Got car MOT last year and it passed with some minor advisories but failed with major defects this time
deleted2702595
deleted2702595
I got the car MOTed last year and it passed with some minor advisories, took it to a different garage this time and it failed with a number of defects of one which I got fixed last time and some major ones.
Due to lockdown and COVID the cars been driven about 6k mile or less between the last and this MOT.
So don't understand how this much could have happened, to me it seems either the last guy didn't do it properly or this one wants money off me and making it up or has made all these faults.
Not sure what to do as the quote to fix all these is more than what the car is worth.
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Update, as some of you advised, I've managed to get the MOT results. I know these must be fixed, any idea on cost estimate so I can negotiate accordingly.
Refusal Notices
Offside front brake pad(s) less than 1.5 mm thick (1.1.13 (a) (ii)) - Dangerous
Nearside rear stop lamp(s) not working (4.3.1 (a) (ii)) - Major
Nearside headlamp aim projected beam image is obviously incorrect (4.1.2 (c)) - Major
Nearside front lower suspension arm ball joint excessively worn (5.3.4 (a) (i)) - Major
Offside front lower suspension arm ball joint excessively worn (5.3.4 (a) (i)) - Major
Rear exhaust system insecure (6.1.2 (a)) - Major
Advisory Notices
Nearside registration plate lamp inoperative in the case of multiple lamps or light sources (4.7.1 (b) (i)) - Minor
Nearside rear service brake binding but not excessively (1.2.1 (f))
Front brake disc worn, pitted or scored, but not seriously weakened (1.1.14 (a) (ii))
Nearside rear tyre worn close to legal limit/worn on edge (5.2.3 (e))
Offside rear tyre worn close to legal limit/worn on edge (5.2.3 (e))
Nearside front tyre worn close to legal limit/worn on edge (5.2.3 (e))
Due to lockdown and COVID the cars been driven about 6k mile or less between the last and this MOT.
So don't understand how this much could have happened, to me it seems either the last guy didn't do it properly or this one wants money off me and making it up or has made all these faults.
Not sure what to do as the quote to fix all these is more than what the car is worth.
---
Update, as some of you advised, I've managed to get the MOT results. I know these must be fixed, any idea on cost estimate so I can negotiate accordingly.
Refusal Notices
Offside front brake pad(s) less than 1.5 mm thick (1.1.13 (a) (ii)) - Dangerous
Nearside rear stop lamp(s) not working (4.3.1 (a) (ii)) - Major
Nearside headlamp aim projected beam image is obviously incorrect (4.1.2 (c)) - Major
Nearside front lower suspension arm ball joint excessively worn (5.3.4 (a) (i)) - Major
Offside front lower suspension arm ball joint excessively worn (5.3.4 (a) (i)) - Major
Rear exhaust system insecure (6.1.2 (a)) - Major
Advisory Notices
Nearside registration plate lamp inoperative in the case of multiple lamps or light sources (4.7.1 (b) (i)) - Minor
Nearside rear service brake binding but not excessively (1.2.1 (f))
Front brake disc worn, pitted or scored, but not seriously weakened (1.1.14 (a) (ii))
Nearside rear tyre worn close to legal limit/worn on edge (5.2.3 (e))
Offside rear tyre worn close to legal limit/worn on edge (5.2.3 (e))
Nearside front tyre worn close to legal limit/worn on edge (5.2.3 (e))
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sorted byObservation: a vehicle that fails with an item of "most of the bulbs" suggests that the vehicle is generally not maintained, has inadequate service schedule/attention and is generally allowed to deteriorate, in which case repeat / more serious failures between MoTs would be reasonable and not unexpected.
I don't know why you are surprised. It boils my urine when I get a car to test & the customer says "I noticed a bulb out" or the nail I advised on last year is still in the tyre!
You can check what's actually failed on the GOV.UK website. You don't need to wait for them.
My garage would replace the stop lamp and adjust the headlight aim for free if I gave them the other work, and just charge a nominal amount for the exhaust if it was an easy fix, maybe ask yours if they will do the same.
