ago

Perhaps i wasn't clear, when i said smoking i was referring to tobacco …Perhaps i wasn't clear, when i said smoking i was referring to tobacco rather than vaping, the amount of smokers is dropping drastically with the biggest decreases in the youngest users, this i believe is due at least in part to the exorbitant pricing.



Yes and her point was it makes very little difference when they just change the delivery method of the drug.

Beer runs to England

For me, this is a perfect example of how out of touch politicians are with the real world.

I'd say they need to look at WHY people take this drug rather than pricing it out of reach of society's poor.


Through my work with the church I have met with and talked with many people who drink to excess - and there's a reason they drink - and guess what? It's not because they wanted to lose their job, their house, their family, and it's not because they wanted to end up pennyless and homeless with seriously bad health.

While they are at it they should impose a maximum price per unit ...seeing as some places charge a tenner for a double for bog standard stuff.

I can't imagine it would lead to an increase in 'illegal' home-brewing - spirits won't be sufficiently affected to make it worthwhile. There may be an increase in perfectly legal home-brewing though - ales and ciders will be affected the most, and these are the cheapest and easiest to brew. However, I don't think this will impact addicts and the like - they don't tend to have the foresight or patience. It will, however, have an impact on the treasury.
Edited by: "fivegoldstars" 15th Nov 2017

Wongy11038 m ago

[Image]



Throw a chocolate bar in the deep fryer once and you’re scarred for life. The truth is, most of us haven’t even seen one, let alone tasted it.

It makes no difference what you think of it, it's now the law, from next year

Minimum unit pricing is not a tax; it is a targeted way of making sure alcohol is sold at a sensible price.

MSK.34 m ago

Yes and her point was it makes very little difference when they just …Yes and her point was it makes very little difference when they just change the delivery method of the drug.


Opened it up to more as they can start with the fruit flavours then move on to drugs with fruit flavours

tryn2help31 m ago

For me, this is a perfect example of how out of touch politicians are with …For me, this is a perfect example of how out of touch politicians are with the real world.I'd say they need to look at WHY people take this drug rather than pricing it out of reach of society's poor.Through my work with the church I have met with and talked with many people who drink to excess - and there's a reason they drink - and guess what? It's not because they wanted to lose their job, their house, their family, and it's not because they wanted to end up pennyless and homeless with seriously bad health.


I'm sure they already know, i wonder what the current tab is for the tax payer subbed commons bars

Uilleam1714 m ago

Throw a chocolate bar in the deep fryer once and you’re scarred for life. …Throw a chocolate bar in the deep fryer once and you’re scarred for life. The truth is, most of us haven’t even seen one, let alone tasted it.


I have, bitterly dissapointed.

Wonder if it will effect jobs cos I can't see people stumping up £20 for a slab of the yellow pish that is Fosters, Carling , Coors etc.

Original Poster

Segata-Sanshiro44 m ago

I'm sure they already know, i wonder what the current tab is for the tax …I'm sure they already know, i wonder what the current tab is for the tax payer subbed commons bars


Or the bar in the Scottish Parliament? hmmm Scottish Parliament built a second bar for £125,000 in 2013 for MSPs...


pressreader.com/uk/…278


(In 2013) Figures by the Scottish Parliament show that the amount of alcohol it sold has increased by 11% since £125,000 was spent on building a second bar in 2012.


Edited by: "davewave" 15th Nov 2017

Well let's wait and see, alcoholics drink cheap unless they are rich, at the very least it will reduce the amount of people becoming alcoholics.

It's so they can sell more Irn-bru

MSK.2 h, 12 m ago

Yes and her point was it makes very little difference when they just …Yes and her point was it makes very little difference when they just change the delivery method of the drug.

Then the point would need to be demonstrated that there is a comparison in numbers from children starting smoking to children starting vaping rather than ex-smokers switching to vaping, and of course, vaping seems to be less harmful overall than tobacco smoking.

coys673 m ago

Then the point would need to be demonstrated that there is a comparison in …Then the point would need to be demonstrated that there is a comparison in numbers from children starting smoking to children starting vaping rather than ex-smokers switching to vaping, and of course, vaping seems to be less harmful overall than tobacco smoking.


It's been demonstrated as well as you demonstrated your point. But that's not for me to take any further, it wasn't me making the point. Merely agreeing with it.

tryn2help2 h, 25 m ago

For me, this is a perfect example of how out of touch politicians are with …For me, this is a perfect example of how out of touch politicians are with the real world.I'd say they need to look at WHY people take this drug rather than pricing it out of reach of society's poor.Through my work with the church I have met with and talked with many people who drink to excess - and there's a reason they drink - and guess what? It's not because they wanted to lose their job, their house, their family, and it's not because they wanted to end up pennyless and homeless with seriously bad health.


Addiction is a mental illness and a heavy duty one as well. The UK has a terrible record in dealing with such illnesses so don't expect that to change in a hurry.

Original Poster

Agharta4 m ago

Addiction is a mental illness and a heavy duty one as well. The UK has a …Addiction is a mental illness and a heavy duty one as well. The UK has a terrible record in dealing with such illnesses so don't expect that to change in a hurry.


