44 Comments

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The other thread got locked because some cannot distinguish between Feedback and Misc.

I suspect it will be the same for your thread also.

So yes it's too lame.

to have a reasonable debate



I'd really like to see that.

Nice one dog_cop... But you'll probably get as a constructive answer in this as was given in the thread locked..:x

Original Poster Banned

Admin;4490383

The other thread got locked because some cannot distinguish between … The other thread got locked because some cannot distinguish between Feedback and Misc.I suspect it will be the same for your thread also.So yes it's too lame. I'd really like to see that.


Well here I am and I am reasonable and not going to have a pop so can I have a few answers to a few questions ?

Well here I am and I am reasonable and not going to have a pop so can I … Well here I am and I am reasonable and not going to have a pop so can I have a few answers to a few questions ?

That's what this forum is for. Formulate the questions, keep Misc/personal spats out of it and if everyone can stay reasonable and on topic we'll all get somewhere I'm sure.

Original Poster Banned

Admin;4490417

That's what this forum is for. Formulate the questions, keep … That's what this forum is for. Formulate the questions, keep Misc/personal spats out of it and if everyone can stay reasonable and on topic we'll all get somewhere I'm sure.


ok first question...
having been a member for quite a while, why are some of your staff very even handed and fair and some are not and dont seem to justify their actions ?

Original Poster Banned

please dont use this as a vehicle to attack admin be reasonable and reasonable answers we might get

Why was name calling allowed in a thread that didn't even concern them, but they jumped in and started shouting abuse. And the thread was reported by a good few people.
Thanks fitty x

dog_cop

having been a member for quite a while, why are some of your staff very … having been a member for quite a while, why are some of your staff very even handed and fair and some are not and dont seem to justify their actions ?



I suspect that is going to be based on ones experiences and the opinion of who is fair and who is not will probably differ between members (and where they spend their time).

I think the better question may be - "What can I do as a member if I feel a moderator is not acting fairly?"

The answer to that as far as I can see is to write an account of what happened, the response from the mod team, and why you feel it is not fair. Send that in through contact us so it can be read. If you don't feel that's enough then I'm happy to hear what else we can do.

Original Poster Banned

ok thats a fair reply, but do you understand how the un even handedness makes the members feel plus when no response to pm`s is forth comming it makes the situation worse

Admin...I know you don't discuss banned/suspended members so I will ask a question in general. Do you think it is fair or right that a member should be suspended or banned for something that two mods thought was funny and took it in the way it was meant only for another mod to take it all out of proportion and banned/suspended a very well respected member.. This is not about any perticular member but in general..

Admin;4490483

I suspect that is going to be based on ones experiences and the opinion … I suspect that is going to be based on ones experiences and the opinion of who is fair and who is not will probably differ between members (and where they spend their time). I think the better question may be - "What can I do as a member if I feel a moderator is not acting fairly?"The answer to that as far as I can see is to write an account of what happened, the response from the mod team, and why you feel it is not fair. Send that in through contact us so it can be read. If you don't feel that's enough then I'm happy to hear what else we can do.



Schoolteacher much?

Original Poster Banned

donnydude;4490545

Schoolteacher much?


I ask for some patience here folks and no trolling for once reasonable questions and I hope some reasonable answers

dog_cop

ok thats a fair reply, but do you undersatand how the un even handedness … ok thats a fair reply, but do you undersatand how the un even handedness makes the members feel plus when no response is frth comming it makes the situation worse



Yes I do understand. There are going to be situations though which just don't get handled fairly because it's too grey an area or too difficult to assemble all the information. I think the question from your side is whether it is a big deal or a small deal. It's going to be easier to pick the right battle to escalate than try to fight every little one because sometimes it's just not going to matter that much.

From the mod's side I hope you can appreciate that there are a lot of "interested" parties that skew the reported information one way or another. Often what seems to happen is no matter which way a mod decides on a complaint someone is going to feel they got the short end.

