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My missus works for this company, and I feel they seriously undervalue her .
This new guy started work he manages the managers .Then, after a personality clash with my partners manager , they sacked him. Since then , she has been doing his job and teaching others how to do things . Then, instead of giving her the managers job , they hired someone else, and she is now teaching her new manager what the job entails . It turns out this new guy is a friend of the manager , manager .
She has worked at this company for 15 plus years .The only reason why she doesn't seem to get promoted is because she doesn't have any higher qualifications or is not friends with the higher-ups , yet at times has been running her department and a lot more so over the past 6 months .
On top of that , they have been underpaying her for the job title that she does . Every other company that hires for the same position pays around 4 / 5 thousand more a year .
She has been offered a new job at another company at the higher rate , but I feel her current company are taking the pee and she shouldn't need to leave . They should be rewarding her for the job she does and has done.
I am not joined up to a lot of forums , so I thought I would ask here . Is there anything she can do ? Should she do something?
I just wanted to vent a little .
This new guy started work he manages the managers .Then, after a personality clash with my partners manager , they sacked him. Since then , she has been doing his job and teaching others how to do things . Then, instead of giving her the managers job , they hired someone else, and she is now teaching her new manager what the job entails . It turns out this new guy is a friend of the manager , manager .
She has worked at this company for 15 plus years .The only reason why she doesn't seem to get promoted is because she doesn't have any higher qualifications or is not friends with the higher-ups , yet at times has been running her department and a lot more so over the past 6 months .
On top of that , they have been underpaying her for the job title that she does . Every other company that hires for the same position pays around 4 / 5 thousand more a year .
She has been offered a new job at another company at the higher rate , but I feel her current company are taking the pee and she shouldn't need to leave . They should be rewarding her for the job she does and has done.
I am not joined up to a lot of forums , so I thought I would ask here . Is there anything she can do ? Should she do something?
I just wanted to vent a little .
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46 Comments
sorted bythreatening to leave or kicking up a fuss about the situation wont help her and may make things worse in her current job.
check the notice period, check outstanding holiday owed. interview for new post. go
If you show yourself to be competent, uniquely qualified and resourceful, yet still don't get earmarked for promotion, or even given some sort of recognition or encouragement, it's time to move on. Likeability does play a part in the workplace, as does popularity, sad to say, but it's not the whole story - if a company is run efficiently, those who don't pull their weight should be given the heave-ho before long (though...that all depends...!).
Sounds like they may eventually regret promoting those who can't do their job properly - they are relying on your wife more than they may appreciate - she is definitely being undervalued! It also seems communication is very poor in the workplace, on top of all this.
I bet if she moves onto a more supportive and forward-thinking work environment she'll wish she'd done it sooner. And her old employers will be kicking themselves that they didn't appreciate what they had. (edited)
15yrs means she's a door mat.
2yrs tops now for me.
In my place the factory floor staff often train the new managers in many aspects of their job, it doesn't mean they can do the full remit of the job however.
A senior managers job may well entail more than just getting to grips with day-to-day running and they will likely have other qualities or attributes being the reason why they obtained the role.
Before I would take the opinion as others have indicated of getting your missus to jack in her current job it would be worthwhile getting her to request feedback as to why she didn't obtain the role and what she can do to improve her chances in the future. GAP analysis should indicate shortcomings which she could request training on and would show a clear motivation to progress given many managers nowadays are expected to apply for roles even where they don't want to.
It's very easy to state discrimination or favouritism when the reality is most employers implement positive discrimination and have equity systems for hiring women and minorities, many even say as much in their mission statements.
Equally I think it highly unlikely that someone got sacked over a personality clash as am employer has to give grounds for dismissal otherwise they are in for a big payday over 'unfair dismissal'.
Seems to be a regular number of these weekend posts when people are on the juice and they express how the world is against them. If you honestly feel your wife has been discriminated against she should lodge a formal grievance with the HR department over sexual discrimination but I would suspect it will go nowhere as the company will be able to show that the new hire was the most suitable candidate for the job. Equally if she thinks the grass is greener elsewhere she should apply elsewhere but it is a highly competitive marketplace and you have already alluded to her being underqualified but then again there is no harm testing the water. The flip side is she will face a whole lot if new challenges as 15-years is a long time to become comfortable in a job.