That would give you a pass for your MOT.
Once you've done that it would be a good idea to start looking for a new set of tyres, it sounds like you'll need them before the next MOT so you may as well have the benefit of new tyres over the winter. (edited)
Offside front brake pad(s) less than 1.5 mm thick (1.1.13 (a) (ii)) - Dangerous £20ish
Nearside rear stop lamp(s) not working (4.3.1 (a) (ii)) - Major Couple of £ for a bulb
Nearside headlamp aim projected beam image is obviously incorrect (4.1.2 (c)) - Major Probably just needs adjusting
Nearside front lower suspension arm ball joint excessively worn (5.3.4 (a) (i)) - Major £25ish
Offside front lower suspension arm ball joint excessively worn (5.3.4 (a) (i)) - Major £25ish
Rear exhaust system insecure (6.1.2 (a)) - Major Probably a rubber, few £
I would imagine somewhere between £50 and £100 labour if it's a small backstreet garage doing the work. Thats assuming it is what I've said, for example the light not working could be a wiring problem, which to trace could cost more than the rest of the jobs put together, but it's most likely a bulb blown.
The advisorys
Nearside registration plate lamp inoperative in the case of multiple lamps or light sources (4.7.1 (b) (i)) - Minor Couple of £ for a bulb, may as well get it done
Nearside rear service brake binding but not excessively (1.2.1 (f)) Probably just needs freeing off and is due to the car not being used much, maybe an extra £20 labour if you get it done at the same time as the rest. I would get it done.
Front brake disc worn, pitted or scored, but not seriously weakened (1.1.14 (a) (ii)) You can ignore that
Nearside rear tyre worn close to legal limit/worn on edge (5.2.3 (e))
Offside rear tyre worn close to legal limit/worn on edge (5.2.3 (e))
Nearside front tyre worn close to legal limit/worn on edge (5.2.3 (e))
regarding the tyres, I would say your wheels might need aligning (assuming they are inflated properly). Depending on how bad they are I would most likely be looking at getting them replaced, but impossible to say without seeing them, if the rest of the tyre is almost brand new and it's half an inch round the edge, I would probably just find out what caused them to wear and fix it. (edited)
I am waiting for the garage to give me the list but as that wasn't made yet but from on top of his head, the disc plates, 3 tires and alignment, something to do with brakes, most of the bulbs, something to do with suspension and they were mentioning more stuff, they said they'll give a call again as they just finished the MOT.
This vehicle cannot be driven away from the garage in its current condition.
Offside front brake pad(s) less than 1.5 mm thick (1.1.13 (a) (ii)) - Dangerous
Nearside rear stop lamp(s) not working (4.3.1 (a) (ii)) - Major
An item that wears with use.
Nearside headlamp aim projected beam image is obviously incorrect (4.1.2 (c)) - Major
If it’s a plastic headlamp lens it might have clouded (just needs a polish or clean), or the lamp may just need adjustment to the correct level (need to check with MOT station which it actually failed for as the reason is a little ambiguous.
Nearside front lower suspension arm ball joint excessively worn (5.3.4 (a) (i)) - Major
Offside front lower suspension arm ball joint excessively worn (5.3.4 (a) (i)) - Major
These items wear with use, the boots normally perish with time and allow dirt ingress.
Rear exhaust system insecure (6.1.2 (a)) - Major
Might be a rubber hanger that has perished or the metal bracket on the exhaust might have snapped, both can easily happen over time
Advisory Notices
Nearside registration plate lamp inoperative in the case of multiple lamps or light sources (4.7.1 (b) (i)) - Minor
Most likely just the bulb
Nearside rear service brake binding but not excessively (1.2.1 (f))
Brakes most likely just need a service to free off.
Front brake disc worn, pitted or scored, but not seriously weakened (1.1.14 (a) (ii))
Is going to happen over time with or without use.