That's not an excuse for ineptitude or being unfair but just something to factor in when understanding how something looks in front of a mod.

edna_clouds

Admin...I know you don't discuss banned/suspended members so I will ask a … Admin...I know you don't discuss banned/suspended members so I will ask a question in general. Do you think it is fair or right that a member should be suspended or banned for something that two mods thought was funny and took it in the way it was meant only for another mod to take it all out of proportion and banned/suspended a very well respected member.. This is not about any perticular member but in general..



No this is in particular as you know. This is also what I mean by how a report is often very political and has many "interested" parties.

As I wrote in the other thread there is often a lot more to a report/story than what the mods hear and second what you hear/see.

There is a type of playing around that doesn't work in Deals. Misc is here for fun and that's fair enough but the majority of site members are in Deals and not Misc. Manipulation or abuse of the deal voting is heavily frowned upon.

Original Poster Banned

I understand how difficult the job of your moderating team is, putting aside the personal snipes from time to time, but do they ( not you) understand the frustration and pain some of the members feel at times, I for one try to deal with everyone how I like to be dealt with, which i think is a good mantra.. do they understand that all it might take is a message at some point for clarification ?

dog_cop

do they understand that all it might take is a message at some point for … do they understand that all it might take is a message at some point for clarification ?



I think they do understand that and try to do their best to communicate with members. This doesn't always happen though as you say and that can cause problems. I don't know the best way to make that communication as easy and quick as possible.

Are bans discussed with all mods when before the ban is actually issued?. I only ask this as you can be posting one minute in a thread with someone then all of a sudden they are banned. I know you have to do this sometimes but I don't think I have ever come across a member that has been suspended and then issued with a ban at a later date.
Would this not be the way to go? I mean suspend someone until all the mods can each make a comment to each other and then decide the punishment.. A bit like a mod jury..

I apologize for my first negative question..

Original Poster Banned

Admin;4490676

I think they do understand that and try to do their best to communicate … I think they do understand that and try to do their best to communicate with members. This doesn't always happen though as you say and that can cause problems. I don't know the best way to make that communication as easy and quick as possible.


a solution.. if the mod team were to read this thread they might realise how by a very quick pm a world of hate could be avoided. At least the member has a reply at the time and then future debate can be done by polite exchange of pm`s .. how easy is that ?

edna_clouds

Are bans discussed with all mods when before the ban is actually issued?.



Generally yes if it is not clear it is a bannable offense. We don't actually ban that much unless it is a spam/multi user. Usually suspensions are used and if there are several suspensions given and a problem continues then a ban will happen.

We have the attitude that people may need a warning but that they should understand that warning and then work within it after that. If a suspension is given and then problems continue and after additional suspensions it is still not sorted then there it is clear a ban is warranted.

The mods have an IM chat where they discuss issues constantly through the day so there isn't much that happens in isolation.

I've got to be up really early so have to go to bed now. I'll pick this up later tomorrow.

Thanks for the discussion so far.

Original Poster Banned

I have a zillion more questions but I have an early one and another day training an unruly dog, sounds a bit like on misc at times.
Thats for the answers I hope that you realise that your site is a gold mine and enjoyed by many, but dont forget its not just about your team the members are the life blood and sometimes some common courtesy is all it needs to iron out some issues and the members are not unreasonable folk, but an answer to a reasobale question is all some of us ask ...
Thanks for your time

I've always been treated fairly and that is the only case i can comment on with 100% certainty and genuinely have no issues with anyone on the team but i've moved on from yesterdays 'dramas' so my question doesn't regard that.

My question is the usual FS/FT..........is their plans to clarify the ruling on Traders to avoid and returning it anytime soon?

I have had no problems with MODS apart from last week, my brother posted a deal and got banned without explanation, I used the contact us button but as usual got no reply? Any chance of answers?

Syzable

My question is the usual FS/FT..........is their plans to clarify the … My question is the usual FS/FT..........is their plans to clarify the ruling on Traders to avoid and returning it anytime soon?