No employer is going to pay you what you are worth, only what they need to. It is only by justifying your worth can you demand more. Upskilling, threatening to leave or actually leaving are likely the only options available to secure a substantial pay rise.
the employee has had 15 years in the current role where they could have tried to get the higher qualifications or make friends with the higher ups
you don't mention the role or salary so there's no way to determine the percentage of salary difference. if she's a basic rate tax payer then it's about £12 a day in her pocket more elsewhere. money isn't everything so they would need to consider if the extra work/travel/training/benefits and starting again to acrrue annual leave and sick/maternity/etc benefits and the rights that longer permanent staff have regarding job security. the current post may be safe and secure, the new post may not work out or the employee may not like it, it could be worse
she could discuss her manager to advise her concerns and advise she's been offered another job and see if they are willing to match or improve the offer to keep her on, or see if they can offer training or a way to move up in the current organisation, or they may be happy to let her go and get someone else in
ultimately is her decision to make, lose job security for higher pay on the understanding the role may not work out and she may have to seek another job. a lot may depend on how financially secure they are and if they can last a period with no income or take a reduced income in an alternate post if the new offer doesn't work out
if she's applied for a role and been offered it then the company must have an interest in employing her, so i'd suggest seeing if the current role can match or improve the offer and if not then move on. if it doesn't work out then i'm sure if she's been given an opporunity with that role, then there's a good chance someone else would do the same elsewhere. having a look at the job market to see how many similar roles are currently available will give an idea on fall back roles should the new one not work out. if there aren't many, play safe, if there are plenty then that should give more confidence to move on
99% of managers will never promote someone who is better than they are, it would make them look bad, much better to have them do your work for you and then take the credit.
Tell her to hand in her notice immediately, meaning the new manager won’t be trained and in the letter explain the reasons that you’ve just put forward.
They will either accept the resignation, in which case she was going nowhere there anyway, or up her pay and accept she is valued, in which case she now realised she had to resign in order for them to realise her worth.
Either way it isn’t good so i would accept the new job offer and leave with the head held high. (edited)
Still don't think it's fair , but it is what it is
All the best to you and your wife.
Wife sacked for questioning management decisions & asking for raise......
House now being repossessed........
Divorce proceedings initiated......
"Thanks a bunch for the great advice you lot"
In my work theres a basic installer, level 2 installer ( me )
Level 3 electrical installer.
Took me and some other guys 4 years to be put in for training to be a level 2 and a few grand increase.
In a meeting the other day one of the level 3 workers started kicking off and informed us all the company are taking on new employees with no experience as a basic installer and paying them more than the level 3 installers.
Manager first denied it then said its because they're struggling to find people so they had to increase the basic pay and we're not being increased above them and guess who has to train the new guys up ? Yeah, Us, unbelievable.
But i have the option to leave i guess.
I get full sick pay for 5 weeks and an extra 5 days holiday each year for 5 years service, guess ill have to suck it up or go get less holiday and potentially ssp somewhere else (edited)
If they don't increase all the level 2's & 3's in line with the new wage structure for the basic level newbies, then they will lose most/all of their experienced workers and then still be faced with having to pay more to attract new staff at those levels, but with barely anyone to train them all.
Are they trying to destroy their own business, or are they arrogant or dumb or some combination?
15yrs means I'm a legend.
2 posts tops now for me.
I was trained up in every aspect of the job ..
and still on basic wage, and they wouldn’t promote me, I was very undervalued ..
management used to come to me for answers, and to top it off, as soon as I trained another person enough, they made me redundant ..
I should have learnt my lesson
In my experience, a job is advertised internally but to a select few, which is where friends of managers have gotten the job and not her.
If she really wants to stay at the place she can use the job offer and use it to see if they want her. But at this point, if she has been with the company for 15 years and hasn't even been aware or thought of for this position then the company has shown their hand.
I wouldn't do any more work than what she agreed to in her initial contract, before she started training these managers or doing their jobs for them, and just do what she normally did if she wants to put her 2-weeks notice in (unless her contract states otherwise).
In that question you might find the answer to your questions of why.
Work that out. Ask for a settlement & move on with life. (edited)
If I were Mrs Fairys_Burn_Things, I'd keep my silence and take that better paid job. (edited)
That way company can't use you to train up anyone, you get time off plus new job.
It very much is who you know everywhere.
Has she sat down and asked for a pay rise? Wages aren't set in stone they're negotiable. If she can give the employer a valid reason why she deserves more then there is a chance she will get it. Regarding her training the new manager up I have personally been in this situation and I refused to do it. I told them if I'm not good enough for the position then I'm not good enough to train them up. I left that company not long after, after 12 years of service.
Over the years, they have given her a pay rise here and there , but its still fallen below what's advertised elsewhere . Like I said, the new jobs starting salary is about 5 grand a year more than what she is being paid now. That on its own is a joke . She has basically been punished for being loyal .