Nearside rear tyre worn close to legal limit/worn on edge (5.2.3 (e))
Offside rear tyre worn close to legal limit/worn on edge (5.2.3 (e))
Nearside front tyre worn close to legal limit/worn on edge (5.2.3 (e))
Tyres are always going to wear with use.
None of it sounds overly drastic and I wouldn’t be surprised with any of it appearing from one MOT to the next, they are all pretty common issues associated with use. Even just 6k a year.
Most of it would likely have been picked up if you had it regularly serviced or maintained.
It's cheap up North, and I think they must work faster.
"Why they make things like that so hard to change is beyond me"
3 Guesses. £ or ££ or £££ (edited)
They used to be really cheap and really good years ago, but as they got popular, they put their prices up, I used to use them all the time. As an example, needed the DMF and clutch doing in January, asked in the one on Hylton Rd (same garage) for a price, they quoted £400, walked a few doors up, and the lads there charged £150. Few months later the same garage charged me £30 to change the front pads and discs. They've been there at least 25 years I know of, VAT registered, full receipt, so not just some guy doing a bit fiddle work
Some garages take the p though, needed the drop links changing about a year ago, called into a garage someone had recommended, £40 per side, wtf, it is literally a 5 minute job per side on a ramp, take 2 nuts off, pull the drop link off, pop the new one on and put the nuts back on, you don't even have to take the wheels off! Went to Vulcan motors at Roker and he did them for a tenner.
I'm the same as you, do most the work myself, but sometimes it's easier just to get someone else to do it, depending on the price obviously.
I only ever use Pagid brakes and pads. I fitted my Type R about 5 months ago with disc and pads front/rear which cost £180 with discount code from Euros. If I got them for that with code I'd honestly have a heart attack if I got a quote from a garage... At a guess £400+ easy.
What brand were your brakes? Did you find the problem? I usually let mine wear in, you don't have to but they do recommend it before any heavy breaking. Brymbo seem to be the worst for warping
I had Brembo brake discs and pads on my last car. Had to change the pads because they rattled like crazy but the discs were fine for me. Put some OEM pads on (Vauxhall). Problem solved.
My go to pads are Ferodo. They're definitely an improvement over oem pads. Currently have them fitted on my current car. Ford Kuga.
I was helping my neighbour do his discs and pads, he threw the shims in the box, I had to tell him he needed them on, so cleaned them up for him with a wire brush and refitted them. A few times I've had brand new shims with the kit but usually just clean the old ones up. I'm guessing that'll solve your squeaking issue straight away.
The pin I've seen people in the past not remove it and grease it up, I think they must think it'll be fine but it's always nice to check while everything is off.
I just hope the OP gets everything sorted for a hell of a lot cheap than they've been quoted. Some old cars you just have to call it a day when they start turning into money pits
Some things will require some discretion, Lots can happen in 6k miles. Having some basic knowledge will help prevent you getting fleeced.
Maybe the garage is trying it on, It's a bit late now but if you're unsure you could have it MOT'd elsewhere. Be warned though it won't be legal to drive if it's not road worthy regardless of MOT status. Hence will likely need towing to another garage etc..
"Driving a vehicle that’s failed
You can take your vehicle away if:
- your current MOT certificate is still valid
- no ‘dangerous’ problems were listed in the MOT"
Check the actual fail listed on the MOT (online here). That's the only thing needing to be fixed. But if its listed as dangerous you can't drive your car away.
But at some point every jalopy meets the end of the road (edited)
They looked ok to me tbh at least the ones I saw such as the headlights, brakes, etc so not sure. Waiting for the proper list/discussion to find out the exact issues but just confused to so many defects which weren't there last time.
Bulbs seemed fine to me, at least the ones I saw, the garage said I can drive it between home and garage and vice versa even though they picked up major defects.
I wasn't advised for any of the mentioned stuff last time and the one that the garage this mention, I've asked them to fix before MOT and they even replaced 2 of the bulbs.
We have no power to prevent the vehicle presenter from driving the vehicle away if its been issued with a dangerous.
Don't wait. Check online now.