I know the mods are going over this and looking at options. There is support/arguments from members both ways which means either way it goes there is going to be a group that is not happy.

guv

Do you think this situation could have been avoided by simply spelling … Do you think this situation could have been avoided by simply spelling out why the thread was locked, or answering in the "why was my thread removed" or via the contact us - which everyone is always instructed to do?



I don't know the details of this specific case but as a general rule the less dramatics the easier it is to work with something.

Banned

Admin;4495020

I don't know the details of this specific case but as a general rule the … I don't know the details of this specific case but as a general rule the less dramatics the easier it is to work with something.


Any chance of a response in my thread: hotukdeals.com/ite…ns/ please?

Syzable;4492846

I've always been treated fairly and that is the only case i can comment … I've always been treated fairly and that is the only case i can comment on with 100% certainty and genuinely have no issues with anyone on the team



I'll second that :thumbsup:

Banned

Liddle ol' me;4495086

I'll second that :thumbsup:


I'll third it - HOWEVER I've seen others treated very unfairly.

Syzable;4492846

I've always been treated fairly and that is the only case i can comment … I've always been treated fairly and that is the only case i can comment on with 100% certainty and genuinely have no issues with anyone on the team



Liddle ol' me;4495086

I'll second that :thumbsup:



vibeone;4495282

I'll third it - HOWEVER I've seen others treated very unfairly.



Well, I was actually referring in particular to the bolded part of Sy's comment. I think we have to accept that mods make decisions in context and that we don't have full access to that context.

And if you accept they treat you fairly, I think it's probably fair to assume they extend this across the board.

Even if a decision seems a little harsh on occasions, why should the team have to justify their decision to anyone other than the person directly effected? Appeals should be between the suspended/banned member and the team and nobody else.

When personal relationships are brought into play with members attempting to exert pressure on other's behalf, it gets messy and (nearly always) blown out of proportion.

Banned

Liddle ol' me;4495639

why should the team have to justify their decision to anyone other than … why should the team have to justify their decision to anyone other than the person directly effected?



Well... I guess its down to opinion, but I think they should definitely have to justify their decisions - and some do.

I have a question if I may Admin.
Feedback used to be a place where we could get a definitive answer on serious questions. It was also a place where there was always a two way communication, you asked us, we replied, we asked you, you replied.

Why has feedback been allowed to become just a slightly more serious extension of miscellaneous where it has become very difficult to get a definitive answer from yourself or the Mod team ?
I don't know about others but I get the feeling that feedback nowadays is just a real pain in the backside to the team and you'd probably rather just see the "Contact Us" button used ?

As I write this is just my opinion and if you want a personal example ]here's one.

Banned

Admin;4495020

I don't know the details of this specific case but as a general rule the … I don't know the details of this specific case but as a general rule the less dramatics the easier it is to work with something.



He started a thread in feedback asking why the thread, a year old, had suddenly been locked.
I don't really think that is dramatic.
What was most annoying for him was that the thread was moved to misc (obviously by a mod) who couldn't even be bothered to answer the question!

The easiest thing in this case would quite obviously be to say why the thread was locked, it was a year old, had hundreds of replies, there surely couldn't have been anything wrong with it!

hottoshop

Why has feedback been allowed to become just a slightly more serious … Why has feedback been allowed to become just a slightly more serious extension of miscellaneous where it has become very difficult to get a definitive answer from yourself or the Mod team ?



I don't know why it's become like this Misc extension and I've said the same before. I think there are more agendas being dragged in and it's being used like a court rather than a place to exchange ideas.

I've also been thinking about closing it and just using the contact form for people who are serious. The misc style threads could just happen in Misc (which they are tending to do lately anyway).

Admin;4505493

I don't know why it's become like this Misc extension and I've said the … I don't know why it's become like this Misc extension and I've said the same before. I think there are more agendas being dragged in and it's being used like a court rather than a place to exchange ideas.I've also been thinking about closing it and just using the contact form for people who are serious. The misc style threads could just happen in Misc (which they are tending to do lately anyway).



good idea...feedback is useless.