Given that your wife now has 15 years of experience I would suggest her lack of qualifications is less of an issue now. And if she's already got an option for a new job then I'd say go for it. Oh, if the old job does offer more money (which they probably will do), remember what drastic action it's taken to get a pay rise.
Same with mobile phone contracts, same with insurance companies, employment just doesn't seem to reward loyalty.
If she doesn't have the qualifications for the job posting but the new hire does I don't really see the problem. If this is the case it isn't unfair or discriminatory. I know managers in the civil service and private sector who were deemed underqualified and at risk of losing their job despite already working the role until they attained new qualifications.
In my place the factory floor staff often train the new managers in many aspects of their job, it doesn't mean they can do the full remit of the job however.
A senior managers job may well entail more than just getting to grips with day-to-day running and they will likely have other qualities or attributes being the reason why they obtained the role.
Before I would take the opinion as others have indicated of getting your missus to jack in her current job it would be worthwhile getting her to request feedback as to why she didn't obtain the role and what she can do to improve her chances in the future. GAP analysis should indicate shortcomings which she could request training on and would show a clear motivation to progress given many managers nowadays are expected to apply for roles even where they don't want to.
It's very easy to state discrimination or favouritism when the reality is most employers implement positive discrimination and have equity systems for hiring women and minorities, many even say as much in their mission statements.
Equally I think it highly unlikely that someone got sacked over a personality clash as am employer has to give grounds for dismissal otherwise they are in for a big payday over 'unfair dismissal'.
Seems to be a regular number of these weekend posts when people are on the juice and they express how the world is against them. If you honestly feel your wife has been discriminated against she should lodge a formal grievance with the HR department over sexual discrimination but I would suspect it will go nowhere as the company will be able to show that the new hire was the most suitable candidate for the job. Equally if she thinks the grass is greener elsewhere she should apply elsewhere but it is a highly competitive marketplace and you have already alluded to her being underqualified but then again there is no harm testing the water. The flip side is she will face a whole lot if new challenges as 15-years is a long time to become comfortable in a job.
No employer is going to pay you what you are worth, only what they need to. It is only by justifying your worth can you demand more. Upskilling, threatening to leave or actually leaving are likely the only options available to secure a substantial pay rise.
The previous manager got paid off and had to sign one them NDA's .
She already has an offer on the table of a new job . They have offered her about 5 grand more a year with the potential for it to rise another 5 within the next couple if she is willing to do a few courses .
This new manager literally has no clue about any aspect of the job . The only thing that he has is that he has managerial experience and has worked with the person in the position above him before .
Over the years , she has literally done the managers job . every time one of the managers has gone on holiday , died , left , she has been the one to run the department.
It's not about the money . We have known she was being underpayed for a while , but she was happy there . So I've never pushed her to leave her job, but this new guy literally doesn't have a clue about anything to do with the business. His managerial experience may as well have been at McDonald’s.
Colleagues, managers, customer or client interactions, I have only scant knowledge about.
Some workplaces have yearly work reviews (a bit like a school report card but in a one-on-one interview), I wonder if there has been any of those, as it gives some idea how you're progressing. (edited)
What is your wife's opinion/view? Seems it is you saying she is undervalued and you've never pushed her to leave her job......
Now she feels like she is being pushed out.
I'm wondering if the wife even knows her situation is being discussed at length on a bargain hunting site
Nope . It's me venting . Common sense says to take the new job , but I feel they're taking the pee, and she should be rewarded for the work she has done, and it basically feels like they're pushing her out .
I think this is a pretty common situation, just move on.
In my work theres a basic installer, level 2 installer ( me )
Level 3 electrical installer.
Took me and some other guys 4 years to be put in for training to be a level 2 and a few grand increase.
In a meeting the other day one of the level 3 workers started kicking off and informed us all the company are taking on new employees with no experience as a basic installer and paying them more than the level 3 installers.
Manager first denied it then said its because they're struggling to find people so they had to increase the basic pay and we're not being increased above them and guess who has to train the new guys up ? Yeah, Us, unbelievable.
But i have the option to leave i guess.
I get full sick pay for 5 weeks and an extra 5 days holiday each year for 5 years service, guess ill have to suck it up or go get less holiday and potentially ssp somewhere else
See , you read about people getting paid out because someone said something they found offensive, but its stuff like this that shouldn't be allowed . It's a liberty.
We had a similar situation when I was in retail with new starters getting paid more then current staff that had been there for 4/5 year's it causes a lot of animosity especially if they are lazy.
Management will never change unless she has had conversations with them about where they see her future in the company.