Didn't know I could do that, I've check and it's a available, I've pasted it in the description. Thanks.
Seems like it, the garage is closed so will check in the morning for the exact cost to repair, but if I can get some indication I can negotiate accordingly.
If it is a dangerous fault then the risk is most certainly yours. Accidentally kill someone and you'll be in trouble!
Some things are objective, ball arm joints for example.
But to be honest, there nothing there that's too expensive. You can do a lot yourself. The most expensive will be the tyres which you shouldn't complain about as they are consumables and are going to need changing regularly anyway.
Do what you can, advertise on Facebook local page for someone to do the other stuff Labour only - but buy the parts yourself (eBay is a good source for cheap car parts. Put your reg in on Halfords or Eurocarparts and make a note of the part numbers, then search for them).
Mostly agree but depending where you live the labour costs seem very low and probably VAT at add to these prices.
Nothing catastrophic though, one of our cars costs over £300 just to get the spark plugs changed.
really? I actually put up to £100 for those who live down south knowing it will likely be more down there lol. I know for a fact I could get that work done up here for about £50 labour.
It's no more than a couple of hours labour, 2 ball joints, set of pads (wheels off for both of those so saving time if done at the same time), a bulb and an exhaust rubber. I could do it on the street without an impact wrench in under 2 hours, probably about an hour on a ramp with power tools.
Obviously, like I say, does depend on the car and whats involved, to change the DRL bulb on my car you have to take the front bumper off, which means to change the bulb would be 90 mins labour at least. Why they make things like that so hard to change is beyond me.
Letting your tyres and breaks wear down is dangerous to both you and other drivers. You could skid or not be able to stop or could hit another vehicle or pedestrian.
I had a wheel bearing fail on my van just before its mot last year. Had to be towed to the garage. Had the bearing replaced. Took it for mot and it failed. 2 other bearing had excessive wear and needed to be replaced along with a cracked back leaf spring.
In the end i had 3 wheel bearings, 2 leaf springs and both back hangers replaced along with new pads and discs and a new battery. Cost me £1,200. Very expensive and not really happy about it. But at the end of the day you have no choice.
Things wear out and some are consumables that you need to monitor and sort. Wipers, spark plugs, tyres and pressure, bulbs and fluids etc.
You have 2 choices, 1 pay and get it fixed or 2 sell or scrap the vehicle and replace it.
You should take your vehicle in for a service just before your mot is due. That way you can get things sorted before hand and hopefully sail through the mot.
No offence, but it sounds like you have let maintenance slide a little. Possibly due to lock down and lack of funds. But either way it's your responsibility to keep your vehicle road worthy for your own or other road users safety. Plus it's the law.
Im sure you must have insurance. Driving an unroad worthy vehicle will probably invalid your insurance. Imagine if someone hit you without insurance. How mad would you be?
Now imagine you hit someone else due to worn tyres or breaks. How mad would they be at your negligence. Plus the popo would have you.
Garages would change for both, even though the wheels off they're two seperate jobs so doesn't make a difference if the wheels off.
Garage prices aren't cheap at all these days, a few mates own garages and know they prices you've said are well under.
The OP told me the on spot price they've been quoted and it's not far off a grand for everything.
Pads alone a garage will charge you £30-50 for labour easy
Your mates are expensive if thats the case. £50 to fit a set of pads that takes 15 minutes (assuming the caliper isn't seized or anything)? So £200 an hour labour? Even dealers don't charge that. Come over to Sunderland and I'll take you to 10 garages without speaking to them first, who will charge under £100 labour for the jobs that need doing.
£1000 for the failure list and parts is an absolute rip off, assuming it's not a top end car (and even then it's over the top). Most dealers wouldn't charge that.
What car is it as obviously that could make a difference, a 4 year old Porsche or Land Rover will obviously cost quite a bit more to do than a 20 year old Scenic.
Not all garages charge by the hour, they charge for the work that's being done, so like I said £30-50 for pads to be changed.