Admin;4505493

I don't know why it's become like this Misc extension and I've said the … I don't know why it's become like this Misc extension and I've said the same before. I think there are more agendas being dragged in and it's being used like a court rather than a place to exchange ideas.I've also been thinking about closing it and just using the contact form for people who are serious. The misc style threads could just happen in Misc (which they are tending to do lately anyway).



Think it would be a real pity if you did, its good to have a forum where site issues can be debated and feedback from and to moderators and yourself can be given, more good ideas would come that way than through just contact-us.

Admin;4505493

I don't know why it's become like this Misc extension and I've said the … I don't know why it's become like this Misc extension and I've said the same before. I think there are more agendas being dragged in and it's being used like a court rather than a place to exchange ideas.I've also been thinking about closing it and just using the contact form for people who are serious. The misc style threads could just happen in Misc (which they are tending to do lately anyway).



Well with due respect to you Admin you run the site and "employ" the mods so you have direct control about what gets posted in Feedback. I can't think why there's an issue in just policing Feedback correctly ??

Feedback has worked very well for you in the past especially during the site changeover and along with Jah128 I would be sad to see it go.
Surely it also goes against what you wanted the site to stand for, an active and friendly community ?? A "Contact Us" button for feedback is hardly friendly IMO ??

Admin;4505493

I don't know why it's become like this Misc extension and I've said the … I don't know why it's become like this Misc extension and I've said the same before. I think there are more agendas being dragged in and it's being used like a court rather than a place to exchange ideas.I've also been thinking about closing it and just using the contact form for people who are serious. The misc style threads could just happen in Misc (which they are tending to do lately anyway).



jah128;4505543

Think it would be a real pity if you did, its good to have a forum where … Think it would be a real pity if you did, its good to have a forum where site issues can be debated and feedback from and to moderators and yourself can be given, more good ideas would come that way than through just contact-us.



I agree such a forum is healthy and should exist in theory jah128, but looking at recent threads, an increasingly large number of them are started by members trying to push an agenda - and often one designed to criticise a decision by the mods/admin that has somehow affected them or a 'friend'.

I can also see why Admin might be frustrated by this. There are also other arguments for not letting it become a place that 'legitimises' personal grievances stemming from Misc.

Surely good ideas, serious complaints, and other suggestions will arrive even without this forum?

One idea which might act as a compromise though is to have the Feedback tab lead you to a form to fill out with your suggestion / complaint / comment. These could then be added to a viewable database after they have been answered by the team so that a public record remains.

Liddle ol' me;4505885

I agree such a forum is healthy and should exist in theory jah128, but … I agree such a forum is healthy and should exist in theory jah128, but looking at recent threads, an increasingly large number of them are started by members trying to push an agenda - and often one designed to criticise a decision by the mods/admin that has somehow affected them or a 'friend'. I can also see why Admin might be frustrated by this. There are also other arguments for not letting it become a place that 'legitimises' personal grievances stemming from Misc. Surely good ideas, serious complaints, and other suggestions will arrive even without this forum? One idea which might act as a compromise though is to have the Feedback tab lead you to a form to fill out with your suggestion / complaint / comment. These could then be added to a viewable database after they have been answered by the team so that a public record remains.



Why make something complicated that isn't ?

If the posts are not right for Feedback then delete them, end of.

What is difficult about that ??

Liddle ol' me;4505885

One idea which might act as a compromise though is to have the Feedback … One idea which might act as a compromise though is to have the Feedback tab lead you to a form to fill out with your suggestion / complaint / comment. These could then be added to a viewable database after they have been answered by the team so that a public record remains.



hottoshop;4506168

Why make something complicated that isn't ?If the posts are not right for … Why make something complicated that isn't ?If the posts are not right for Feedback then delete them, end of.What is difficult about that ??



I was thinking it might actually simplify things, but either way it is nothing more than a raw 'compromise' suggestion in case Admin decides to close Feedback.
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