I wonder who has a good record in dealing with addictions.

If it stops the weans ( that's children BTW) from buying cheap rotgut ciders and getting pished then its a good thing.
It won't really effect the sale of spirits to any extent and as the prices are going to rise after brexit it won't have any great effect after a couple of years.

plodging2 h, 9 m ago

Wonder if it will effect jobs cos I can't see people stumping up £20 for a …Wonder if it will effect jobs cos I can't see people stumping up £20 for a slab of the yellow pish that is Fosters, Carling , Coors etc.



The scots would drink the spirit out of the spirit level. This increase will likely make drink more desirable to them.

Original Poster

rincewynd66 m ago

If it stops the weans ( that's children BTW) from buying cheap rotgut …If it stops the weans ( that's children BTW) from buying cheap rotgut ciders and getting pished then its a good thing.It won't really effect the sale of spirits to any extent and as the prices are going to rise after brexit it won't have any great effect after a couple of years.


theyll still want a buzz...legal highs like Spice might get more popular maybe?

plodging2 h, 14 m ago

Wonder if it will effect jobs cos I can't see people stumping up £20 for a …Wonder if it will effect jobs cos I can't see people stumping up £20 for a slab of the yellow pish that is Fosters, Carling , Coors etc.


If they stick to 4% stuff so just under 2 units a can, a 20 pack would be reaching £20 which isn't massively more than you pay now anyway. Think it's cider where you are getting between 15-20 units in a 2 litre bottle, so should be near £10 a bottle when at the moment it can be around £2.

Uilleam172 h, 37 m ago

It makes no difference what you think of it, it's now the law, from next …It makes no difference what you think of it, it's now the law, from next yearMinimum unit pricing is not a tax; it is a targeted way of making sure alcohol is sold at a sensible price.


so all the extra tax the Gov't will see from higher profits at the retailer isn't a motive? is that what you are saying?

sure... believable.

adamspencer9522 m ago

so all the extra tax the Gov't will see from higher profits at the …so all the extra tax the Gov't will see from higher profits at the retailer isn't a motive? is that what you are saying?sure... believable.




Does it really matter?
Less drinking = good
Tax for services = good

rincewynd643 m ago

If it stops the weans ( that's children BTW) from buying cheap rotgut …If it stops the weans ( that's children BTW) from buying cheap rotgut ciders and getting pished then its a good thing.It won't really effect the sale of spirits to any extent and as the prices are going to rise after brexit it won't have any great effect after a couple of years.


Prices of imports might rise after brexit, which would affect wines but not the cheap crap teenagers and tramps drink, we make that in this country.

catbeans5 m ago

Does it really matter?Less drinking = good Tax for services = good


people like me who drink in moderation would be ~25%worse off for no reason. add that to 3% inflation and the Brexit effect and my pay is worth 10% less

whereas the retailers and gov't rake it in

if you think that's fair then there's something wrong

Agharta1 h, 5 m ago

Addiction is a mental illness and a heavy duty one as well. The UK has a …Addiction is a mental illness and a heavy duty one as well. The UK has a terrible record in dealing with such illnesses so don't expect that to change in a hurry.


No its a physical addiction hence the word

Rubisco8 m ago

Prices of imports might rise after brexit, which would affect wines but …Prices of imports might rise after brexit, which would affect wines but not the cheap crap teenagers and tramps drink, we make that in this country.


With imported ingredients, fruit and veg is expected to increase in cost by 33% due to brexit

Original Poster

adamspencer958 m ago

people like me who drink in moderation would be ~25%worse off for no …people like me who drink in moderation would be ~25%worse off for no reason. add that to 3% inflation and the Brexit effect and my pay is worth 10% lesswhereas the retailers and gov't rake it inif you think that's fair then there's something wrong


but...A 75cl bottle of 12.5% wine could not be sold for less than £4.69 - How much would you usually spend on a bottle of wine? Wine seem to be cheaper since the Brexit vote and consequent weakness of the £ so wouldn't panic yet.

adamspencer9537 m ago

so all the extra tax the Gov't will see from higher profits at the …so all the extra tax the Gov't will see from higher profits at the retailer isn't a motive? is that what you are saying?sure... believable.


To suggest that they can expect to get extra tax from higher profits at the retailer would be to assume that people would continue to buy White Lightning and pay Magners prices.

In reality those who can still afford to drink will switch brand, those who can't afford it will take drugs, bargain booze brands will go out of business, and retailers profits will drop.

Original Poster

Rubisco1 m ago

To suggest that they can expect to get extra tax from higher profits at …To suggest that they can expect to get extra tax from higher profits at the retailer would be to assume that people would continue to buy White Lightning and pay Magners prices.In reality those who can still afford to drink will switch brand, those who can't afford it will take drugs, bargain booze brands will go out of business, and retailers profits will drop.


Scots will load up at the Duty Free in future.
Post a comment
Avatar
@
    Text

    Top Discussions

    Top Merchants