I do my own work but know people who can't do basic jobs get stung with the bill. Garages really aren't cheap these days at all.
When I had my Range Rover Sport I took it to Les Potts who quoted me a mental amount for some work, took the car to CC Discount Motor Store in Hendon where my mate worked and did the work for 1/4 of the price. It always pays to have a friend in this industry
My mate actually got drop links fitted to his mk7 Fiesta a few months ago, cost him £120 for both sides, I'm pretty certain they'll have used the cheap and nasty kind as well. I would have done them for him but I was full of busy.
I just feel sorry for people who have to people mental prices.
When my friend Carl worked at CC that was my go to garage but since he's moved to another garage I stated using a new mechanic for jobs I can't do at home, would love one of them home ramps you put under the cills and lifts the full car up with the air compressor it comes with.
If you buy stuff from EuroCarParts they've actually got a bit when you pay what says 'fit for me' you enter your postcode and it gives you a price from local garages
Yeah I'm sure some garages see £ signs in their eyes when you walk in, I genuinely don't know how the large chains like Halfords etc get any business from the public. I had loads of problems with my discs warping, and went through 3 sets in 18 months, called in Halfords to get the brakes checked (was never going to use them) as thought they might at least be able to find the problem with them being brake 'specialists'. They wanted £547 to supply and fit the pads and discs. Peugeot dealers at the time were £199, I could have got the front and back pads and discs done at the dealer and still had £100 left over from what I would have paid for just the front at Halfrauds
I pretty much stick to 3 places now when I need stuff doing that I can't be bothered to do myself. Vulcan, Hylton Road and a lad who's mobile now as he gave up his garage. Sure he just does everything on the fiddle though and I wouldn't trust him with anything too technical, although he's fine for mechanical stuff, brakes, suspension etc. Theres a small garage over by the stadium who are extremely knowledgeable and good, but don't half charge for it, more expensive than a dealer.
Yeah a home ramp would be excellent, I would rarely go into a garage if I had one of those.
I've tried different types, including Pagid (which incidentally are what Halfords use). I stripped them down completely and the drivers side caliper pin was a little sticky, so greased everything up and freed that off, the ones I got fitted earlier this year have been fine (touch wood) so am presuming that sorted it, I can see why garages missed it as it wasn't stuck, I just noticed it was a little stiff when I was pulling everything off, I had 6 sets on in 3 years and usually I would feel a slight judder after about 4-6 weeks, which would get progressively worse, so if nothing else these have lasted much longer. I am actually going to change them again as I got sick of paying for decent brands, at the moment the discs are a cheap unbranded set from ebay with Bosch pads, as I figured if they were only lasting a month or so, they couldn't be any worse lol, but I want decent ones back on now the problem seems to have been fixed. They squeak like mad too, which no amount of copper grease has stopped, but found out they should have shims in, which mine don't, dealer only part which are £27 + VAT but managed to find someone selling genuine ones on ebay for a fiver, they came last week so will change the pads and discs next week when I pop them in.
It was doing my head in though, I've been driving 35 years and never had a disc warp on me, so, despite what some garages were saying, knew it wasn't my driving style, and after the second set was very careful, made sure they were worn in properly, didn't sit with my foot on the brake at lights or anything, and they still only lasted a matter of weeks. One of the most frustrating things I've ever had go wrong on a car.
FWIW, ebay can be much better than ECP for parts, when there's a 20% discount code. There are fakes so you have to be careful, but if you buy from a large seller like carpartsinmotion you are pretty safe, they sell decent brands and have always been substantially cheaper than ECP's when the discounts are on. I got my clutch and DMF from them for £365 whereas ECP were £680 for the same make as an example.
My shims must have collapsed at some point, I only noticed they were missing as I noticed the clips inside the piston on the drivers side, so the main part must have snapped off at some point, the passenger side doesn't have one on at all.
I still think a grand is massively over the top for what he needs doing, if it includes all the advisories including 3 tyres, then not as bad, but still a lot more than he should be paying, obviously depending on the car.